norseman

Bigfoot winter time survival

128 posts in this topic

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It is nice to have the chance to chat again by the way.

 

 I admit, I am only working the western side of the Cascades. There is just not much information to paint a picture with as far as reports go in central WA, as it is only the touch of the brush when compared to the Cascades and Olympics.  The Blues are the only data point to the far east that are reviewed for patterns.

 

  There are an estimated 1,900 to 2,100  cougar in WA and people are out specifically tracking/hunting them.  Cougar tracks are not easy to find, I have found cougar prints three times and I am not the smooth trail type of hiker.  We will be lucky if we ever find out there is that many bigfoot alive across the United States and Canada.

 

 You are correct, those areas are not good for tracking as snow does not hold and it also happens to be where there is more food if you are an omnivore.   The ungulates and other wildlife like to drop into those areas as well.  If there is good powder people hit open high spaces to ski and board, out in the wet zones these conditions just don't typically happen so really people don't spend time in there.

 

 The two areas that fit my bill both produce snow track reports, these areas are also where I have been spending most of my time this year and in 2015. In short, I propose that Sasquatch in WA don't typically live high during the cold months but rather navigate deep and remote river valleys in a circuit. 

 

 In Michigan every living thing moves into the cedar/spruce swamp forest, these areas are warmer, sheltered and very difficult to effectively move in ( for a human ).   The only people going into these areas in the cold months are trappers and hound runners, guess who my winter reports came from.  :)

 

 I think there needs to be a new thread for this, I did not intend to hijack the thread. 

 

 

Nathan,

 

It's good to talk with you as well.

 

Cougar- I'm an ex houndsman, and I agree cougar tracks are not easy to come by. But we humans do find their tracks and tree cougar consistently every winter with the use of hounds. Just not in Washington where it has been outlawed. I cannot say that about Bigfoot tracks. They are much much harder to find. Only once in winter in my life time. Compared to a handful of cougar tracks each winter.

 

My point is thus. Sasquatch does not create enough tracks in snow regions to be actively foraging or hunting in winter months. They must be like a chipmunk and have food caches. Sparsely found trackways could be them moving from an exhausted one to a fresh one? Once there they hunker down and spend some time.

 

I have many many miles under my belt on horseback, snowmobile, four wheeler, pick up, Peterbilt and even dog team in winter. I have ONE track way in 47 years to show for it. I sure would like to know the answer to that.

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Where I live,   just South of Mt St Helens,   the snow level much of the winter is close to 2000 feet.   It goes up and down about 500 feet and much of that area is closed off for the winter.  Forest gates are locked and there is no access until late spring or sometimes into June and the forest service reluctantly opens things up for the summer.    That keeps the idiots from going out and getting stuck in the snow.  An elk hunter is missing Northeast of me right now.    They have found his vehicle in two feet of snow and no evidence he ever returned to it.       Locked gates,  also keeps most people out of the bush in the truly remote areas.        So I disagree that there are a lot of people in river valleys in Western WA,    even in the winter.   People who are not aviators probably do not know when the valleys get cold, foggy and  below freezing,  at 4000 to 5000 feet, the temperature can be up in the high 40s and sunny.   BF have to know and use this to their advantage.  That does not mean the snow goes away at that elevation, only that higher might be warmer as long as the surface inversion continues.   

 

  Lack of BF footprints in an area means lack of BF.   That is my criteria for an active area.     They might be there but not very often or very many.     If BF are there in any numbers,   they make mistakes and leave footprints.   I have more footprint finds than I have years in the field looking for them so they are not all that rare in some areas.    But when an area goes inactive for whatever reason, they abruptly stop or get very difficult to find.  That in my experience in this area,   sudden BF inactivity is directly related to human activity like logging.  

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SNPP_WA_DNB_OBS_0907-1048_10Oct2014.gif

I think you guys have a lot of people stacked between the cascades and Puget sound.

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What state and elevation was your track find ?

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Back in 1989 a friend and I where cross country skiing near Mt St Helens,  east side of Goat Mt. We came across what we decided had to be a Bigfoot track way. I have told the story here several times even showing the location with  google earth . It was one of the only incidents where my only conclusion was Bigfoot, and the only track way I have witnessed. 

 

Yep Norse there are a lot of people around the Puget Sound and I doubt not any Bigfoot very near.

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So that being the case they must stay somewhat in the mountains during winter?

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Hi Nathan, a lot of folks are hungry for information- myself included- and it's nice to think we have a guy "on the inside". I think the important thing for you is to not view the questions or interest as any kind of pressure placed upon you to produce answers. I'm saying that because I don't want you to feel that you have the be that guy and that's all I'm saying. I truly appreciate your insights and experience field-wise but I also don't want you to think of feel that you are under the microscope because you are not. It's great to converse with you and get your take on things but I look at it as information that you offer more than it being information you think is required of you. It's not. So, no pressure, my friend, and anything sensitive I would expect you to wisely keep to yourself for your own sake as well as others for the safety and security of your research regarding what you find. And it's all good :) 

 

@Norseman, that's a good question. It sounds like Sasquatch might be more apt to play the snow line as it drops and recedes. The winter thing has always been such an interesting topic for me personally so thanks for rekindling the chance to look further into it :)   

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Well I can tell you that the Olympics are quite frosty and white now, beautiful to see around daybreak alpenglow. About 300-400% normal snowpack.

 

That said, to stay on track,  there was some research showing BF preferred elevations of 1500-2500 ft. in winter (that seems to hold true in the carolinas/blue ridge/smokies too). 

 

BF trackways in the mountains of NC to me were rarer than hens teeth.....   had more sightings than prints. 

 

Now, if BF can drag a bull elk road kill across a Montana highway at -26 F  I would think they can go anywhere they D well please anytime of the year.but prolly prefer temps like we do.   

 

(that the famous Montana towtruck driver sighting.....verified by weather service temp data, on the BFRO website)

 

Ditto on the pressure comment from hiflier NathanFooter.  

 

Hope my soon to be trip to Montana isn't quite that cold. 

Edited by bipedalist
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One of the great mysteries to us knowers is why are there not more trackways.

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They’re generally not made in the places that people look. The reason for why and details on how are where it gets quite difficult.

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 I know I am not the guy with the answers, I am just doing my best to look at the information.   

 

 I am here to come up with a theory, to test it and put all the information out there so others can either replicate or disprove my results.

 

 Winter reports do happen at lower elevations on the cascade range but they are not common.     I believe this simply reflects that people are not out in the wet thick forest in the winter months.

 Gigantor may be able to shed a bit of information on this thread, he and a great group of people on here are doing an extensive data mapping project on reports in the hope of illustrating seasonal movement.

 

 Just for kicks, lets review a random sample of a county in WA on the fringes of the cascades.   I have looked at a few reports from this county but I have not sat down and intensely applied my theory on this area.

 Below is every cold weather report on public file in the BFRO database for Snohomish County, check out the elevation locations on google maps.   

 

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_report.asp?id=38224

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_report.asp?id=38224

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_report.asp?id=23170

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_report.asp?id=8597

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_report.asp?id=1674

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_report.asp?id=1671

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_report.asp?id=1880

 

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1 hour ago, NathanFooter said:

 Gigantor may be able to shed a bit of information on this thread, he and a great group of people on here are doing an extensive data mapping project on reports in the hope of illustrating seasonal movement.

This graph represents 533 BFRO Washington reports in the SSR database.

I sorted by month and then calculated average altitude for each month. December, January, February, & March account for the least amount of sightings.

I have no idea why the altitude dips so much in April. Mapping locations by month probably would help to explain that.

WA avg alt by month.jpg

 

WA report graphs.jpg

Edited by Redbone
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" So that being the case they must stay somewhat in the mountains during winter? "

Norseman

This would depend on what side of the mountain that they are on and not so much on the elevation.  I would believe that they stay in the lower elevation  on the leeward side of mountains  where it would be warm  and not harsh as far as winter goes.  This might account why lower sightings happen during winter time in high frequent areas. In the warmer climate they might move towards the windward side of mountains since this would be cooler for them. I have notice this in Michigan when hunting that on certain sides of hills It would be warmer and less swirling winds  on certain side of the hills. Not just that but I would also notice that deer and turkey would bed down during the night on certain nights during the winter time of these hills. Another thing that I would notice is that there would be areas that would be dry and warm where one could bed down and stay dry during the winter.  So if there are tracks where there are complete dryness then these can be places where these creatures can be capable of hiding their movement. Again just adding my opinion.

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 In April things are starting to grow, ungulates and other critters are hugging lower to get the buds and early greens.     

 

Redbone, can you get a whole 12 month graph data for elevation and time of year ?    I would love to see what you got.

Edited by NathanFooter
more info
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Well it looks for the average damp winter months in Washington it is closer to 1000 ft.average then, the majority of sightings occur 1500-2500 ft. then. 

 

It looks like they flirt with the new fallen snowline Oct.-Jan. interesting enough.

 

So my question is then how many and what is the data for elevations for sightings above 2500 ft.?    All I can think of is the Silver Star Mtn. sighting in terms of

high elevation sightings in Washington state.

 

Thanks for the graphic data crunching BTW redbone!

 

 

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