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Martin

24 Hrs At Bluff Creek

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SweatyYeti

Wheelug wrote:

You're a Male aged 26, you do not take your mothers car.

Good point, Wheelug... :)

Especially when you're 26....you own a Corvette....and you're looking at a long ride on the Highway....to make yourself a big chunk of money.

You don't take the 'old geezer' car.....you get in your 'Vette....and have yourself a blast, out on the open road! :asciidity:

Edited by SweatyYeti

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Guest LAL

Next question is why would his mother let him take her car to California in the first place when he had one of his own? He wasn't driving while suspended or anything, was he?

He'd have been less likely to get pulled over in a little old lady car than a sports car. Sports cars were fair game for the law back then. But why would she allow it?

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Wheellug

By taking his mothers car, is he letting his mother drive his? His dragster baby?

If this corvette was for dragster purposes, what did he use for an everyday car?

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Cotter

I thought these guys were hard up for cash, now there's a 'vette involved?

Could this pay credence to perhaps, there WAS some serious money behind the suit?

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PBeaton

Martin,

Regardin' kitakaze's post # 4, he believes Bob H. was there, the guy in the suit, however, I think it's all nonsense. kitakaze even says himself, Bob H. "is adamant that this was not the week leading up to the 20th, but rather the first or second week of Oct." You can ask kitakaze, or he could respond if he wants, but is it not true Bob H. also said he took the so called suit home with him in the trunk of his mothers car, so no-one would see it when Roger an Bob G. went into town to tell of what had happened. We know when Roger talked to the reporter, the 20th of Oct.

I've had the pleasure of chit-chatin' with Bob G. over the phone now an again, met Bob at John Green's some years back, Bob H. wasn't there, nor is there anythin' to his claim to be the man in the suit. kitakaze would have you believe otherwise, that it was all a hoax, Bob H. sayin' he was the man in the suit is a hoax, nothin' more in my opinion.

There's a reason it's called the P/G Film...not the P/G/H Film...the H. wasn't there.

:drinks:

Pat...

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Guest LAL

Cotter, Roger had some backing from his brother-in-law, Bob Gimlin was working in roofing and Bob Heironimus wasn't involved except in the filming of the documentary or movie Roger was making around Yakima. Bob Heironimus had a job and could presumably make payments on his own car.

So BH took the suit back in his mother's car so no one would see it and then showed it to people at the Idle Hour Tavern and left it in the trunk where it was found by his mother on the morning of Saturday, October 21st around 10:00 am. Good going, there, Bob.

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Guest
So on the Tuesday or Wednesday that Heironimus left, he borrow his mothers brand new 1967 Buick similar to what you see here,

He didn't take his own ride because it was a gas guzzling Corvette.

Bob Heironimus said to save gas money, gas was .33 cents a gallon, that buick got at best 12 mpg, how much would he saved? $10.00or $15.00 on the whole trip ? He is going to make a $1000.00 for being Patty. At 26, your taking the vette, and telling every girl you meet that your making $1000.00 to walk in the woods dressed as an ape. Scratching the mother's car ? at 26, blame someone else why it's scratched, your MOM will believe you, It's what they do. I think kitakaze's arguments only add to the fact that Bob Heironimus is full of Sh....

@ LAL

So BH took the suit back in his mother's car so no one would see it and then showed it to people at the Idle Hour Tavern and left it in the trunk where it was found by his mother on the morning of Saturday, October 21st around 10:00 am. Good going, there, Bob.

he is about as sharp as a 16 lb bowling ball :rolleyes:

Edited by zigoapex

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SweatyYeti

A 1962 C1 Corvette rolling out of the plant has a 327 V8 250 HP engine with about 10 mpg. Heironimus' was modified for drag racing. It had low rear-end gears and the gas consumption shot up the faster it went. This is without factoring in winding mountain roads and taking your drag racer for a trip across three states into the mountains.

We don't know if his mother's 1967 Buick was a Skylark, a Le Sabre, or whatever, but it was brand new, a sedan, not used for drag racing or modified and we can safely assume a much better car for such a long road trip than Bob's dragster.

You're 26 and you're going to the mountains of Bluff Creek three states away where you've never been before. Are you going to take your ride and risk it getting all scratched up?...

Or your mom's?...

Or your mom's...new Car?? Yeah...take's ma's new Buick....and get that all scratched up! :lol:

I mean....why take your own Corvette on a long trip on the highway.....when you're a young guy....(looking for adventure...and whatever comes your way...)........when, after paying to have it modified...it's gonna cost you a little extra, in gas??!

Gas was not too costly, back then...it was only about 30 cents/per gallon. At 10 mi/gallon....$1.00 would get you about 33 miles.

A 600-mile trip...(one way)....would cost a Grand Total of......$18 in gasoline.

Now, ma's Buick also costs money to drive.....so, what is the difference in the cost of gas, between the two cars??

A 1967 Buick Skylark was rated at a 'combined' gas mileage of about 14 mpg. With that mileage...the cost for gas... one-way....would be about 13 bucks.

So, Bob would have saved himself approximately 5 bucks, one-way........$10...round-trip.

kitakaze wrote:

Heironimus' (Corvette) was modified for drag racing. It had low rear-end gears....

Bob has enough money to have his Corvette modified for drag racing.....and....for this trip, he figured he could save himself 10 bucks.......so, he decides to take the Geezer-mobile...instead of his Vette... :lol:

Gee, he could have saved more than $10, by not staying overnight in a hotel....on his way back home....(in his mom's Buick).

Edited by SweatyYeti

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Crowlogic

Bob's Corvette wouldn't have been a good highway car if it was equipped with a drag ratio rear like a 411 or 511. American V8's with 511 rears would be turning 3800-4000 RPMs at highway speeds and at high speed cruising 70-90MPH would begin to overheat. Bob's Vette would have redlined around 5000 RPMs. Bob H had good reason not to take the Vette. However I can't imagine his Mom driving the Vette as it wasn't something moature women with children were predisposed to doing.

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Guest LAL

Far be it from me to suggest he went on a bender ending up back at the Idle Hour with the suit he'd been using around Yakima and when asked about the scratch next morning explained he'd been to California and played the part of a bigfoot. Everyone would believe that, especially mom. :rofl:

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Guest

I agree Crow, only when I was a young man I had a 1970 Nova SS with the 402 big block, 411 gears and all that, and although I would be a little slower on the long straight roads, I would have loved to take that thing into the mountains, not because it handled worth a crap(not like that sweet vette would have), but just because it would feel great on those roads,and be a crazy fun drive.

Not only would I not take my mom's car,but mom would not have gotten behind the wheel of that old Nova,not a chance.

Edited by JohnC

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SweatyYeti

But....regardless...Bob didn't take any car down there...

Patty....loves....Bobby... :mellow::wub: ...

PattyLoveBobbyAG1.gif

  • Upvote 1

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Guest Kerchak

is it not true Bob H. also said he took the so called suit home with him in the trunk of his mothers car, so no-one would see it when Roger an Bob G. went into town to tell of what had happened. We know when Roger talked to the reporter, the 20th of Oct.

Yes it is true. Not only that, he also said it was announced before the footage was developed.

XZone radio interview, August 6, 2007.

Bob Heironimus-"The reason I brought the suit home in the trunk of the car is because, after they went back and made the tracks,they headed for town to announce that they had filmed the Bigfoot…. They didn’t want anybody seeing that—maybe taking a chance on having somebody see it. So I brought it home in the trunk of the car."

Interviewer Rob McConnell—"So you mean they announced that they had filmed Bigfoot before the film was developed?"

Bob Heironimus—"Uh, yes."

Rob McConnell—"Huh! Interesting. And did it catch on right away? Did the press gobble the entire story?"

Bob Heironimus—"Oh yeah, yeah. They ate that right up."

So BH took the suit back in his mother's car so no one would see it and then showed it to people at the Idle Hour Tavern and left it in the trunk where it was found by his mother on the morning of Saturday, October 21st around 10:00 am. Good going, there, Bob.

Yes that just boggles the minds LAL.

Anyway, going by the hoax scenario why would Roger have let Bob H take the suit home? Roger brought it down there in his truck didn't he (sarcasm)? Wouldn't it have been better to wrap it back up again with all the camping and horse gear stuffed in the back of his truck rather than give it to Bob H to just put (unwrapped) in the trunk of his mum's shiny brand new car, where anyone could see it if the trunk is opened?

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kitakaze

Bob's Corvette wouldn't have been a good highway car if it was equipped with a drag ratio rear like a 411 or 511. American V8's with 511 rears would be turning 3800-4000 RPMs at highway speeds and at high speed cruising 70-90MPH would begin to overheat. Bob's Vette would have redlined around 5000 RPMs. Bob H had good reason not to take the Vette. However I can't imagine his Mom driving the Vette as it wasn't something moature women with children were predisposed to doing.

Thank you for posting about it from the perspective of being knowledgable about cars. Taking a drag-modified C1 Corvette three states up onto mountain gravel roads is just a terrible idea, especially if this is your baby. I equate it personally to someone asking me to take my mint Roland TR-909 drum machine and Juno-106 synthsizer up into the mountains for a show in the bush. I'm young, these things are my babies, I don't care in the slightest about flashing that gear, and there is no way I am going to expose them to the elements and circumstances of that trip. If my mom had a nice new sturdy MPC-1000 sampler, I would take that instead.

You can't imagine Opal driving the 'Vette? He was gone three days. It's nothing. But let's do something just nuts. Let's listen to what Opal herself has to say about it...

Greg Long: "Let's talk about this experience of yours, which involves your car."

Opal Heironimus: "Well, one day Bob said, 'Mom, I want to borrow you car for a while, maybe for a few days.' So I let him have it."

GL: "Did he tell you why he wanted to borrow it?"

OH: "I didn't know more where he went than nothin' in the world. He just said he wanted to borrow it and he'd be back in a few days."

MoB. p. 363

Opal then goes on to detail finding the suit in the trunk upon the cars return when she was going to buy apples. The suit frightened her at first thinking it was an animal. Opal then showed the suit to her sister-in-law Willa Smith and Bob's nephew John Miller who both handled the head of the suit. John Miller reported that the mask stunk just as Bob Heironimus did.

Bob Heironimus reported the car being scratched when hiding it a half mile from the campsite with Roger Patterson by hiding it in buckbrush. Opal Heironimus reported to Greg Long that she later noticed the scratch on the car when she was with her sister Myrtle. By Opal's account she simply lent her son the car and wasn't particularly concerned what he was doing with it. Bob was 26 at the time.

So this woman gives us eyewitness testimony not only for lending the car, the length of time it was gone, but also it coming back with a suit in the trunk, which was witnessed by multiple people. Is she a nefarious colluder, or can we in Bigfootery try actually considering that she is not some person lying for her son?...

Bigopal.jpg

There is a very good reason to do so. There is corroborating testimony not only from friends and family of Heironimus, but also from a man who was no personal friend of Heironimus, Les Johnson...

Les Johnson (MoB, p. 47-48)...

"I was in the Idle Hour Tavern in Wiley City. There were 15 or 20 guys, some of the guys that hung around with Roger. These guys were drinkin' and talkin' about things they had been doin'. Bob Heironimus said that in the back of his Buick - he had a blue Buick - was an ape suit, or a suit. They were talking about this suit. Someone says, 'What are you talkin' about?' And someone said, 'Go look in the back of Bob's Buick.' The guys were teasing each other about it. There were lots of guys who sat around and talked about it" I probed deeper his memories of this event. He recalled among the onlookers grouped around Heironimus' car were the Ridge Runners, members of a jeep club. Johnson was either walking toward to the tavern or leaving it. "I heard them talkin' when I went by. They were laughin' and gigglin'. They were makin' fun about this suit, like, 'We're going to fool everybody.' I mean I got that opinion. But you couldn't fool us. We all lived here." He chuckled and then added: "The 'monkey suit' is what they called it. There's four Heironimus boys. Bob. And Bill. Bill worked for me for a while. Then there's Howard and Mike. The Idle Hour Tavern's where we'd go to congregate, lie to each other, and tell these big stories and try to make out like we was somethin'."

Bolded in that excerpt of the Johnson interview are some extremely important details when compared with other witness testimony. It's important to note that when allowed to be seen in the original context, we can see that Johnson is expressing derision for the notion that the community of Yakima could be fooled by a Bigfoot hoax. Here are some major details that help confirm that the Idle Hour incident was in fact an actual event...

- Les Johnson was not a personal friend of Bob Heironimus', yet he talks about something that allows us to pinpoint the event - he mentions the Buick, the blue Buick. Only once has Heironimus had a suit in the back of a blue Buick and that is the suit found by Bob's mother in the back of her blue Buick then handled by her and two other family members.

A blue '67 Buick...

114370121_836062bbfa.jpg?v=0

- Les Johnson mentions the presence of the Ridge Runners jeep club. Massively important in corroborating this testimony is that in a separate interview with former Ridge Runner jeep club member and owner of the Circle Inn Tavern Merle Warehime says that he was present when the suit was shown in the back of a car in a box when they were about to go jeeping (MoB, p. 331).

Opal Heironimus testifies to lending the car for three days. Multiple people testifiy to Heironimus returning around 9pm at night with the Blue Buick and showing the suit from the back of the trunk in the parking lot. There are three witnesses outside of the four there that saw the suit at Heironimus' home before Patterson came to retrieve it.

On top of that, Les Johnson witnessed Bob Heironimus in a blue Buick showing the suit and discussing it with friends. He felt nothing but derision and scorn for the notion expressed by these young men that people in Yakima would be fooled by a Bigfoot hoax.

There are far to many witnesses to sit there and try and dismiss Bob taking his mother's Buick instead of his own dragster Corvette to Bluff Creek based on how older people think younger people think. Older people often simply have no idea how younger people think because they generalize or look only from the point of how they would have thought when they were once young.

Bob Heironimus borrowed his mother's car in October 1967 for a three day roadtrip. He returned with a scratch on the car and a suit in the trunk, both of which have corroborating witnesses. Kneejerk dismissals of Heironimus' testimony as being that of a liar are nothing more than intransigence and close-mindedness, particularly in light of how deeply connected Heironimus is to Patterson and Gimlin. Bigfootery owes it to itself to give an actual sincere consideration to the prospect that Bob Heironimus may indeed not be lying about going to Bluff Creek with Patterson and Gimlin to film a hoax Bigfoot film.

The only man on Earth ever to publicly claim to being Patty is not some random nobody with no support and no connection to the film source...

f4175dc4.jpg

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roguefooter

Les Johnson said a couple of really interesting things in the interview with Long:

Long: "Do you remember any discussions about Bigfoot, or Bigfoot pranks?"

Les: "All the time."

Long: "At the Tavern?"

Les: Everywhere."

Interesting that the Tavern buddies would sit around and discuss Bigfoot pranks all the time. When Johnson overheard them all talking "We're going to fool everybody" while discussing the suit in the car - what were they talking about if they had no knowledge of Bluff Creek?

These guys even gave the suit a name- the "monkey suit".

Then Johnson says: "He apparently carried this thing around in his car for a long time."

What Les Johnson describes sounds nothing like any suit 'used one-time at Bluff Creek' that disappears the next day. No, it sounds more like these guys were talking about a suit that Bob kept in his car and they were all familiar with, which was used for local pranks.

Edited by roguefooter

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