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Guest Kerchak

When Skeptics Talk About The Costume Bob Heironimus Allegedly Wore.

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Guest BF believer

Ray G, if my comment seemed to be insulting in any way, then I apologise. I didn't mean it to come across in that context, I promise. In future I should be more explanitory with my wording.

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Guest MikeG

A gentle reminder, folks, to please stay on topic, and to try to keep the tone up. This thread is about Bob Heironimus' (alleged) suit. Let's try to stick fairly closely to that.

Cheers

Mike

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Guest

O.K. Mr. Kerchak, I'm not one of the big name skeptics that post here, the ones you are wanting to confront. But heck, I'll give it a shot anyway.

I say ........ number 1.!

Do I win something?

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Guest

I'm a skeptic. It's been forty years and neither side has been able to secure a definitive answer. I personally lean towards a hoax, but it's not a closed case IMO.

I think most people have put this film in the "maybe" category and are waiting for some new evidence. If BF does exist, there should be new evidence put forth at some point. Every day that passes without promising evidence, reduces the PGF plausibility.

And the clock is ticking, many fence sitters like myself are leaning towards the hoax side of the fence. I've been at it for ten years and nothing. It strongly suggests it's a hoax and BF does not exist.

Just because the clock keeps ticking and no BF has been shown definitively does not make the

case the pgf therefore is fake. Patty very well could have been one of the last of her kind. Their

numbers could be so small that eluding us could be very easy. And if they slipped into extinction

no one would ever know.

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xspider1

Good topic, Kerchak. As far as I can tell, there is no unified hoax theory on any of it. The list of various and suggested suit parts is hilarious. I just don't see any combination of what BH says .vs. the reality of costumes making any sense. And, the other (random) hoax speculations don't make sense either. : )

Edited by xspider1
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kitakaze

Which suit description do I accept, Heironimus' or Morris'? That's easy. Morris didn't wear a suit for Patterson, he sold him one. Selling Patterson a suit does not enforce that Patterson must have used that suit he bought and the PGF shows that. Patterson and DeAtley would not have been forced to use the suit Morris sold Patterson. It could be that parts of it were used, or that it was heavily modified.

I accept Heironimus' description of the suit he wore. He has supporting witnesses who also handled that suit and confirm parts of his description of it. I have no reason not to accept Heironimus' description. Heironimus is also perfectly allowed to change who he thinks who made it, depending on what others suggest to him was the case. He can be influenced by others just as much as Gimlin can. Ask Gimlin how tall Patty is. He'll drop Munns' 7'4". Somebody hasn't given him the memo. That's OK.

I don't think this thread is about any genuine inquiry or sincere discussion with skeptics who support Heironimus. If you have any questions about why I accept Heironimus' description of the suit he wore over the description of the suit Morris sold Patterson, please feel free to ask. One does not equate the other, though you are free to rationalize a contrary argument.

Good topic, Kerchak. As far as I can tell, there is no unified hoax theory on any of it. The list of suggested suit parts is hilarious by any definition. I just don't see the combination of what BH says .vs. the reality of costumes making any sense. The other random and various hoax speculations don't make sense either. : )

Please provide a list of suit features Bob Heironimus describes and when doing so, please do not twist him comparing a suit feature to an object he in his experience is familiar with, to him saying that object was used in the suit. Also, please don't include anything not described by the only human ever to make a public claim of wearing the suit.

You can do that without problem because it's the fair thing to do. You wouldn't want to do something disgenuine like force things upon Heironimus he never said.

Edited by MikeG
Removal of off-topic material

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Guest Kerchak

Please show me where BobH claimed those things, and I will answer your question.

Really? Wow. C'mon you knew there was a huge thread on this topic so your attempt to make me do the work all over again is mere side stepping game play.

All the good stuff can be found here.

http://bigfootforums...bob-heironimus/

http://www.scribd.co...s-vs-Herroneous

http://www.pdf-archi...ws-w-o-comment/

O.K. Mr. Kerchak, I'm not one of the big name skeptics that post here, the ones you are wanting to confront. But heck, I'll give it a shot anyway.

I say ........ number 1.!

Do I win something?

Thanks.

I will make a mental note that you are rejecting the Phil Morris suit and are instead going for the skinned red horse version with waist high waders, a t-shirt like torso and old house type slippers inbuilt, with eyes/face about a couple inches from the mask and being easy to walk in.

Now how about Opal? Did Opal converse with Bob H about this suit number 1 and watch it together with Bob in the PGF and ask him if that was the suit in her car or did the question of the 'suit' number 1 never ever come up between them and remain unmentioned? Which version you going for? They can't both be true.

What about P and G's 'suit retrieval'? Did Bob H just notice that it was gone from the car trunk one morning without seeing P and G come and take it or was the last he saw of it when P and G came and took it from the back of the trunk and Bob H saw that they were "picking their belts" on a job well done? Which version there? They can't both be true.

What about the filming time? Which version are you going for here? The version that it was filmed in early October 'weeks' before the film was announced or the version that it was filmed on October 20th, the same day that Patterson went into town to announce it before it was developed? Which version there? Both can't be true.

Good topic, Kerchak. As far as I can tell, there is no unified hoax theory on any of it. The list of various and suggested suit parts is hilarious. I just don't see any combination of what BH says .vs. the reality of costumes making any sense. And, the other (random) hoax speculations don't make sense either. : )

Yeah I think it's a good topic xspider.

Bob H's story(ies) would be at least a little bit more credible if he didn't keep changing them, self contradicting what he claimed earlier and shooting himself in the foot over and over again.

If I was a Bob H proponent I honestly wouldn't know where to even begin with his sorry mess of a claim(s).

Edited by Kerchak
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Guest Kerchak

One thing I must clarify here. I see Bob H's biggest supporter is already pushing misinformation and twisting of the facts.

I am not talking about Phil Morris's description of 'the suit'. I am talking about BOB HEIRONIMUS'S own words regarding the Phil Morris suit.

I am talking about what BOB HEIRONIMUS HIMSELF changed and actually said regarding the description of the suit.

This thread is NOT about Bob Heironimus version vs Phil Morris version. This thread is about Bob Heironimus version vs Bob Heironimus version.

His radio interviews post the Greg Long book give HIS OWN descriptions of the suit and they make a radical difference to what he told Greg Long earlier.

Some examples.

XZone radio interview, December 7, 2006

""Those were irrigation boots, you know, kind of like irrigators wear, up to about the knees. That’s why the calves stick out pretty good there.â€

Earlier Bob H told Greg Long he was wearing waist high waders.

(The Making of Bigfoot p. 344).

""“I … slipped my legs into the legs of the suit, which felt like they were hip boots or wading boots … that go up to your waist.â€

Jeff Rense radio-show interview, March 1, 2004:

""“There were no slippers.â€""

Earlier Bob Hob H said there were house slippers.

The Making of Bigfoot p. 344

“.....the feet were made of old house slippers you used to see around that looked like a big foot with toes on them"

Xzone radio interview, August 23, 2007

Caller- "Mr Heironimus, were you barefoot or wearing shoes inside the costume?"

Heironimus - "I had shoes on".

But earlier on Countdown, an MSNBC TV show, March 22, 2004, Bob H claimed:

""“I was walking in my stocking feet inside my costume.â€""

XZone radio interview, August 6, 2007.

Caller Sean Forker—“So he’s saying he wore the Philip Morris suit.â€

Heironimus- “Yes, I did. ………. It had a zipper going up and down the back.â€

Yet earlier Bob H was not describing a 'Morris' suit to Greg Long. Heironimus told Greg Long it was a smelly dead red horse skin suit in three sections, leg, torso and head. Yet a Morris suit is fake fur romper suit type all in one affair that you step into via the zipper at the back and does not have torso that you pull over your head like a t-shirt.

So, once more, this thread is NOT about Phil Morris's comments. It's about BOB HEIRONIMUS'S comments..........which totally go against what he claimed earlier.

Edited by Kerchak
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Guest BF believer

Great post Kerchak. I mean, you would expect to forget small details all these years later but to keep coming out with these small, intricate details and then totally contradict yourself is almost laughable. Bob H's credibility is beyond useless, IMO. It simply collapses with the small amount you have written right there. Forgetting small details like who filmed something for a few seconds is one thing but to make a detailed claim about a suit and to then completely change something is quite telling....IMO of course :)

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Guest MikeG

Five posts after I asked nicely for this thread to stay on topic I have had to delete an entire post for not being on topic. Come on guys!!

This thread is about the (alleged) suit. Stick to that.

Mike

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Drew

Yet earlier Bob H was not describing a 'Morris' suit to Greg Long. Heironimus told Greg Long it was a smelly dead red horse skin suit in three sections, leg, torso and head. Yet a Morris suit is fake fur romper suit type all in one affair that you step into via the zipper at the back and does not have torso that you pull over your head like a t-shirt.

So, once more, this thread is NOT about Phil Morris's comments. It's about BOB HEIRONIMUS'S comments..........which totally go against what he claimed earlier.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I haven't read Making of Bigfoot in a few months, but wasn't Bob saying something like "My brother saw the suit, and said it was made of Red horse hide or something"

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Guest LAL

Bob said something like that but he also said the guy from Planet of the Apes made the suit.

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roguefooter

Correct me if I'm wrong, I haven't read Making of Bigfoot in a few months, but wasn't Bob saying something like "My brother saw the suit, and said it was made of Red horse hide or something"

Bob initially said that Roger told his brother Howard it was made from a horse. Later on the same page(345) Bob states it himself:

"It stunk. Roger skinned out a dead, red horse."

However, Howard Heironimus had no idea what Bob was talking about-

http://bigfootforums...847#entry122847

Edited by roguefooter

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xspider1

BH throws a lot of stuff at the wall but, none of it sticks. I would think that if there was a Bigfoot mime in the PGf, that person would have come forward with a credible story a long time ago, if for no other reason than to cash in on being Bigfoot.

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