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Peggy Marx = Bob Gimlin


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kitakaze

I'm creating a separate discussion from what was discussed in the thread on the most skeptical questions a member has ever asked Bob Gimlin to discuss the similarities between Peggy marx and Bob Gimlin...

Peggy Marx just looks and sounds credible. This grey-haired woman on the left is a sweet old grandmother who will look you in the eye and tell you in detail about the day she was there when her husband filmed Bigfoot...

bigfoot-research051605.jpg

She's a female Gimlin. She swears it's the truth and she will defend her deceased husband against accusations of hoaxing with her every breath. Is that sweet, matronly woman who has worked tirelessly for the protection of animals a Bigfoot hoaxer filling our ears with deception?

Very sweet, sincere, elderly people can look right in your eyes and tell you all sorts of things that never occurred. They can indeed outright deceive you. Acknowledging that Peggy Marx was involved in a hoax while continuing to deny it and defend her deceased husband is not character assassination in my opinion. Or do you think the jury is still out on this one?

marxbigfoot.jpg

There is a strong and vocal sub-group of people that support Marx's claim. Her grandchildren are in fact Bigfoot researchers and if anyone brings up Peter Byrne and saying the film is a hoax, they will get very irrate with you. Don't think the film is a proven hoax and Peggy is pulling the wool over people? Excellent. Here's Peter...

Byrne+Peter.jpg

And here he breaks down the hoax by Ivan and Peggy...

http://www.bigfootencounters.com/hoaxes/marx_footage.htm

My personal opinion is that we need to come to a place in Bigfootery where we do not react to acknowledging hoaxes as if it is character assassination. That image above is not Bigfoot. It's a human in a suit and it's a hoax. Byrne busted Marx, but Marx swore it was real and went to his deathbed never confessing. Peggy Marx continues to defend the claim to this day. She's not a bad person because they pulled off a Bigfoot hoax. Indeed, she has an excellent reputation as an animal conservationalist.

The relevance is simple. Peggy Marx is essentially a female Gimlin of sorts. She's a sweet. elderly woman that has done much in the name of Bigfoot and has people that regard her to be beyond doubt or reproach. She will look you in the eye and tell you convincingly6 about the day she and her husband filmed a Bigfoot doing a bluff charge at them. If you want to see her do it on camera, by all mean, please watch this documentary...

http://www.amazon.com/Bigfoot-Beast-Run-Jeff-Meldrum/dp/B002U1YJQI

This is from the commentary...

There's also an interview with Peggy Marx, who has been accused of wearing a Bigfoot costume for her filmmaker husband, Ivan. She's a sweet old lady with a huge love for animals. It is really hard to believe she would do something like that, but then when I look at some of the Marx pictures of Sasquatches with what looks to me like bear ears, I pause and wonder how that could have happened.

Now with that in mind, do you truly see no relevance between the cases of Peggy Marx and Bob Gimlin?

TLOB-yukonfrieda.jpglikamed_186519084.jpgbobGimlin2.jpg

Two sincere, elderly now, convincing people regarded by their perspective believers and supporters to be believable and upstanding individuals worthy of respect and admiration. Both claim to be present during the filming of Bigfoot. Both were cooperative partners to the person who took the footage and is now deceased. Both are considered by a majority of people to be involved in a hoax.

This is keenly relevant when discussing perceptions of what one considers believable testimony from another person.

I haven't asked BG anything as I have never had the pleasure to meet him in person. Doing so is on my bucket list though.

If I could ask him a question I guess I would ask him what he thinks of his friend, Roger Patterson's reputation being drug through the mud posthumously, as well as his today, and why, if the PGF was all an hoax, RP didn't refute it on his deathbed and come clean? Or, if it was all an hoax why he doesn't do so while he still has time to right the record?

The exact same could be asked of Peggy Marx...

Peggy, what do you think about your husband's name being drug through the mud posthumously? If it was a hoax, why didn't Marx come clean on his deathbed? Why doesn't Peggy come clean now while she still has the chance?

You can see her answer exactly these questions in the documentary I provided a link to above. I would much sooner over pull over and give Peggy Marx a lift than I would Bob Gimlin. But wow, would I ever immediately offer a ride to Gimlin. I can not speak to what Gimlin's willingness to remain in the vehicle would be once I said who I was, though.

Just as a sidenote, here is the trailer for the Bigfoot documentary I recommended above, Bigfoot: A Beast on the Run. It really is an excellent film...

The interview with Peggy Marx alone is worth it.

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Guest OntarioSquatch

You have a good point Kitakaze. Someone who sounds convincing could still be lying. Todd Standing is one guy that comes to mind :lol:

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Wheellug

Hmmm.. borderline, in that I don't see this should be tied to the P&G thread line. This is a topic unto itself.

If the intent is to defame, bash one's character with someone else's experience .. you win.

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SweatyYeti

kitakaze wrote:

Acknowledging that Peggy Marx was involved in a hoax while continuing to deny it and defend her deceased husband is not character assassination in my opinion.

Or do you think the jury is still out on this one?

Marx11.jpg

According to you....it is...

kitakaze wrote:

Bigfooters have no more proof of the nature of the Marx film then they do for the PGF.

They can pronounce it a hoax, but they don't know that to be a fact.

No confession, no suit, Marx went to his grave swearing it was true, and Peggy Marx still insists it was.

Acknowledging that Peggy Marx was involved in a hoax...

They can pronounce it a hoax, but they don't know that to be a fact.

Which is it, kit??? Make up your mind.

Edited by SweatyYeti
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PBeaton

kitakaze,

Very sweet, cincere, elderly people are not the only ones who can look ya in the eye an tell ya all sorts of things that haven't occurred.

Pat...

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kitakaze

The intent, Wheellug, is simple, and one the first person replying immediately grasped. Peggy Marx and Bob Gimlin's situation and circumstances are extremely similar. Who is getting bashed here?

Is Peggy Marx getting bashed? Most keenly, if Peggy Marx is not getting bashed as I said in the OP (acknowledging a hoax is not character assassination and we need to come to a place in Bigfootery where we are not hyperallergic/hypersensitive to dealing with such realities in a forthright manner...

...then why is Peggy Marx not being bashed?

I have no intent to bash either Gimlin or Marx, only compare the similarities they share. I hope we can do so without unnecessary appeals to emotion.

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Wheellug

More of the character association then perhaps? All the onions must be bad because one is rotten? Appealing to emotions is the intent of your post isn't it?

If we want to discuss the Marx film and related material, should that not be a topic unto itself?

Or is your suggestion that is directly tied to the P&G film, by association? Topic?

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kitakaze

kitakaze,

Very sweet, cincere, elderly people are not the only ones who can look ya in the eye an tell ya all sorts of things that haven't occurred.

Pat...

Excellent. As OntarioSquatch pointed out with the case of Todd Standing (beside Cliff Barackman on the left here)...

Todd+Standing+and+Cliff+Barackman.jpg

Barackman on Standing...

Todd is a very polite and well-spoken man. I genuinely liked the guy, as well as his message regarding sasquatches: protect them, and let them be. He has taken great strides to increase the public's awareness of bigfoots through his actions. While these actions are labeled as self-serving by his critics, the fact that attention was brought to sasquatches is undeniable.

http://bigfootevidence.blogspot.ca/2012/01/cliff-barackman-writes-about-todd.html

The man is a Bigfoot hoaxer (Standing, not Barackman). But this thread is not about Standing. Neither was Roger sweet and elderly and he most certainly told numerous things that weren't true. What is in focus here is how similar Peggy and Bob are in their situations.

Most importantly, do you see acknowledging Peggy Marx as a Bigfoot hoaxer to be character assassination? If not, do you accept the Marx film in the OP as a hoax and if so why?

More of the character association then perhaps? All the onions must be bad because one is rotten? Appealing to emotions is the intent of your post isn't it?

If we want to discuss the Marx film and related material, should that not be a topic unto itself?

Or is your suggestion that is directly tied to the P&G film, by association? Topic?

Is Peggy Marx a bad onion, Wheel? IOW, is she a Bigfoot hoaxer and if so, how do you know?

Peggy Marx is directly relevant to the PGF in the manner both she and Bob Gimlin are treated, their extremely similar circumstances already outlined in the OP, and the manner in which they defend their claim. If you think this belongs in General Discussion or some other section, by all means feel free to make such a request.

I'm discussing a PGF related issue and specifically Bob Gimlin, so I think it appropriate to have it here. If you don't agree, let's not waste tme debating about it and you just suggest to a mod where you think it should go.

Which is it, kit??? Make up your mind.

This, again, is an example of a false dichotomy. There is no ambiguity about my position regarding Marx's film. It's a hoax. Peter Byrne did the necessary work to establish that, as far as I am concerned. Yet concerning the PGF and it's proponents, they don't know for a fact that Ivan Marx's film is a hoax by the very same criteria they set out for the PGF. Where's the suit? Where's the confession? And there is the surviving person claiming to have been there that day that insists it was no hoax and she saw the creature with her own two eyes. Does the PGF look more like a realistic Bigfoot? That's purely subjective. And please, not graphic spamming. You don't know what a realistic Bigfoot looks like any more than Peggy Marx does. In fact, at least she can claim to have seen one, and do so in a manner that people find convincing.

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I was hit by a car once driven by a 25-year-old guy. Turned out he gave someone else's name to the policeman. Using your logic, all 25 year old males driving cars will lie about their identity to the police. Your argument is based on an assumption that more than likely will turn out to be extremely inaccurate.

Tim B.

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kitakaze

What's my assumption? Is my assumption that Peggy Marx was a hoaxer and still lies about it to this day or do you accept that as well.

I'd really like to know what you think about that.

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xspider1

Peggy Marx and Bob Gimlin's situation and circumstances are extremely similar.

In regard to the two actual subjects being considered, their situations seem to be extremely dissimilar:

post-131-0-69506800-1335297165_thumb.jpg

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kitakaze

Wow, those when put like that look actually rather similar. I think you could show those to people who have no familiarity with either the PGF or Marx film, and they could easily think they are looking at the same subject from different angles.

Tell you what, XS, I will show your side-by-side to ten people and not say whether the subjects are the same or different. You can do the same. You need only ask those people if the subjects appear similar. Not Patty believers, please, and I'll do no Patty skeptics. We then report the results back here. I will provide precise quotes for the people looking at the side-by-side.

If you have people thinking they look similar, do you accept that they do appear to be similar, or do you believe yourself gifted with a superior sense of perception to the people looking at your side-by-side?

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PBeaton

kitakaze,

"What is in focus here is how similar Peggy and Bob are in thier situations." In your opinion, an it seems to be in the minority here.

I wasn't talkin' bout Standing. I've never payed much attention to the Marx's, simply because I have no interest in them or thier claims. Nor do I feel the need to say anythin' negative about them or thier claims at the moment.

I'm with xspider1... :drinks:

Pat...

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kitakaze

Pat, where in this thread has someone yet described how they feel Peggy Marx and Gimlin's situations are not similar?

Also, this is not Oprah or The View. You can acknowledge whether you accept something as a hoax or not and not concern yourself with touchy-feely "negative" comments. Peter Byrne outted Ivan and Peggy Marx as hoaxers. Or did he not?

Edited by kitakaze
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