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Bill

Identifying Things From Rp's Footage

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Bill

Beach Identification

Using the rocks on the shoreline that the tide passes, I found 4 points in both photos that i'd confidently say were a positive ID of the beach.

The camera position is clearly different, so the perspective is skewed a bit, but the landmarks seem the same and such rocks aren't likely to vary much in 40 years or so.

beachID.jpg

I guess we can chalk this one up as reliably identified.

Bill

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Guest

Well, just guessing but all the commercial trees appear to be Doug Fir. Even the culls on the ground look like DF based on the fact that there are still some chunks of bark on them. Redwood bark peels off in long strips and rarely leaves "chunks" of bark. Also, with the exception of the upper left pic none of the pics appear to have any stump sprouts which will happen quite quickly after a Redwood has been cut so again I'm thinking DF. Even the upper left pic doesn't look like sprouts, just some underbrush or trees starting to grow. And it's foggy which generally means coastal although that could be low clouds from a storm in a more inland setting. While there are plenty of DF stands in the CA fog belt there are no natural coastal Redwood stands inland from the fog belt. Coastal Redwoods need fog.

So I'm gonna take a stab in the dark here. This tree footage occured before the Caruthers Cove footage? That would suggest RP shot coastal Oregon DF on his way down to CA. Anybody that's still breathing would be awestruck be the size of the coastal Redwoods and probably wouldn't waste their time filming CA DF.

How'd I do? :P

wow, im in awe of your knowledge norcal B)

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Bill

norcal:

"So I'm gonna take a stab in the dark here. This tree footage occured before the Caruthers Cove footage? That would suggest RP shot coastal Oregon DF on his way down to CA. Anybody that's still breathing would be awestruck be the size of the coastal Redwoods and probably wouldn't waste their time filming CA DF."

The logging stuff is reel #4 all by itself. The redwood with the VW Van is reel #3

But both are the same unidentified camera, not a K-100. Does suggest a close time period for filming those two reels. But so far no indication if reel #3 was filmed before or after reel #4.

The Caruther's Cove footage, however, is K-100 filmed footage, which potentially disconnects it from the logging and redwood footage, unless Roger had two camera on one trip and used them interchangably. So that's still unresolved. The rest of the reel where the beach scene is, that's just forest scenery too, a wood planter, and an orchard dirt road, but no logging.

Bill

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Guest

Bill,

this looks like it would have been a great documentary if all this PGF stuff didnt get in the way, lol :lol:

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Guest

Bill, Any pics of logging equipment? There's usually a lot that can be learned from machine pics. :P

Oh, and thanks Mark!

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parnassus

Bill: I assume you've shown these to Bob Gimlin and Pat Patterson and Al Hodgson? If the man is a logger, the only name that comes to mind is Pat Graves, who was a timber cruiser and was at Laird Meadows in 1964. Patterson might have looked him up in 1967. Or possibly Bud Ryerson? No idea what those men looked like. Fred Beck was interviewed by Patterson in 1966. He could have stopped in to see him later, of course.

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Bill

norcal:

No, nothing showing equipment.

Paranassus:

When I scanned the footage, it was at Chris Murphy's request, because he wanted the Fred Beck images. I didn't pay any attention to this material immediately after that because I was overloaded with the analysis of the PGF scans, image stabilization etc. . So I haven't had a chance to get back up to yakima and talk with either Patricia or Bob about this yet. Never met Hodgsons so obviously haven't asked him about this material.

I do have a list of material to talk to both Patricia and Bob about, on my next trip up there, and this material is included on that list, just that trip isn't scheduled yet. Hopefully, soon.

Bill

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parnassus

Bill, is the frame with the van and the redwood and Roger's back on the same roll as the Carruthers Cove?

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Bill

Paranassus:

No. The beach is reel #2, with some non-descript woods and an orchard road. K-100 camera.

The big redwood is reel #3, with Roger and the store, and Fred Beck, then the VW Van stuff. Unidentified camera.

The website PDF in the opening post lists content of each reel in greater detail.

Bill

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Crowlogic

Bill for some reason the man in the photo with the bus at he base of the Redwood reminds me Bob Gimlin.

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Bill

Crow:

I personally can't make any positive ID on the man. If there's a way to do so, I'm open to hearing it.

Bill

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Guest

I said this on the old BFF, and could be wrong, but I really think that's a Columbian Black Tail, not a muley. I know I'm going against the grain here, but that's my thought. I think May would be a good "guesstimate".

Also, I don't think it would be odd at all to have snow like that in May in Northern California. It wouldn't be right on the coast, but the area up Hwy 96 could certainly have a considerable amount of snow in May. If you come in a little bit from the coast you'll find the cold/wet is dumping a ton of snow just inland from the California/Oregon coast. I camp in/near the Red Buttes in Oregon (on the California/Oregon border) not far from Happy Camp and this year it was in June or July that I went and I was the first person through some of the snow drifts.

I don't know if this will help in giving any idea of the amount of snow someone *might* find, but here is a link to the California Dept of Water Resources. I think you can get an idea of an area near there...maybe? And maybe find some historical data, but ultimately, the area will have significant snow well into late spring, early summer.

http://cdec.water.ca.gov/cgi-progs/snow/COURSES.05

I think your photos show Patterson to be in and around the Bluff Creek area in or around May 1967.

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Guest

If I were a betting man, I'd say that the mystery guy is Roger. The jacket seems to be the same colour and has what appears to be a pleat in the back, the cut seems to be similar around the shoulder and he's wearing dark denim jeans. I know the jacket hangs low and loose but in the mystery man pic, it looks like he might have his hands in his pockets which would pull the bottom in tighter to the body.

Just my opinion :)

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parnassus

When Patterson first visited Fred Beck, he lived in a cabin near Kelso WA, in 1966, near Longview, directly west of Yakima, about 50 miles from the coast. So the store might be in that neck of the woods; Patterson mentions that they later headed to Mt. St. Helens, and stopped and had breakfast in Cougar, so all you BFFers who live in Cougar, whassup? I think the building looks more like a cafe than a store. Cougar was big time logging area, and Patterson did visit some folks around there who were interested in the caves at Mt. St. Helens, including Ape Cave at the head of Ape Canyon. Patterson also visited Ray Wallace on that trip. His companion was the estimable Prentis Beck.

Of course, Patterson says he visited Fred Beck many times, and he certainly was in the MSH area many times, so ????

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parnassus

I said this on the old BFF, and could be wrong, but I really think that's a Columbian Black Tail, not a muley. I know I'm going against the grain here, but that's my thought.

I agree; that's not a muley or a whitetail, imho. (in my hunter's opinion)

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