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Guest Theagenes

Dfoot's Theories On The Pgf As A Hoax

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roguefooter

The above picture of the mask has obviously been heavily modified to look like Patty, it looks like someone may have even added a part of Patty's face to it.

The real mask has an open mouth with teeth, it has no hair on the sides of the face, different shaped lips, and a different nose.

1z6efsp.jpg

Edited by roguefooter

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Guest Kerchak

Yes it's definitely a morphed manipulation. The Wah Chang mask most certainly is not a match for Patty's face. There are major differences everywhere. There is an obsessed poster on You Tube called eminboztepe who goes to lots of bigfoot videos declaring Patty's face to be an exact match to the Wah Chang mask. His comments are unintentionally hilarious.

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Guest Theagenes

The above picture of the mask has obviously been heavily modified to look like Patty, it looks like someone may have even added a part of Patty's face to it.

Yeah, I see that now it. I found where Dfoot originally posted that in the JREF and it was his attempt to overlay Patty on the image below to show how well the facial features line up. Apparently this is the closest angle that will match up with Patty.

taurian09_zps8220bb7f.jpg

The real mask has an open mouth with teeth, it has no hair on the sides of the face, different shaped lips, and a different nose.

Actually as you can see below the real mask had a movable jaw and could open and close it's mouth (Hey! Jaw movement---just like Patty!) Yes, hair would have had to have been added to the sides and a fur hood covering the back and top down to the browridge---lust like many of the gorilla suits did. That was Dfoot's contention.

taurian06_zps0f48b8b7.jpg

I would disagree that the lips (when closed) and the nose don't match; I think they are actually a very good match. Note the proportions of the features and their relative distance, the presence of a philtrum, the distance between the upper lip and the nose, the distance from the nose and lips to the eyes. All that lines up. That was the point of the overlay that Dfoot did above. But don't take his word for it---throw them in photoshop and play with the images yourself. If the angles were a closer match I think it would even more clear.

PattyTaurean2_zps614e86cc.jpg

To me the only major difference is the shape of the eye holes. So I don't think it's a perfect match either, but it's very close. Close enough to overcome one of the last the things that made me think Patty could be real---her face. I see now that it could be a mask. If not the Taurean alien then something similar. In fact they might have just recast the Taurean mask and fixed the eyeholes as they were apparently too big on the original. The mold is still in existence and it sold at auction a few years ago for $800. It would be cool to track that down as see if you could create a real replica of Patty.

Be even more compelling than the mask are the comparisons that Dfoot made between some of the Project Unlimited (Chambers/Janos/Wah) suits and how they were padded with the standard flaws that are often pointed out with Patty (like gigantor is doing now in the Stabilized thread). The butt pad creating the diaper effect, the horizontal line across the thigh where the thigh pad ends, the shoulder pad effect---it's all there.

So you have a creature that exhibits all the signs of a Janos suit and a Wah Chang mask from the mid-60's and all these rumors over the years that the suit came out of Chambers' shop. And who are the only two Hollywood suit guys from the time that defended the film? Janos and Chambers.

Personally I think there is a whole lot of smoke here that shouldn't be so easily dismissed if you're honest with yourself.

Edited by Theagenes
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Guest LAL

As I recall Dfoot decided Prohaska was in on it because he "knew" how long it would take to glue the hair on (ten hours).

He failed to convince me.

Check this out from 39:52, especially about the muscles around the eyes..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1bQoJVl--k

Daris wrote the standard text on primate anatomy. The film is actually John Green's copy, not the original as the narrator says.

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roguefooter

Theogenes- good catch on the teeth. The overall features are similar but I just don't see the match, especially that pancake nose.

Where did you see the mold being sold?

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Drew

While I liked where Dfoot was going, with the Corriganville ranch connection, with Wah Chang and Prohaska, He was never able to provide evidence that Roger Patterson and Bob Gimlin actually worked there.

The story was, that Ray 'Crash' Corrigan one of the kings of Hollywood Gorilla movies, created a ranch called "Corriganville", Dfoot claimed that Patterson and Gimlin both worked at Corriganville in the 50's, and that Patterson's building of the theme park in Yakima was based on his experiences there.

Being that they had working shows, and even gorilla costume stunt shows at Corriganville, they had several costume people working there, including Wah Chang and Janos Prohaska. The story being that Patterson would have had access to some of the top costume men, learned a trade, and perhaps even borrowed parts of Corrigan's gorilla suits.

http://www.corriganville.net/

Dfoot claimed as well that this was a photo of Roger Patterson from 1959, but it could not be confirmed.

bates2.jpg

Here is Buck Maffei, who worked at Corriganville, he played the Galileo7 creature in Star Trek.

speidel5.jpg

There is a claim that Roger Patterson worked at Corriganville at the same time Buck Maffei worked there.

Here is a claim from the owner of HollywoodGorillaMen.com http://www.hollywoodgorillamen.com/

http://monsterkidclassichorrorforum.yuku.com/reply/563749/Patterson-BIGFOOT-Film#reply-563749

I'm thinkin that maybe it was not only John Chambers, but also some of the guys that worked with Chambers at the time, Wah Chang, and Janos Prohaska.

The face looks a good deal similar to Changs mask he sculpted for the Star Trek episode; Galalleo 7(sic) for the giant bigfoot-like creatures.

The Trek monster was played by a 7' tall guy named "Buck" Maffei.

Buck Maffei and Patterson were friends and co-workers at a wild west show run by Ray "Crash" Corrigan.

Corrigan was one of the most famous movie gorilla men of all time.

Janos Prahaska was also a major player in the gorilla man business.

Prohaskas work was mainly seen in television,and he played a wide variety of creatures as well. ( including the blob-like Horta from Star Trek)

Most of these guys worked for, or with, a Hollywood effects house called Project Unlimited. (most famous for "The Outer Limits")

Chambers, Chang,and Prohaska were the 3 main creature guys at Project.

They were famous for cobbling together pieces of past creations to make new ones.

The Patterson "subject" looks like a combination of many elements.

The head looks like a modified version of Changs Galeleo 7 creature.

The overall body shape ( padding) looks similar to the apes that Prohaska was making at the time, with a wide back, and enormous butt !

If you look at the footage posted above, you'll see that while large strides are being taken, the butt barely moves at all. You'll also notice a line running across the upper thigh on the leg closest to us, as though a piece of foam rubber padding were stuck in the leg to beef it up a bit. This shows in a lot of Prohaskas apes.

Nothing pertaining to theanatomy had not been achieved before by Charles Gemora, Ray Corrigan, Art Miles, and a host of gorilla men as far back as the 30's

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Guest LAL

John Landis apparently started the Chambers rumor. John didn't deny it at the time because it was "good for business." In later years he denied any involvement saying, "I was good, but not that good."

The Hollywood rumors are just that - rumors.

<edited because my Kindle can't spell>

Edited by LAL

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Guest Theagenes

LAL, wouldn't you say that given everything being posted above that they are rumors that are worth investigating?

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Guest Kerchak

I would disagree that the lips (when closed) and the nose don't match; I think they are actually a very good match.

They are not even remotely being close to a match. The lips on the Wah Chang mask are much wider, the nose is much flatter and more spread out. The distance between the bottom of the nose and the upper lip are nowhere near the same and nor is the distance between the bottom lip and the chin.

Personally I think there is a whole lot of smoke here that shouldn't be so easily dismissed if you're honest with yourself.

It can easily be dismissed. It's a lot of nonsense.

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Guest LAL

I think that's been done [checking out the rumors], at least for Chambers. Bobbie Short interviewed him in the nursing home and the topic came up at a party for him as well.

Maybe next time Pat talks to Bob or Bill talked to Patricia they could ask if Roger and Bob ever worked at Corriganville. Even if they did, so what?

Janos was the best in the business. He said IF it were a suit it was the best he had ever seen.

Edited by LAL

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Guest Kerchak

Janos also said it looked very very real and said he doesn't think it was a man in a costume. Janos must be lying through his teeth (according to the theory) hehe.

Edited by Kerchak

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Guest

I agree Theagenes, this is the first I've ever heard of this story, certainly seems worth a little investigation. That mask does appear close enough to patty so that it could be modified to look like what we see in the PGF. Also, I find it comical when people throw around words like, "clearly, obviously, blatantly, no way, etc", when dealing with the PGF. It is of such low quality, which is why I believe the hoax can last forever, and makes it borderline impossible to say anything definitively on the film. And the backstory of the film and roger patterson(especially that drawing of a female bigfoot before patty) tells me all I need to know on the validity of the film.

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Guest John

Bobbie Short interviewed him in the nursing home and the topic came up at a party for him as well.

Indeed it did.

(My bold).

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Guest Kerchak

It is of such low quality, which is why I believe the hoax can last forever, and makes it borderline impossible to say anything definitively on the film.

Like when you say its definitely a man in a suit, you mean? Like that?

And the backstory of the film

Which has no real red flags.

and roger patterson(especially that drawing of a female bigfoot before patty) tells me all I need to know on the validity of the film.

Patterson drew pics of male sasquatch and youngster sasquatch too. Most of his drawings of female sasquatch don't look like Patty. The only one that does resemble Patty somewhat was copied from a Morton Kuntstler picture which in itself was modelled on the picture that William Roe's daughter saw after his sighting. So we have Patty looking somewhat like the female sasquatch that William Roes supposedly saw. That should be expected shouldn't it? It only sounds suspicious if you reject or question the idea of sasquatch. If you don't then it makes perfect sense. One female sasquatch SHOULD resemble another female sasquatch.

Edited by Kerchak

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