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Patty's Entrance And Exit


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BobZenor

This seems to show a reasonable location for her to have climbed the hill. It sure would give her a good view. I am not sure I have her location right though. Her trail is 2 meters tall so is about the right height just to give some perspective. It does go for about 300 yards. Route 12N42 apparently ends there. Her exact starting place on my graphic is 41.438897, -123.703280 . They might have built a smaller road down below closer to the creek that isn't visible or this might be the logging road they are talking about.

It certainly doesn't go down to the bridge nor does any other road go down the creek to the bridge. That might be the doubt that Parnassus is talking about. I told him that the road doesn't go up from the bridge to the PGF site and he apparently doesn't want to accept that. It comes back down as 12N42 after going up a very large hill.

pattyshidingspot.jpg

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Guest Kerchak

This seems to show a reasonable location for her to have climbed the hill. It sure would give her a good view.

Do you think Patty might have been aware of Patterson and Gimlin in the area in the days before the footage was shot? Do you think she might even have seen them before at some time? Allegedly they did a lot of riding around the creek and feeder creeks.

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kitakaze

Not to mention Lyle Laverty and his timber counting crew. They were up and down Bluff Creek for months. They somehow missed both Patterson and Gimlin and Patty.

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Guest Kerchak

Not to mention Lyle Laverty and his timber counting crew. They were up and down Bluff Creek for months. They somehow missed both Patterson and Gimlin and Patty.

And yet Patterson and Gimlin were most definitely there.

Not surprising that Lyle Laverty and his timber crew 'somehow' missed Patty. I suspect he and his crew would have been making more noise and probably wouldn't have been able to get near her, unlike P and G on horseback who bumped into her at the log jam by the creek.

Edited by Kerchak
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kitakaze

Yet Gimlin claims he was driving a C-30 Chevy dually on logging roads in the area for three weeks. What sort of Bigfoot would remain in an area with a timber crew and a truck driving around every night?

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Guest Kerchak

Yet Gimlin claims he was driving a C-30 Chevy dually on logging roads in the area for three weeks. What sort of Bigfoot would remain in an area with a timber crew and a truck driving around every night?

One that didn't actually live on the logging roads but rather deep in the forest instead, perhaps?

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BobZenor

Do you think Patty might have been aware of Patterson and Gimlin in the area in the days before the footage was shot? Do you think she might even have seen them before at some time? Allegedly they did a lot of riding around the creek and feeder creeks.

I seriously doubt she would have seen them. There are just too many deep valleys and too much dense forest. It is probably less than one chance in a hundred that she would have seen them in my opinion and that is assuming they were riding their horses in all the valleys for several days and driving the roads. I just asked my brother and he thought it was one chance in 50. I figured he would agree with me.

She may have heard the vehicle driving several miles away if she happened to be in the right spot. It would be pretty easy for her not to be aware of any people in the area at the time. There are many miles forests and deep valleys between many of those rarely traveled logging roads.

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Guest Crowlogic

Not to mention Lyle Laverty and his timber counting crew. They were up and down Bluff Creek for months. They somehow missed both Patterson and Gimlin and Patty.

If we were talking about an area the size of say Central Park in NYC then sure the timber crews and P&G could have run across one another. However the area in question is vast and who's to say P&G wanted to be seen. And some of the crews might have seen P&G and never gave it a second thought so it's lost to time now.

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Guest parnassus

BobZ

u were never there in the sixties, correct?

where do you think Patterson and Gimlin camped? Why do you think Byrne, who certainly went there, showed a road there?

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BobZenor

BobZ

u were never there in the sixties, correct?

where do you think Patterson and Gimlin camped? Why do you think Byrne, who certainly went there, showed a road there?

I was there in the early to mid 80's. They apparently camped at Louse Camp. It is actually little more than a parking space near the creek. You could park large vehicles there if you needed to.

I am sure from my experience at gold prospecting not to mention corroboration from a geological engineer and also experienced prospector that no road was ever built there. Prospecting really makes you notice things like how the creek bed is formed. We struggled to walk several hundred yards up that valley from the bridge and had to give up because of both fear of injury and slow progress. That made it stick in my mind.

This is the Burns map in question.

ByrneMap.jpg

I can't imagine what inspired some of the features on the map. He must have either misread a map before going there or he drew it from memory and got confused. His memory of the creek margin is totally off. It makes the roads very difficult to interpret. The roads are actually fairly correct if you disregard the stream margin which causes great confusion. His other additions are very crudely added.

I made an overlay to show how it compares to reality. The road to Onion mountain and Notice creek mean that I have his map approximately correctly placed. Wherever he copied it from, he obviously messed it up big time.

Burnsmapoverlay.gif

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roguefooter

The "road" on Byrne's map is most likely just land alongside the creek that was cleared from the flood, which would have been clear enough to drive on after the creek subsided. It's all overgrown with vegetation now so that's why nobody can find this "road" anymore.

Nobody in their right mind would build a road within a creek bed, not to mention it would have been mapped like all the other roads.

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Sweati - I remember reading that particular quote some time ago and always thought it an odd choice of words on Titmus' part. He said it was "obvious" but really does not say how it was obvious. And if it was obvious then it would not be "probably" came down from the mountain but "...did come down..."

Titmus stated he did not spend much time trying to backtrack but he should have. Of course he was no scientist and would not have known what was the proper thing to do from a documentation standpoint.

Certainly though if the trackway as laid out was factual it would show that no hoax occurred. And it would make sense that she would have retreated whence she came, her safe haven. But I am not sure we know exactly what the trackway did or showed because it was not documented well enough if at all.

Thank you for this post. It is great to see the analytical thinking our members use to back up the facts.

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Yet Gimlin claims he was driving a C-30 Chevy dually on logging roads in the area for three weeks. What sort of Bigfoot would remain in an area with a timber crew and a truck driving around every night?

There are no signs of any logging going on where the film was made, also, Patty was walking along the stream where she could drink and fish. If she was nursing, her calorie consumption would almost double, plus her thirst would be much greater. Nursing mothers need to almost double their fluid intake, and add healthy calories to their diet. Animals do it instinctively.

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Guest parnassus

I was there in the early to mid 80's. They apparently camped at Louse Camp. It is actually little more than a parking space near the creek. You could park large vehicles there if you needed to.

nope, they weren't at Louse camp. They were camped on that road that went up the creek. The only question is how far up it. Was it a half mile or was it up near the film site. They drove up that road. The fact that Byrne didnt draw his map to scale has nothing to do with it. With all respect, your impressions from twenty odd years afterwards are interesting but not very relevant.

Edited by parnassus
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parnassus

"With all respect, your impressions from twenty odd years afterwards are interesting but not very relevant."

but your impressions 40 years later, and never having been there, are very relevant?

fascinating.

Bill

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