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Guest Cryptic Megafauna

What Branch Of The Family Tree Does Patty Belong?

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Guest Cryptic Megafauna

May I suggest reading a book by Richard Leakey?

You would learn a lot of significant material that would be relevant to further discussion.

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LeafTalker

Bigfoot invested in physical supremacy at the expense of a larger brain and absence of complex social group abstract and symbolic thinking.

 

This is not true.

 

There are many reports of BF speaking known languages, as well as their own language. In addition, there are reports of them using glyphs (stick writing) to communicate. And finally, there are reports of them writing in English.

 

Last time I looked, spoken and written language is a sign of abstract and symbolic thinking.

 

CM, you might want to become familiar with the work of Scott Nelson. He is a linguist who has determined, from the Al Berry recordings, that the Sasquatch have language, and he has been engaged in the tedious work of transcribing the language spoken on those recordings for many years now.

 

http://ronmorehead.com/r-scott-nelson/

 

http://www.bigfootencounters.com/biology/scott-nelson-spa.htm

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ShadowBorn

In my opinion I believe that the bipedalism to quad is a response action on there part. I have seen this on edges where there have been deer ambushes along bottle necks.  The creature seem to have traveled down the hill after stunning the deer with a rock and retrieving it. I was able to see where it had placed it hands and feet or more like toes and knees as it went down the hill. It was not a full straight forward charge but an off side charge as the way the sign look like. 

 

Another time another person was camping with us and he said he thought he saw some thing hunched over walking around the fire ring. It was the hunch over that has me at thinking that if it had to take off quickly it could on all fours.

 

But Patty did not show this sign and nor did she show that she was in a hurry, but still walked in a steady pace with purpose. Nor did she show fear like other reports so she had to have observed other humans to not show fear of them. I do not see no one writing about this aspect about her , as to why she never showed no fear of them. Either she was a hoax like a man in a suit, or she was the real thing and she has observed other humans and had made a decision that these humans were not dangerous.

 

Had she run into guns before and this is why she walked away slowly and steady? Did she spot the rifle being pointed at her ? and this is the reason why she did what she did? If Patty was in danger then why did she not go down on all four to get away? 

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Guest Cryptic Megafauna

 

Bigfoot invested in physical supremacy at the expense of a larger brain and absence of complex social group abstract and symbolic thinking.

 

This is not true.

 

There are many reports of BF speaking known languages, as well as their own language. In addition, there are reports of them using glyphs (stick writing) to communicate. And finally, there are reports of them writing in English.

 

Last time I looked, spoken and written language is a sign of abstract and symbolic thinking.

 

CM, you might want to become familiar with the work of Scott Nelson. He is a linguist who has determined, from the Al Berry recordings, that the Sasquatch have language, and he has been engaged in the tedious work of transcribing the language spoken on those recordings for many years now.

 

http://ronmorehead.com/r-scott-nelson/

 

http://www.bigfootencounters.com/biology/scott-nelson-spa.htm

 

Animals have language, you can talk to a parrot, a gorilla, a dog,

The point is the level of social abstraction.

Bigfoot are not driving around in cars, living in cities, communication by computer, email, cellphone.

We can organize states of hundreds of millions of people

There is a reason for that.

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guyzonthropus

But it does not rule out other levels or forms of abstraction on their part, that we in our advanced state of self-impressed omniscience have yet to recognize or even realize. In that most every issue, aside from meteors and solar flares, can be traced back to our knack for overpopulation, perhaps our organizational skills have ultimately worked against us, or maybe we just haven't worked all the kinks out quite yet....

And I was reading Leakey back in the mid 80's......And Dawson, Berger&Luckman, Arhendt(sp?)

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salubrious
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But Patty did not show this sign and nor did she show that she was in a hurry, but still walked in a steady pace with purpose. Nor did she show fear like other reports so she had to have observed other humans to not show fear of them. I do not see no one writing about this aspect about her , as to why she never showed no fear of them. Either she was a hoax like a man in a suit, or she was the real thing and she has observed other humans and had made a decision that these humans were not dangerous.

 

Had she run into guns before and this is why she walked away slowly and steady? Did she spot the rifle being pointed at her ? and this is the reason why she did what she did? If Patty was in danger then why did she not go down on all four to get away? 

 

An animal running in the forest is an animal in extreme danger. Almost any animal will take their time to move away from a perceived threat, but usually in what appears to be a leisurely fashion. They only run if spooked. If they run, they give away their position to other creatures in the area, which is not a good thing regardless of predator or prey. So walking is the preferred means of leaving.

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norseman

Bigfoot invested in physical supremacy at the expense of a larger brain and absence of complex social group abstract and symbolic thinking.

This is not true.

 

There are many reports of BF speaking known languages, as well as their own language. In addition, there are reports of them using glyphs (stick writing) to communicate. And finally, there are reports of them writing in English.

 

Last time I looked, spoken and written language is a sign of abstract and symbolic thinking.

 

CM, you might want to become familiar with the work of Scott Nelson. He is a linguist who has determined, from the Al Berry recordings, that the Sasquatch have language, and he has been engaged in the tedious work of transcribing the language spoken on those recordings for many years now.

 

http://ronmorehead.com/r-scott-nelson/

 

http://www.bigfootencounters.com/biology/scott-nelson-spa.htm

Animals have language, you can talk to a parrot, a gorilla, a dog,

The point is the level of social abstraction.

Bigfoot are not driving around in cars, living in cities, communication by computer, email, cellphone.

We can organize states of hundreds of millions of people

There is a reason for that.

Oh silly silly man.....the forest people live like a bear in the woods by choice. Yet they are smarter than we puny minded humans.

(your observation is spot on and plussed)

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Guest Cryptic Megafauna

Thanks,

 

I think where A chimp might learn 2000 symbols perhaps a Bigfoot might be able learn 10,000 symbols.

Probably could have some type of rudimentary conversation that would be much more interesting than a chimp.

 

It would be interesting to see if they have some type of symbolic language and what types of things they communicate about beyond food, sex, or danger.

 

"Me Patty and like sunset fox walks on the beach"? 

 

They would not have human vocal abilities since a hallmark of Homo evolution is in the larynx and in breath control and parsing of sounds.

 

The analysis of the Sierra Sounds indicate that the have more of an apelike vocalization and cannot enunciate all vowel sounds.

 

They seem less organized than chimps so perhaps they de-evolved socially so as to remain more isolated and harder to find.

 

Pretty much like people that went wild to escape the persecution during the Soviet era  and maintained small nuclear families deep in the bush far from society.

Edited by Cryptic Megafauna

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Guest Cryptic Megafauna

 

But Patty did not show this sign and nor did she show that she was in a hurry, but still walked in a steady pace with purpose. Nor did she show fear like other reports so she had to have observed other humans to not show fear of them. I do not see no one writing about this aspect about her , as to why she never showed no fear of them. Either she was a hoax like a man in a suit, or she was the real thing and she has observed other humans and had made a decision that these humans were not dangerous.

 

Had she run into guns before and this is why she walked away slowly and steady? Did she spot the rifle being pointed at her ? and this is the reason why she did what she did? If Patty was in danger then why did she not go down on all four to get away? 

 

An animal running in the forest is an animal in extreme danger. Almost any animal will take their time to move away from a perceived threat, but usually in what appears to be a leisurely fashion. They only run if spooked. If they run, they give away their position to other creatures in the area, which is not a good thing regardless of predator or prey. So walking is the preferred means of leaving.

 

I think Patty was conserving energy while she took stock of the danger, whether hot pursuit, etc.

(you notice she turns around and looks, but just once, and it is beeline-out-of-there all the way.

 

Conserving energy till she was approximate to a tree line and a steep slope. One to screen her movements and the other to gain altitude based on physiologic advantage provided by a Sasquatches unique locomotion physiology. The tree line and then up slope is the classic avoidance strategy of the Sasquatch, it seems.

 

Another words get in cover and run (they don't run anyway, just make huge strides).

Probably they can't handle long distance running as good as man so they gain distance and then rely on stealth movement in inhospitable terrain to out maneuver pursuers, at least until they need to make another burst (or counter attack).

Edited by Cryptic Megafauna

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guyzonthropus

Cryptic~ I loved the "me Patty...." line!

As for breath control, they have been reported swimming well under water, which requires breath control.

Hmmm, I wonder what impact/influence, if any, such breath control while swimming had on our own development of spoken language, or if the influence went the other way, in that it took the control needed to speak that first allowed us to swim under water?

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southernyahoo
They've kept their ENTIRE SPECIES almost completely unknown by our culture, that's not the workings of a simple mind.

 

You got that right Guyz!!!!

 

 

On the subject of why they might favor the quadrupedal locomotion at times. Like what Guyzonthropus said earlier , their can be many reasons beyond the straight linear evolutionary path. I think at first as an infant it is about brain development, but later it can be mimicry of other animals, keeping a low profile when it's beneficial, ease of moving through thick underbrush, or simply not knowing any better, if the quadrupeds encountered in their environment were the primary influence during development like with feral children.

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FarArcher

There is a body of narratives over centuries, and if one considers these collective narratives, we see a creature who:

 

1. Is primarily adapted to nocturnal activities.  Yes they are seen in daytime, but the weight of narratives indicate significantly more activity starting at sundown.  Only recently developed technology has allowed our own limited abilities to go out at night.  But those technological abilities simultaneously telegraph human approaches from long distances, enabling observation or evasion - whichever they prefer. 

 

2. Has a natural Ghillie suit.  Ideal for breaking up overall shape, many report a flat black appearance that doesn't reflect light, ideal for moving and living in the shadows, hunting by ambush, and while they are very large animals, they can get very small by using this natural camouflage.  It is so easy to hide from humans very nearby, if one can break up his shape, remain motionless, and confuse human eyes by blending with shadows, rocks, and grey bark.

 

3. They have great muscular mass and are extremely powerful.  Those "natural" approaches taken by humans, due to limited strength and capability, are NOT the same natural approaches taken by much more powerful critters.  The ability to leap great distances and run up almost vertical inclines due to apparently a differently hinged ankle enable them to "disappear" very quickly.  

 

4. Animals that can't "talk" seem to be able to use other means to communicate basic concerns to others of their species.  We like to think we alone have a spoken language, and maybe we do - but what if language can be defined as a means to communicate - then there are degrees of language.  There are peoples even today that can't read or write, but they meet their own needs.  Some backward cultures can't do calculus, but neither do they find a need for it.  And yet they are as human as NASA employees.

 

5. I noted especially in the jungle and deep remote forests, you have your daytime players, and come sundown, they become relatively inactive and an entirely new group of players come out to in turn, dominate the night.  Some do split duties.  Some lean more one way than the other, due to their capabilities.  Outdoorsmen know this.

 

Humans and Critters have some similarities.  Likewise, they have many dissimilarities.   Just how many are yet to be determined.

Edited by FarArcher
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LeafTalker

There are peoples even today that can't read or write, but they meet their own needs.  Some backward cultures can't do calculus, but neither do they find a need for it.  And yet they are as human as NASA employees.

This is beautiful, Far Archer. I was going to make the same point – something something something People of Borneo are going to be very disappointed to hear their lack of cell phones makes them subhuman – but you did it much better.

 

I don’t agree with everything you say, Far Archer, but one thing I have noticed about you – and admire – is your obvious respect for the object of your interest. You’re also clearly a smart person. Others I admire here – Guyzonthropus and southernyahoo, for example – unite these same things in their one beings: intelligence and respect.

 

For some, respect is a natural way of being. For others, respect (meaning, in this case, respect for the BF) sometimes comes as a result of actual first-hand experience. Wherever it comes from, though, respect indicates a willingness to suspend ego and allow for outcomes that might contradict deeply held and nakedly self-serving notions such as the notion that homo sapiens is superior to every other living being.

 

 

So in that way, respect is critical to inquiries of all kinds. It is the only posture, the only attitude, that allows for true learning. 

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Guest Cryptic Megafauna

Cryptic~ I loved the "me Patty...." line!

As for breath control, they have been reported swimming well under water, which requires breath control.

Hmmm, I wonder what impact/influence, if any, such breath control while swimming had on our own development of spoken language, or if the influence went the other way, in that it took the control needed to speak that first allowed us to swim under water?

I think you enjoy throwing curve balls  :P

 

It works the other way, we are the only animal that can drown because having a throat that can modulate sound better (but not close to keep out water) makes for a better evolutionary survival than not being able to not drown.

 

You could also argue that the  is is psycho spiritual and the enlarged spinal cord in the upper body area we have is because our physical envelope is evolving faster to accommodate fuller expression in our upper (non animalistic) chakras or spinal nerve plexuses at the heart, throat-creative and crown-transpersonal.

 

The water of Aquarius that issues from the throat chakra being synonymous with the water of life, communication with higher creativity at the trans-personal point. (higher consciousness informing the arch type of the meaning).

 

If we are fundamentally a vibratory thought form as physics indicates we are, then are vibrations is progressing faster and higher than Patty.

 

However if a Sasquatch can swim perhaps it too has that evolutionary development of the throat.

 

The Sierra sounds may indicate otherwise, however (being more of an apelike modulation).

Edited by Cryptic Megafauna

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Guest Cryptic Megafauna

 

They've kept their ENTIRE SPECIES almost completely unknown by our culture, that's not the workings of a simple mind.

 

You got that right Guyz!!!!

 

 

On the subject of why they might favor the quadrupedal locomotion at times. Like what Guyzonthropus said earlier , their can be many reasons beyond the straight linear evolutionary path. I think at first as an infant it is about brain development, but later it can be mimicry of other animals, keeping a low profile when it's beneficial, ease of moving through thick underbrush, or simply not knowing any better, if the quadrupeds encountered in their environment were the primary influence during development like with feral children.

 

The point from an Anthropological perspective would be in the definition of quadruped despite whatever evolutionary path.

They have a foot made for walking and not tree climbing and a hand that is not appearing to be a functional foot.

So they are Bipedal with an ability for locomotion that accommodates their enhanced gymnastic ability, being one of the most energetic complex animals on the planet.

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