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BobbyO

Camping - Is this the best chance to see Sasquatch ?

Camping - Is this the best chance to see Sasquatch ?  

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norseman
On 9/14/2018 at 1:12 PM, BigTreeWalker said:

Which is currently where I'm hunting right now... Skamania County that is. 

 

Good luck!

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BobbyO
SSR Team
9 hours ago, gigantor said:

 

 

When you say "Non Visual", do you mean Class B reports?

 

 

Yeah. Tracks, vocals, knocks etc combined.

 

Non Visual Reports, reports where they're not seen.

6 hours ago, Huntster said:

 

Whoa! California is way skewed on that graph!

 

It is weird. That needs further looking in to for sure.

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SWWASAS
13 hours ago, Huntster said:

 

Whoa! California is way skewed on that graph!

I was wondering about California.   Is it because there are more people to make sightings or more to sight?   The high Sierra does not have much cover above the snow line.     Maybe more sightings because cover is less?     The area between Yosemite and Lake Tahoe is where the Sierra Sounds were recorded.  

Edited by SWWASAS

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Huntster

It must be a question/answer anomaly. For example, if you’re backpacking for more than two days, you’re camping AND hiking. Throw a line in the creek, and you’re fishing, too. It all depends on when you see the critter: while actually hiking to your camping destination, actually fishing when you get to camp, or hanging out/cooking/eating/sleeping in camp. The answer seems to indicate that Class A encounters occur when actually in camp. 

 

This is could be good news for the Huntster. I love sitting quietly in camp waiting for big game to come to me. I caught a caribou like that last month.

 

When I get a chance, I’ll be querying the SSR database to see if this stat can be pinpointed to a specific area in California. My initial hunch is that it can; the northwest corner of the state.........

 

 

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Huntster

Come to think of it, my own “maybe” some 46 years ago was just like my above post:

 

We were backpacking, and halfway through a six day trip when we came across the trackway less than a mile from our next planned campsite. After arriving in the campsite, we fished in the creek (the fishing was great, and we did not see a sasquatch). While “hanging out” in camp, a giant, old sequoia tree decides to fall down nearby (yes, there was a definite sound). Later that night, we had a visitor. I have no idea whether it was a raccoon, bear, sasquatch, or human serial killer, so it wasn’t a Class A sighting.

 

But it was while “camping”..........

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SWWASAS

My first maybe was in about 1970.     I was back packing in the mountains in New Mexico.     Found a place along a little creek and hankered down for the night.    About 2 AM heard something moving about outside the tent.    Something large.     Figured it was a bear so lighted my little back pack gas stove and  pushed it out the front of the tent and beat metal pans together.   I was unarmed other than a knife.      That elicited some growling and I heard what sounded like rocks being rolled off the bank into the river because I heard splashes when rocks hit the creek and sounds of rocks hitting other rocks in the water.         Very sure now it was a bear because of the growl.   .      The ruckus outside continued for over an hour before I stopped hearing anything.    Did not sleep the rest of the night especially after the stove ran out of gas.        In the morning I got up and realized there was no significant bank for anything to roll into the creek, but not knowing about BF,  I wrote the experience off as a bear.    After getting into BF research I have rethought the whole experience.     A bear might have rolled rocks by dislodging them,   but there was no significant slope to the banks that a rock would roll down.   For the rocks to enter the stream and splash,   they had to have been thrown.    Bears do not throw rocks and while they might dislodge the rocks from a steep bank,    that did not exist.   Now I think it more likely to have been a BF than a bear.    I never once thought about getting outside the tent to see what it was.   The tent and the stove seemed to dissuade the critter and I did not want to change things.        Perhaps with a weapon I might have taken a look.   I must have had a little flashlight but I doubt it was very large.   It was a long time before I went back packing again.  

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bipedalist
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Bears and raccoons will roll/flip rocks.  Bears will tear up logs and knock around snags to get at grubs, amphibians, insects, etc.  Always good to remember.  A beaver tail slap and dive can sound like somebody throwing a cannonball into a stream/lake.  These are all things good outdoorspeople will file in the back of their head.  They become fodder for class B BF encounters otherwise.  Not to say BF doesn't pluck rocks, roll rocks, throw rocks and have a 100 mph fastball.  Just a reminder that our shady neighbors can take the fall for alot of other animals.  BFs can growl and imitate other animals too (500 lb owls).  Makes it sort of difficult to know what you are up against sometimes.  Don't know any bears with 100 mph fastballs but know a few that know how to tear sheet metal and doors off cars and houses to obtain whatever they want to.  Just curious did you always keep your backpack stove in your tent?  Hope you didn't use it to cook there.  The only time during a deluge/severe thunderstorm I tried that trick and actually tried to light one with an old optimus stove I had to kick the thing free of the tent to keep from being a flaming enchilada.  Live and learn, some people don't live to learn making freshman mistakes like that.  I hear you on that desire to backpack again after close bear encounters.  After the recent Oregon cougar kill on a human female hiker I suppose there will be more than a few second thoughts about solo travel, you have to plan your trips very carefully (even though it was apparently the only documented human kill by cougar in Oregon recorded history).  They apparently killed one that is a suspect but DNA testing not completed as I write this. 

 

I still think the long term false camp with a looped longterm recording of snoring, maybe and another recorder nearby may help determine who these "invaders" are.  A black plastic tent with a thermal recorder may also fit the bill in such a scenario and possibly a plotwatcher assist.  When you set up these scenarios though and are not able to monitor them remotely or in vivo occasionally you run the risk of losing your whole setup unltess you are on private property rarely visited by homo sapiens sapiens.  If you set them up on forest, park or wilderness grounds setup would be subject to seizure if discovered deployed for more than 48 hrs apparently i understand. 

 

https://www.opb.org/news/article/hunting-cougar-killed-hiker-mount-hood-oregon/

Edited by bipedalist
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Explorer

BobbyO, RedBone, Gigantor, and others who are actively using the SSR database,  I got a question related to the camping question.

 

If you look at the stats for a specific bounded area (say a National Forest), does the deer hunting season increase or decrease the odds of a visual sighting compared to camping, hiking, and fishing in the same area?

 

Reason I ask, is that I just came from camping in a hotspot area in the Stanislaus NF and it was flooded with deer hunters (apparently Saturday-Sept. 15 was first day of hunting season).

In an area that hardly gets people during 4th of July weekend, all pullouts for car camping spots were taken by Friday night and there were trucks driving in during the night looking for a spot to camp.

Daytime, I ran into hunters in all my usual hikes into the forest.  These are places that I usually don't run into people.

Guns were going off all day long.

 

It appears that deer hunting season does bring a lot more people into this particular forest.  Some of them were hunting from their truck, but I saw many hiking into the forest off-trail.

With a higher number of people in an area, you would expect higher number of sightings (everything else being equal).

But, if the gunshots are scaring away the BFs, then the number of sightings could be lower.

Hard to tell which is the dominant factor.

 

Probably need to dissect all hunting visual cases to see how they got their visual.  Where they deep in the woods, actively hunting during the day or camping?

 

 

Edited by Explorer
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SWWASAS

Your logic about the bears was what I used at the time.    I doubt that a bear is going to come close to a human camp to start looking under rocks for grubs and picas.   Other than dislodging rocks with a bluff charge,  I have never heard of bears using rocks during human interaction.     Beavers usually leave sign that they are around but I suppose tail slaps is a possibility.    Doubt that they growl much or could care less I was camping there.      Have been having issues with raccoons at my place so know they can be very aggressive.   Never heard one growl even though several have stood on their hind legs and wanted to take me on.       That was my first ever back packing trip and I have never solo back backed since.      I cooked outside but took the stove inside to make it easier to light in the morning.   Did not cook or eat in the tent.     

 

The cougar attack was tragic.      Lack of an a fatal attack in Oregon has made hikers careless.   As I recall the woman was 5' 4"  so not very large.   The animal rights people are having a fit one was killed.    Sad to see someone had to be lost to educate the public.        I was hiking a coastal trail and found cougar tracks following a person with small feet.     It followed her down a muddy trail for about 1/4 mile.    The tracks were still following her when I encountered the woman on her way out.   She was probably not 21 yet and very small.     I warned her about the cougar and the tracks and she looked at me like I was nuts to be concerned.  After all they are just big kitties.   

 

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Redbone
20 hours ago, Huntster said:

 

Whoa! California is way skewed on that graph!

I found and corrected 3 California camping report entries that should have been Class B. I checked 'most' of the remaining reports and all I checked were accurately classified. That still leaves CA numbers high compared to other states.

I also found and fixed 7 more entries nationwide. I will look for more and fix them as I find them. It turns out I'm not perfect... who knew?

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norseman

Well California IS a big state! Probably the same land mass as Washington and Oregon combined?

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Huntster

I plused this post because I’m confident that this subject is critical, and it certainly deserves a long thread of its own:

 

2 hours ago, Explorer said:

........does the deer hunting season increase or decrease the odds of a visual sighting compared to camping, hiking, and fishing in the same area?

 

Reason I ask, is that I just came from camping in a hotspot area in the Stanislaus NF and it was flooded with deer hunters (apparently Saturday-Sept. 15 was first day of hunting season).

In an area that hardly gets people during 4th of July weekend, all pullouts for car camping spots were taken by Friday night and there were trucks driving in during the night looking for a spot to camp.

Daytime, I ran into hunters in all my usual hikes into the forest.  These are places that I usually don't run into people.

Guns were going off all day long.

 

It appears that deer hunting season does bring a lot more people into this particular forest.  Some of them were hunting from their truck, but I saw many hiking into the forest off-trail.

With a higher number of people in an area, you would expect higher number of sightings (everything else being equal).

But, if the gunshots are scaring away the BFs, then the number of sightings could be lower.........

 

As a lifelong big game hunter, I’m intimately familiar with both human and wildlife behavior before, during, and after hunting seasons. I’ve even noticed wildlife behavioral changes after seasons change after many years. 

 

I’ve also queried the SSR for the four northwest counties in California (Del Norte, Humboldt, Trinity, & Siskiyou) and found that October reports (deer hunting season) boasts a higher number of reports, including the famed PGF filming event. One reason is that the high number of people out and about are actually looking for animals with optical aids rather than just splashing about in rivers and lakes. 

 

Do I think that sasquatches frolick about more during that time? Actually, yeah........kinda’. It is a well known fact that late October weather drives deer down from the alpine areas of the Marble Mountains, Salmon Mountains, and Trinity Alps. There is every reason to believe that the same holds true for sasquatches. Moreover, the likelihood that sasquatches (like deer) are up high during the hot months of summer when people and families frolick in the lower forests, rivers, and beaches helps explain lower sighting frequencies when more people are out and about. 

 

Animals tend to to be rather tolerant of people.........until the gunfire begins. They aren’t stupid. When the shooting starts, they disappear. When the season ends and the hordes leave, they come back out. Sometimes it actually seems that they understand the regs so completely that they know you can’t shoot them. Moreover, when hunting season ends, fewer and fewer people go out into the woods until the next spring when the cycle begins again and animals follow the receding snow uphill as fresh vegetation emerges.

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bipedalist
BFF Patron
2 hours ago, SWWASAS said:

Your logic about the bears was what I used at the time.    I doubt that a bear is going to come close to a human camp to start looking under rocks for grubs and picas.   Other than dislodging rocks with a bluff charge,  I have never heard of bears using rocks during human interaction.     Beavers usually leave sign that they are around but I suppose tail slaps is a possibility.    Doubt that they growl much or could care less I was camping there.      Have been having issues with raccoons at my place so know they can be very aggressive.   Never heard one growl even though several have stood on their hind legs and wanted to take me on.       That was my first ever back packing trip and I have never solo back backed since.      I cooked outside but took the stove inside to make it easier to light in the morning.   Did not cook or eat in the tent.     

 

The cougar attack was tragic.      Lack of an a fatal attack in Oregon has made hikers careless.   As I recall the woman was 5' 4"  so not very large.   The animal rights people are having a fit one was killed.    Sad to see someone had to be lost to educate the public.        I was hiking a coastal trail and found cougar tracks following a person with small feet.     It followed her down a muddy trail for about 1/4 mile.    The tracks were still following her when I encountered the woman on her way out.   She was probably not 21 yet and very small.     I warned her about the cougar and the tracks and she looked at me like I was nuts to be concerned.  After all they are just big kitties.   

 

 

Good on the stove.  Raccoons certainly do growl and have a very intimidating one, not to mention the screeches emitted during raccoon fights which sound like an alien on steroids.  If I can dig up a raccoon growl file in my archived sound collection I will post one up just to be clear on that, youtube is probably your best friend on that though.  Appreciate the discussion on the sighting database.  California certainly is a large landmass even if you take out populations of hundreds of thousands/millions from the equation. Gotta wonder if some of those BF run towards the gunshots now like Grizzlys/Browns have been known to do in the past. 

Edited by bipedalist

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gigantor

Here is California Camping Class A reports

 

camping-ca-counties.jpg

 

ca-camping-sighttime.jpg

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Huntster

As I suspected, Trinity, Siskiyou, Del Norte, and Humboldt are high on the graphs. Toulumne isn’t a huge surprise, but San Bernardino is.

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