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norseman
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6 hours ago, wiiawiwb said:

 

It's profoundly sad that your friend went missing and has never been found.  Closure is important to family and friends like yourself.  I can't imagine it.

 

That said, there are differences between his case and at least one of the cases in The Hunted.  For one, I suspect the FBI was not called in nor did they visit the site. They don't do that for adult hunters who go missing yet they were called in and did visit the site for several days in the Messick case. Why?

 

In Alaska, there are things that will kill you and drag you off. That would be evident if they knew exactly where your friend was when such an event took place. In the Messick case, everyone knew where he was. Any sign of a struggle would have stood out like a sore thumb. There were no such signs.  Also, his rifle was never found. How did that disappear?

 

 


The aliens took it because they are losing too many of their saucers to gunfire!

 

 

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wiiawiwb
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Haha!  If there are aliens, they probably look at our rifles as though they're peashooters!

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norseman
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19 minutes ago, wiiawiwb said:

Haha!  If there are aliens, they probably look at our rifles as though they're peashooters!


One would think! .30-06 vs Asteroids, comets, black holes, cosmic rays, etc🧐

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Huntster
10 hours ago, wiiawiwb said:

It's profoundly sad that your friend went missing and has never been found.  Closure is important to family and friends like yourself.  I can't imagine it.


That said, there are differences between his case and at least one of the cases in The Hunted........

 

Most definitely. The case of my friend is a run-of-the-mill Alaskan disappearance. It's a regular deal. And what Paulides is writing about are the more bizarre cases. And some of these likely have incredible explanations........if said explanations can ever be discovered.

 

Quote

.........For one, I suspect the FBI was not called in nor did they visit the site. They don't do that for adult hunters who go missing yet they were called in and did visit the site for several days in the Messick case. Why?........

 

The FBI have primary jurisdiction over kidnappings and interstate movement situations. They also have assets that state and local law enforcement agencies like to utilize. The local LEOs might have had some suspicions and brought the FBI into it in order to have some federal boxes checked.

 

Foul play is ALWAYS a box that has to be checked. The guy who helped me check the river was interrogated by the Troopers, and he didn't like it, but he should have expected it. 

 

When my truck crashed through the ice on Big Lake several years ago and I finally escaped the cab, crawled out of the water, and got to a warm house, I was asked by a Trooper if anybody was in the truck with me. I told them no, but you can bet they sent divers down to check it for themselves.  I expected it.

 

Quote

......In Alaska, there are things that will kill you and drag you off........

 

More importantly, you can't go far in Alaska without having to either climb a mountain (and fall) or cross a river (and drown). Then the wildlife will find you with their noses and eat you.

 

.......In the Messick case, everyone knew where he was. Any sign of a struggle would have stood out like a sore thumb. There were no such signs.  Also, his rifle was never found. How did that disappear?

 

Don't know. I'm sure it's a perplexing case. A certain percentage of disappearances are, and will likely never be solved. And Paulides is cashing in on those. Good on him. But the vast majority of disappearances? Falls, drownings, exposure.

 

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wiiawiwb
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My understanding is the FBI do not investigate a lost hiker , hunter, or someone missing. A lost child is different but a lost hunter is garden variety left to state and local authorities. Apparently, there was a reason the FBI  decided to take an interest in this case and be on scene. No one seems to either know or be willing to say.

 

The falls, drowning, and exposure were all investigated and SAR was there within 6 hours.  250 SAR onsite, which is unheard of in most cases, helicopter thermal, search dogs, cadaver dogs, and divers in every waterhole around. Every square inch was grid searched then searched again.

 

It's one of the weird cases where he was with 6 other people yet literally vanished off the face of the earth. 

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Huntster

Here is the weirdest one I've ever been near to. I wasn't there when he disappearred, but I was for a couple of weeks afterwards during the search.

 

https://truecrimesociety.com/2019/08/25/missing-on-mount-marathon-michael-lemaitre/

 

Four years later, and after a civil suit, more details.......:

 

https://www.adn.com/crime-justice/article/seward-lemaitre-settle-case-missing-mount-marathon-runner-20000/2014/10/15/

 

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Arvedis
On 3/17/2020 at 6:20 PM, wiiawiwb said:

My understanding is that Paulides only takes on a case when foul play, animal predation, and self-disappearance are not suspected by authorities.  I'm a member of SAR and when every square inch of an area has been searched and cross searched several times, there is a very high-level of confidence that the missing person is no longer there.  Having said that, there are also no signs that an abduction has taken place.

 

The most baffling one I know of is the Missing 411 case of Thomas Messick. Where is he? I have my own suspicion. 

 

What are your theories on the Messick case in particular?  The clue I am most interested in that the film did not resolve came from his close friend, I forget his name.  The old timer was genuinely spooked when recalling the day's events. He said he heard a sound he has never heard before in the woods, nor since. His son said that the old timer talks about that day all the time. Yet, we have no further clues what that sound was or even a basic description.  I wonder if he feels embarrassed talking about it or what the problem is.

 

“I heard a strange noise in the woods, but I don't know what it was..Just a different noise from what I usually hear, you know?

 

“Like what?”

 

“It'd be hard to explain because...But it was different. Something different that I never heard before in the woods. I just can't say what it was, you know?”

 

“How long in duration was it? Was it two or three seconds?”

 

“No, it's just... Whatever it is, you know?”

 

“How far away was it?”

 

“I'd say it was probably 150 yards, something like that.”

 

“Was it toward Tom, or away from Tom?”

 

“This was up towards the hill. The top of the hill. Yeah.”

 

“Did you tell the cops this?”

 

“Yeah, I told them that. But they just passed it off, you know?

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wiiawiwb
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The person you're alluding to is Sid, a long-time friend of Messick. It seemed to me that Sid felt terrible because he is the one who suggested they go to Lily Pond to do a quick hunt. Of course, it's not his fault at all but I'm sure it weighs on him. They were friends for decades.

 

Later in the video, Sid's son speaks of his conversations with his dad about that noise. I believe he said that his dad described the sound as "a trap closing".  My DVD is out to a friend so I can't replay it and give you his exact description.

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wiiawiwb
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On 7/20/2020 at 2:53 AM, Arvedis said:

What are your theories on the Messick case in particular? 

 

I do have my own theory about the Messick case but prefer not to vocalize now. The SAR effort of methodically formulating a plan and then executing it was extraordinary. The area was criss-cross grid searched from multiple directions with SAR personnel shoulder-to-shoulder. Highly doubtful they could have missed him as certain grids, particularly those determined he'd most likely be in,  were searched multiple times.

 

Ask yourself, how could people, shoulder-to shoulder, in a well-orchestrated search with hundreds of people, not locate a rifle lying on the ground?  They knew where he was and a rifle doesn't move of its own volition.

 

 

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Arvedis
7 hours ago, wiiawiwb said:

I believe he said that his dad described the sound as "a trap closing".

 

I forgot he said that! That is such an important clue. As far fetched as it would be, considering the circumstances, I would prod Sid to get undergo professional hypnotic regression and relive the experience, carefully describing everything he heard. There may be more to the story that everyone is blanking on.

 

Usually, I would not encourage hypnotic regression because it is imperfect and could be a rabbit trail. Given the complete lack of clues in this case, I think it's worth a shot.   

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BlackRockBigfoot
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Paulides definitely seems to be leaning towards an extra-dimensional predator or assailant for a lot of the stranger disappearances.  

 

The 'trap' sound really caught his attention during that interview.  

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Arvedis
6 hours ago, wiiawiwb said:

I do have my own theory about the Messick case but prefer not to vocalize now.

 

I respect that and also your work in SAR.  I'll step on the ledge and offer my early theory. I don't think it was a "trap" sound.  I think it was machinery or metallic noise, the kind that has come up in BF as well as paranormal research (skinwalker ranch, etc.). It's a reasonably consistent ghost noise that comes up when researchers capture EVPs. Beyond that, I am at a loss to offer a hypothesis where to go with it next. The clues are there though.

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Incorrigible1
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Fascinating discussion, gentlemen. Kudos to all.

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Twist

In one account I listened to they mentioned that he was positioned only 40 yards off a dirt road while waiting.  I can’t recall if that’s been mentioned in other accounts I’ve heard.  If true that opens up a lot of possibilities when taking into account the “odd” sound.  

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On 7/18/2020 at 10:34 PM, Huntster said:

Here is the weirdest one I've ever been near to. I wasn't there when he disappearred, but I was for a couple of weeks afterwards during the search.

 

That is an odd one. What do you think happened? 

 

Seems like if he fell off the mountain, the body could have been found. But not having been there, I suppose the terrain is too rugged to support an intensive SAR effort on the ground.

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