Jump to content

e-DNA Sampling For Sasquatch


Recommended Posts

NatFoot

Upvote for you.

 

I'd not play the game of sitting on suggestions. If you want to move this forward and catch attention of people who are out and might be willing to take samples and send them - I'd make this seem as cut and dry and easy as possible and not play to forum politics/etiquette.

 

It's the same advice I gave months ago.

 

What about soliciting help to gather all recent reports (under 5 years) where there are reports of a Sasquatch in, or interacting with, a body of water.

 

Post the reports and let's see how many people are close and willing to go out and sample those bodies of water as close to sighting areas as possible.

 

Theory would be that they might still be around and still interacting with those same bodies of water. If so, their unique DNA would show up according to everything I've read from you.

 

It could be a good start to getting a decent number of samples going. 

 

Once we have the reports listed and, if there seems to be some potential likelihood of success with reports matched to volunteers to take samples - let's start a GoFundMe and members can donate for the cost of analysis for retrieved samples.

 

Just an idea....

Edited by NatFoot
  • Thanks 1
  • Upvote 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
NorthWind

I don't have money to spend - going through a nasty divorce, but I won't go into it here. However, I would be willing to take a sample or three if and when @Madison5716 and I find more tracks by the lakeside. We have to wait until the fall unless we get lucky because that's when they drain the lakes and expose the mud flats. But that's when we have found prints in the past. Anyway, I am willing to invest time and gas, so count me in. 

Edited by NorthWind
Tagging Madison
Link to post
Share on other sites
hiflier
Posted (edited)

Me collate the reports from the last five years? I have enough on my plate just with this. If you don't wish to corral the reports yourself and bring the data here, then maybe someone else is willing? I would like to look at this as a team effort. I've done months of solo work to get to this point and there's still a ways to go. For example, contacting these primatology labs to trying to get a dialogue going regarding accepting samples and cost will take some time. I'm doing it because someone asked me to find a lab, and there are many more labs out there than just those below. Evidently genetic primatology studies are here to stay:

 

https://www.eva.mpg.de/primat/research-groups/molecular-genetics-laboratory/main-page.html

https://www.gwprimategenomicslab.org/research

https://www.ithaca.edu/news/monkeys-and-microbes-studied-ithaca-colleges-new-biosafety-lab

https://anthropology.wustl.edu/primate-genetics-and-molecular-ecology-lab-pgame

 

This is, at Arizona State University is an interesting site: http://www.primateproducts.com/blog/2016/10/17/genetic-testing-non-human-primates/ because it is linked to the products used for testing non-Human primates. So, there's plenty of work to be done now that I've reached a confident end to my research to date.

 

@NorthWind thank you! Between yourself and Madison, Norseman, and wiiawiwb, that's four so far. And believe me when I say I will be looking at trying to find a zero-cost option. That's why the right dialogue to the right person at the right facility is so important. But then I think you all know that :) Again, my thanks.

 

As a suggestion for something to think about? From what I've read and linked, taking a water sample from a water-filled footprint is probably the best source. I know people have said that such an artifact is virtually impossible to get a cast out of, but it may be a perfect situation for getting DNA.

Edited by hiflier
Link to post
Share on other sites
NatFoot

I didn't mean "you".

 

There are some folks here who can whip up report lists with that type of criteria very quickly and have before for other analyses.

 

 

So I know e-DNA is different than a DNA sample...but what about one of Bigtex's sotol chews soaked in water and then testing the water in the baggy in lieu of a river/lake.

Link to post
Share on other sites
hiflier

Well, technically e-DNA just means samples taken from the environment right? So DNA is DNA no matter the source.

 

4 minutes ago, NatFoot said:

what about one of Bigtex's sotol chews soaked in water and then testing the water in the baggy in lieu of a river/lake.

 

It's a fine idea, NatFoot :) 

Link to post
Share on other sites
BlackRockBigfoot

I would be willing to collect and send soil and water samples from the 4 areas where we have found possible signs of activity.  

 

 

 

  • Upvote 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
hiflier
Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, Twist said:

I’ll grab samples from the western side of Michigan if needed.

 

If NEEDED? LOL, of course they will be needed, Twist. So cool that you'd be willing to do that. And I can't go further without thanking @norseman for initiating this. I have to say, the man has quite  bit of some pull here :) Kudos to him for leading things off. He's a born-successful hunter and for him to endorse this says a lot.

 

8 minutes ago, BlackRockBigfoot said:

I would be willing to collect and send soil and water samples from the 4 areas where we have found possible signs of activity.  

 

 

 

 

This is BIG folks. You had mentioned in the past , along with others, that you would do that. You and the rest need to definitely read this if you haven't already: https://www.the-scientist.com/news-opinion/researchers-detect-land-animals-using-dna-in-nearby-water-bodies-67481 because, as I've said many times, I think water samples will be the way to go on the basis that what ends up in the water comes from everything living around the water as well as what lives in it. Soil sample are okay but My gut tells me they are limited to something that has passed through a small area. Water on the other hand drains large areas and gets rain runoff. That makes water a natural DNA collector covering a lot of territory.

Edited by hiflier
  • Thanks 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
Twist

Well by needed I mean if we come up with some relatively recent sightings.  I can grab samples from random lakes and waterways no problem but until more funding is available I’m guessing known hotspots or recent activity is front of the line.   

  • Upvote 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
NatFoot
9 minutes ago, Twist said:

Well by needed I mean if we come up with some relatively recent sightings.  I can grab samples from random lakes and waterways no problem but until more funding is available I’m guessing known hotspots or recent activity is front of the line.   

 

This is what I'm talking about. I'm assuming you'd be willing if someone came up with a report an hour or two from you with a BF in a creek with a pretty good idea of where the creek is in an area.

 

I doubt you'd be willing to go into what would be assumed habitat and start sampling random creeks and lakes.

 

IMO - the report list is the first step to making this a realistic project if we want everyone to chip in.

 

I'd be willing to do help as well if we had a report that fit the criteria I laid out above.

  • Upvote 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
norseman

We are going to have to allow Hiflier the time to find a lab willing to do E DNA samples. And enough time to raise the money to pay for the lab. And the chosen lab is going to have to line researchers out on protocol for taking the samples.

 

I think the Go fund me idea is an awesome idea.

 

I personally would like to see samples go through a transparent chain of custody WITH results posted in the end.

 

For example.

 

/////////////////////////////////////


Sample # 2367

Researcher: Bob Smith

Contact info: Address/Phone number

Date: 10-25-20

Location: Pend Oreille River, Lat/Long

Comments: I have recorded audio of whoops in this location before. SSR has reported 3 sightings within a 10 mile radius over the past 5 years.

 

Sample # 2367

Collector: Bill Jones

Contact info: Address/Phone number 

Date: 11-2-20

Lab: Horizon Laboratories Inc. 12345 Pine Ave, Denver, Co 76543

Comments: Sent off Fed Ex ground today.

 

Sample # 2367

Researcher: Bob Smith

Date: 12-16-20

Lab: Horizon Laboratories Inc. 12345 Pine Ave, Denver, Co 76543

Lab Results: Rainbow Trout, Northern Pike, Beaver, Black Bear, Whitetail Deer.

Comments: Did not sequence plant life per request. 
 

///////////////////////////////////////////

 

I think many researchers get disillusioned over the years by sending in samples only to not hear anything back at all. I think in order to keep people engaged people need feedback. Even if it’s not the target species we are looking for. People will feel better about their work if they see results. If this technology is as good as they say it is? Using the grass roots approach? Hundreds of researchers submitting hundreds of samples? Is going to cover a large chunk of real estate fairly quickly. If the beast exists? It cannot hide forever. And anyone can put on some rubber gloves and collect a water sample. It’s not rocket science.

 

We have been stagnate for awhile now. Obviously what I’m doing isn’t working. This would be a new powerful tool for researchers to put in their tool belt. Who knows? We may get lucky!

 

 

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
BlackRockBigfoot
12 minutes ago, NatFoot said:

 

This is what I'm talking about. I'm assuming you'd be willing if someone came up with a report an hour or two from you with a BF in a creek with a pretty good idea of where the creek is in an area.

 

I doubt you'd be willing to go into what would be assumed habitat and start sampling random creeks and lakes.

 

IMO - the report list is the first step to making this a realistic project if we want everyone to chip in.

 

I'd be willing to do help as well if we had a report that fit the criteria I laid out above.

Setting up the region in which a particular member could respond to reports would be helpful.  That way if one of us came across a promising recent report we could direct it to the person who could most likely respond.

 

We are pretty far flung on this forum. That could come in handy.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
NatFoot
1 hour ago, norseman said:

We are going to have to allow Hiflier the time to find a lab willing to do E DNA samples. And enough time to raise the money to pay for the lab. And the chosen lab is going to have to line researchers out on protocol for taking the samples.

 

I think the Go fund me idea is an awesome idea.

 

I personally would like to see samples go through a transparent chain of custody WITH results posted in the end.

 

For example.

 

/////////////////////////////////////


Sample # 2367

Researcher: Bob Smith

Contact info: Address/Phone number

Date: 10-25-20

Location: Pend Oreille River, Lat/Long

Comments: I have recorded audio of whoops in this location before. SSR has reported 3 sightings within a 10 mile radius over the past 5 years.

 

Sample # 2367

Collector: Bill Jones

Contact info: Address/Phone number 

Date: 11-2-20

Lab: Horizon Laboratories Inc. 12345 Pine Ave, Denver, Co 76543

Comments: Sent off Fed Ex ground today.

 

Sample # 2367

Researcher: Bob Smith

Date: 12-16-20

Lab: Horizon Laboratories Inc. 12345 Pine Ave, Denver, Co 76543

Lab Results: Rainbow Trout, Northern Pike, Beaver, Black Bear, Whitetail Deer.

Comments: Did not sequence plant life per request. 
 

///////////////////////////////////////////

 

I think many researchers get disillusioned over the years by sending in samples only to not hear anything back at all. I think in order to keep people engaged people need feedback. Even if it’s not the target species we are looking for. People will feel better about their work if they see results. If this technology is as good as they say it is? Using the grass roots approach? Hundreds of researchers submitting hundreds of samples? Is going to cover a large chunk of real estate fairly quickly. If the beast exists? It cannot hide forever. And anyone can put on some rubber gloves and collect a water sample. It’s not rocket science.

 

We have been stagnate for awhile now. Obviously what I’m doing isn’t working. This would be a new powerful tool for researchers to put in their tool belt. Who knows? We may get lucky!

 

 

 

I agree. If it got that serious, I'd imagine we would need to move that to the private/premium part of the forum.

 

Really like your additional suggestions though.

Link to post
Share on other sites
gigantor

@hiflier

 

Lets figure out the details and procedures first. We'll figure out the money part later, I'll help with that.

  • Thanks 1
  • Upvote 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...