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Think Like A Hoaxer

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xspider1
BFF Donor

hahaa! Even the three stooges could have planned a hoax better than Roger did!! :o

Now I know you will never admit it, but it makes perfect sense to keep Bob in the dark on anything that's verifiable.

That is so funny! Keep BH in the dark but give him the suit to take back home where you know that he's probably going straight to the bar to "tell stories and make out like they <he> was really somethin'"?? Really, parn? Really? Can you explain why BH, or anyone in the world if asked to put on a Bigfoot suit would not at least ask 'Where did you get this?' crickets... Evidently BH didn't wonder about that, even though it would have been a Class AAA Bigfoot suit, if it had ever been one.

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SweatyYeti

Yeti! you gave me a haddock! laughing so much!

Glad to hear that, wonder! :D

The Stooges were great...and Heironimus' "confession" fits right in, with their comedy!

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SweatyYeti

hahaa! Even the three stooges could have planned a hoax better than Roger did!! :o

I bet Curly would have produced a more believable "confession" that Heironimus has come up with, xspider. :) He probably would have been clever enough to invent something more than just...."That's Perfect!"....for things that Roger supposedly said.

Actually, just imagining... :rolleyes: ...Curly may have said something like this....regarding Roger's words...."After I did the Bigfoot walk, Roger said to me "That's perfect....that's all we need....woo WOO WOO WOO WOO WOO WOO woo woo......woo..."

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kitakaze

hahaa! Even the three stooges could have planned a hoax better than Roger did!! :o

That is so funny! Keep BH in the dark but give him the suit to take back home where you know that he's probably going straight to the bar to "tell stories and make out like they <he> was really somethin'"?? Really, parn? Really? Can you explain why BH, or anyone in the world if asked to put on a Bigfoot suit would not at least ask 'Where did you get this?' crickets... Evidently BH didn't wonder about that, even though it would have been a Class AAA Bigfoot suit, if it had ever been one.

Bolded above is a quote taken out of context of an important conversation between Les Johnson of Yakima and Greg Long. Here is the original context...

Les Johnson (MoB, p. 47-48)...

"I was in the Idle Hour Tavern in Wiley City. There were 15 or 20 guys, some of the guys that hung around with Roger. These guys were drinkin' and talkin' about things they had been doin'. Bob Heironimus said that in the back of his Buick - he had a blue Buick - was an ape suit, or a suit. They were talking about this suit. Someone says, 'What are you talkin' about?' And someone said, 'Go look in the back of Bob's Buick.' The guys were teasing each other about it. There were lots of guys who sat around and talked about it" I probed deeper his memories of this event. He recalled among the onlookers grouped around Heironimus' car were the Ridge Runners, members of a jeep club. Johnson was either walking toward to the tavern or leaving it. "I heard them talkin' when I went by. They were laughin' and gigglin'. They were makin' fun about this suit, like, 'We're going to fool everybody.' I mean I got that opinion. But you couldn't fool us. We all lived here." He chuckled and then added: "The 'monkey suit' is what they called it. There's four Heironimus boys. Bob. And Bill. Bill worked for me for a while. Then there's Howard and Mike. The Idle Hour Tavern's where we'd go to congregate, lie to each other, and tell these big stories and try to make out like we was somethin'."

Bolded in that excerpt of the Johnson interview are some extremely important details when compared with other witness testimony. It's important to note that when allowed to be seen in the original context, we can see that Johnson is expressing derision for the notion that the community of Yakima could be fooled by a Bigfoot hoax. Here are some major details that help confirm that the Idle Hour incident was in fact an actual event...

- Les Johnson was not a personal friend of Bob Heironimus', yet he talks about something that allows us to pinpoint the event - he mentions the Buick, the blue Buick. Only once has Heironimus had a suit in the back of a blue Buick and that is the suit found by Bob's mother in the back of her blue Buick then handled by her and two other family members.

A blue '67 Buick...

114370121_836062bbfa.jpg?v=0

- Les Johnson mentions the presence of the Ridge Runners jeep club. Massively important in corroborating this testimony is that in a separate interview with former Ridge Runner jeep club member and owner of the Circle Inn Tavern Merle Warehime says that he was present when the suit was shown in the back of a car in a box when they were about to go jeeping (MoB, p. 331).

Now here is a relevant portion of my interview with another eyewitness to the Idle Hour event, Gary Record...

KK: Let me ask you about something different, if I may. I want to ask about Bob going down to California and doing the movie. Did you see Bob right after he returned?

GR: Yes, I did. Just when he come back. He showed me the suit. Wanted to show me what it looked like.

KK: And where was this?

GR: It was in Wiley City at one of the watering holes there. There were two of them.

KK: Was that the Idle Hour Tavern?

GR: I think so, yeah. Or it was the other one.

KK: And what time of day was it when Bob showed you the suit. Was it day or night?

GR: I'd say it was about 9:00 pm at night or around there.

KK: And how may times have you seen that suit?

GR: Just the one time.

KK You never saw Bob with a suit again?

GR: No.

KK: Do you know how long he had it?

GR: I think they came and got it the next day just after that.

KK: Patterson and Gimlin, you mean.

GR: That's right.

KK: Have you ever heard any rumours of Bob Heironimus being in Yakima or any other place in a Bigfoot suit other than the one time in Bluff Creek?

GR: No, I haven't.

Note that Gary Record testified that the suit was taken the day after he saw it at the Idle Hour. Now compare with the bolded part below from my interview with yet another witness to the Idle Hour event...

Notes from my July 2010 interview with Howard Heironimus...

I have been swamped today with work. Posting all of my interview with Howard Heironimus will take time I don't have in the next 48 hours. I will toss some nuggets from that interview in handy point form...

- HH has no idea what the dead read horse thing was. Did not even slightly register. It did not come from him.

- HH saw the suit twice. Once in the back of Opal's Buick along with Gary Record and a few other people parked beside the bottle shack in the parking lot of the Idle Hour Tavern. Once at Opal's house. It was taken away one or two days after Bob returned from Bluff Creek.

- HH met Bob Gimlin before Roger Patterson did.

- HH characterizes Bob Gimlin and Roger Patterson as having been inseparable and united in a drive to get rich.

- HH used to live with Bruce Mondor and his sister Patty Mondor (Patterson) before Roger married her. Bruce and HH were best friends. HH first met Roger when he would come to see Patty Mondor. HH liked him because they were both cowboys, as he described.

- Roger came to HH in late '66 or early '67 and asked him to be a part of a movie about Bigfoot so they could make money.

- Roger asked HH if his brother Bob would be interested in being the Bigfoot. HH told Roger to ask Bob himself. Roger had Gimlin ask BH. HH said it was before BH and BG would go riding together in the hills around Yakima.

- HH and BH met Gimlin when he was a bartender at place beside ****'s Cigar Store. I may have misheard the "****'s" part.

- Roger and Pat Patterson moved into HH and BH's grandfather's home which was bought by Willis Mondor, Pat's dad.

- HH at Roger's home watched him make fake prints using casts he had and one foot-shaped stomper in the soil of the garden at his home. He wood use various weighted objects to impress the casts and foot. This matches Jerry Merritt's description of finding left foot only prints in the soil of the garden beside his home that he suspected Roger had faked to get his interest in Bigfoot.

- HH said Roger shaved the manes of his ponies to remove cockleburs. Roger never mentioned using pony hair for a suit. Roger had no suit when they started filming Bigfoot in early '67.

- HH described Bob Gimlin as being a smooth-talker and wheeler-dealer. He said Bob did not later in Yakima have a bad reputation.

- HH said that often when he and/or BH would see Roger at the Idle Hour after the PGF was shot that Roger would be drinking wine and promise that money was coming. Roger promised BH $1000 for wearing the suit but to all the men in his Bigfoot movie he never specified the amount he was supposed to give them.

- The only time BH borrowed Opal's Buick was for the trip to California. Both BH and HH had their own cars.

- There were four Heironimus brothers. One died in a car accident many decades ago. The other never had any involvement in Roger's Bigfoot ventures.

- HH said that every man in the cowboy photo were Roger's main friends until BH went to Bluff Creek. After that Roger cycled through a number of people that he used for promoting the film and each in turn got sick of Roger.

- HH said that Roger and Bob Gimlin remained partners until Roger died and then Pat Patterson took over the film.

- HH never knew Al DeAtley.

Finally, from interview with Opal Heironimus, Bob's mother, regarding her handling the suit...

Late that night after she saw the suit, Patterson and Gimlin dropped off Chico and took the suit. "It disappeared," Opal recalled. "I never seen it leave, and I do remember them comin' in with a horse in a green truck and Bob's horse, Chico." Patterson and Gimlin were able to retrieve the suit from the trunk because, she speculated, she must have left her keys in either the trunk lock or the ignition, a common practice in those days when one trusted one's neighbour. She did remember seeing the scratch on her car when she and her sister Myrtle were out in the orchard next to the car. MoB, p. 365

- Opal confirms along with my interview with Howard and Gary that the suit was taken the day after Bob returned from California.

- Opal confirms that there were two, not three horses.

- Opal confirms seeing the scratch put on her brand new car Bob said was from the buck brush when the Buick had to be hidden during the time Heironimus was at Bluff Creek.

The green truck she was referring to is this truck, Gimlin's horse truck...

89614c840a9562802.jpg

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kitakaze
In fact, BH seems to distance himself from the Morris claim altogether.

XS, on what facts do you base this opinion that BH seems to distance himself from the Morris claim altogether. For if that is an opinion based in reality, odd, then, that Heironimus would agree to do an interview in which he and Morris defend their claims...

Odd, also, in my interviews with Heironimus that he referred me to Phil Morris for details about the suit.

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Guest Kerchak

The Stooges were great...and Heironimus' "confession" fits right in, with their comedy!

Forget the Stooges. It fits more in with Laurel and Hardy:

4456555674_0b22234297_z.jpg

Is that Bob H clearing the bush so he can hide his car? :lol:

Edited by Kerchak

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SweatyYeti

Note the License plate on the Blue Buick... :lol: ...

TitanicBuick.jpg

Sorry to sink your ship, kit... :) ...

BobPattyArmProportionComp5.jpg

(My apologies to wolftrax.....before I 'altered' the brightness level of the image....the license plate actually read....."Bob was Patty". I'm ashamed of myself.)

Edited by SweatyYeti
  • Upvote 1

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SweatyYeti

Forget the Stooges. It fits more in with Laurel and Hardy:

4456555674_0b22234297_z.jpg

Is that Bob H clearing the bush so he can hide his car? :lol:

Wow...nice Gorilla Suit image, Kerchak....it has almost as much distinctive 'body contour' as Patty does!! :lol:

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xspider1
BFF Donor

XS, on what facts do you base this opinion that BH seems to distance himself from the Morris claim altogether.

I guess I get that impression based on the following:

If Anyone were asked to wear a Bigfoot costume for a movie then, I can't imagine that person not wondering and inquiring as to where that Bigfoot costume came from, especially if it were an exceptionally good costume. Well, evidently, BH never asked Roger anything like that, even though he had ample opportunity to do so. Don't you find that to be odd?

Also, in the radio show you linked to above, I didn't hear any type of response that concerned Phil and BH together which gave any indication that BH believes Phil at all. Nothing. BH referred you to Phil for specifics about the suit? That's understandable if BH himself could not provide any real specifics. Obviously, if that were a suit (highly unlikely, imo) then it would had to have been extremely modified from anything that started off as a Morris costume gorilla suit. Yet, neither BH nor Phil say anything that sounds right in regard to that. Bob says there was a mask made out of horse hide, etc. and Phil and Amy instantly recognized Patty as being one of their suits when they saw it on tv? Nah, I realy doubt all that.

Edited by xspider1

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Guest LAL

Wow...nice Gorilla Suit image, Kerchak....it has almost as much distinctive 'body contour' as Patty does!! :lol:

More, even. Look at those calves! The garters seem a bit out of place, though. Oh, wait............that's Ollie.:wacko:

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Guest

Think Like A Hoaxer. well BH would not even blip on the radar! Parnassus would have you believe it was more like central park than a remote area,and kit fills up the board with random speculations.

BH. would last in court 30secs. and the other two less.Long writes a book that is so full of miss info and leading testimony it's like a comic. fits in all this with making RP out to be a lair and cheat and discounts that if it's not what he wants He bends.

a guy that makes successfully carnival suits, See's a suit on TV and jumps on the band wagon! sure he is! that makes good sense. sells more suits. no proof it's one of "His" but there you go.

but thinking like a hoaxer,one that would pass this of as a true account,would YOU do such?

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xspider1
BFF Donor

Those are good observations, justwonder. Thanks! :)

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kitakaze

I guess I get that impression based on the following:

If Anyone were asked to wear a Bigfoot costume for a movie then, I can't imagine that person not wondering and inquiring as to where that Bigfoot costume came from, especially if it were an exceptionally good costume. Well, evidently, BH never asked Roger anything like that, even though he had ample opportunity to do so. Don't you find that to be odd?

I find it non sequitur to the notion of yours that BH seems to distance himself from the Morris claim altogether.

Also, in the radio show you linked to above, I didn't hear any type of response that concerned Phil and BH together which gave any indication that BH believes Phil at all. Nothing. BH referred you to Phil for specifics about the suit? That's understandable if BH himself could not provide any real specifics. Obviously, if that were a suit (highly unlikely, imo) then it would had to have been extremely modified from anything that started off as a Morris costume gorilla suit. Yet, neither BH nor Phil say anything that sounds right in regard to that. Bob says there was a mask made out of horse hide, etc. and Phil and Amy instantly recognized Patty as being one of their suits when they saw it on tv? Nah, I realy doubt all that.

How much of that radio show did you listen to? The specifics Bob Heironimus provided me regarding the suit in our interviews can be found by googling him and I. "Bob Heironimus Kitakaze interview" will get you right to it. There is no disregarding that Heironimus and Morris differed in their accounts of the suit. Differing accounts doesn't mean that Heironimus distances himself from the Morris claim altogether as is your opinion. Nor does Bob change his account to fit Phil's.

If Bob distances himself altogether from Phil's claim as you suggest, these then would be evidence of not succeeding in the attempt...

BigFootFlyer.jpg

page2_13.jpg

Bob-Heironimus.jpg

That is not a man distancing himself from Morris' claim altogether. In fact, the polar opposite is evident.

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Guest Kerchak

^

So Bob H sinks down with the Morris Titanic then?

P.S) Every time I see that lardy Ewok suit it gives me a such a chuckle.

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