The Sykes / Sartori Report - Oxford-Lausanne Collateral Hominid Project

[Cotter]

^ Bears are neither strange nor undocumented, roaming near human settlements or not. They are generally large and hairy creatures, so I guess you have that part right.

The bear being discussed sure was.

 

Oh, also, there are documented cases of hairy primates as well.  I can post some pics if you like!  :-)

 

@Darrell - I'll start worrying about the Sykes stuff becoming a Ketchum fiasco when Sykes starts posting about Angels, Habituation, Mind-Raping, and Annunaki on his FB page.

 

Edited for clarificatoin and add'l comments.

Edited October 21, 2013 by Cotter

[Guest Stan Norton]

The one being discussed sure was.

Ha. Yes. Apparently a polar bear, known only from a jawbone from Svalbard and dated to the pleistocene and now found to be roaming at both ends of the Himalayas is run of the mill.

[Guest Darrell]

I can see the lines in the sand being similar as far as pattern and form but Sykes is not making empty promises , he is credible and scientific, to me you made it sound comparative of Sykes to Ketchum.   If that was not your intention I understand now.  Thank you for your explanation.

 

Also I would like to add that I never put all my eggs in 1 basket,  I do not rely on others to prove something for me , I get out there and do the field work my self to try and bring the truth to the surface.   

We can talk on and on about how credible Sykes is but he is making money off of this just like Ketchum was trying to and that makes me very skeptical of all of it.

[Cotter]

Ha. Yes. Apparently a polar bear, known only from a jawbone from Svalbard and dated to the pleistocene and now found to be roaming at both ends of the Himalayas is run of the mill.

 

I guess it happens all the time.

[Guest Stan Norton]

I guess it happens all the time.

Must do. Apes though? Pure fantasy.

[Guest Llawgoch]

Ha. Yes. Apparently a polar bear, known only from a jawbone from Svalbard and dated to the pleistocene and now found to be roaming at both ends of the Himalayas is run of the mill.

 

The hypothesis is simply that this bear is ancestral to the supposed bear.  As they pointed out in the programme, bear genetics is very murky, and some people still don't hold that the brown bear and the polar bear are entirely separate species.  What the hypothetical bear looks like is anybody's guess.  All we were told is that Reinhold Messner thinks it is a bear that looks not hugely dissimilar to the normal brown bears but behaves somewhat differently, while a specimen stuffed by amateurs in a remote village 40 years ago looked a bit odd.

[Guest Darrell]

Ha. Yes. Apparently a polar bear, known only from a jawbone from Svalbard and dated to the pleistocene and now found to be roaming at both ends of the Himalayas is run of the mill.

Im pretty sure Sykes said it could be a decendant or hybrid of a decendant of the bear, not that there was a species of polar bear that excaped extinction from the pleistocene era and still lives today undetected in the Himalayas. If I have Neanderthal DNA I would be considered a decendant of Neanderthal but that doesnt mean that a race of Neanderthals are living unchanged somewhere.

 a specimen stuffed by amateurs in a remote village 40 years ago looked a bit odd.

If that is the bear shot by the German SS expedition to the Himalayas it would have to be almost 75 yrs ago. 

[Guest Llawgoch]

It's not.  It's one that we have some hairs from.  Apparently the stuffed bear itself is in a remote village that even the Frenchman who supplied the hairs isn't sure he can get to, and has sworn not to reveal the location of.

 

Not the best provenance.

[Guest Stan Norton]

Im pretty sure Sykes said it could be a decendant or hybrid of a decendant of the bear, not that there was a species of polar bear that excaped extinction from the pleistocene era and still lives today undetected in the Himalayas. If I have Neanderthal DNA I would be considered a decendant of Neanderthal but that doesnt mean that a race of Neanderthals are living unchanged somewhere.

If that is the bear shot by the German SS expedition to the Himalayas it would have to be almost 75 yrs ago.

He said the DNA from the hairs was a 100% match to that from the pleistocene jawbone. It is to all intents and purposes a polar bear. I think he stated tat it was unlikely to merely be a polar/brown hybrid. Chances are it is pheotypically different from either.

Messner was not clear in this show what it was he saw. Think he said it was a 'figure' or 'being'. This is a guy who managed to lose eight toes so is he that observant?

[Guest]

^

The 100% match is not the entire genome, rather it is a small section of the mtDNA that matches.

[Cotter]

Well, all things considered, I think we can all agree that it will be interesting if we ever get to see a specimen, alive or dead.

[Guest Urkelbot]

Is there a list of all the DNA samples tested with descriptions explaining why they were thought to be from Bigfoot/yeti.

[MarkGlasgow]

Is there a list of all the DNA samples tested with descriptions explaining why they were thought to be from Bigfoot/yeti.

Think we may have to wait for the book or the paper for the detail.

[southernyahoo]

Im pretty sure Sykes said it could be a decendant or hybrid of a decendant of the bear, not that there was a species of polar bear that excaped extinction from the pleistocene era and still lives today undetected in the Himalayas. If I have Neanderthal DNA I would be considered a decendant of Neanderthal but that doesnt mean that a race of Neanderthals are living unchanged somewhere.

If that is the bear shot by the German SS expedition to the Himalayas it would have to be almost 75 yrs ago. 

 

I'm assuming Sykes has sequenced a small portion of mtDNA to make his match, which could mean the bear donor was from an isolated population. It would be a match to a modern polar bear or brown bear if a modern hybrid. Why it would be unchanged from a common ancestor 40k years ago is a good question. Changes do accumulate in the mtDNA over time.

 

 If I have Neanderthal DNA I would be considered a decendant of Neanderthal but that doesnt mean that a race of Neanderthals are living unchanged somewhere.

 

It depends on whether you were a match 100% across the entire mitochondria. If you had the same mtDNA, all 16.5k bases, they might not have a choice but to say Neanderthals still walk the earth, because the maternal lineage would be entirely in tact.

[Guest DWA]

Well, reading this

 

http://www.latinospost.com/articles/30052/20131018/yeti-bear-mystery-himalayan-yetis-bigfoot-relative-ancient-polar-bears.htm

 

I'm tempted to conclude that anybody who's interested in this topic is gonna be interested in what we eventually find out, ape or not.

 

I'm still thinking reports of yeti don't say bear.

^{Question, though.}

 

^{"...the samples perfectly matched with a DNA sample from a polar bear, which lived on earth more than ten thousand years ago."  [snipsnip sorry for the formatting]}

 

 

^{"There's more work to be done on interpreting the results. I don't think it means there are ancient polar bears wandering around the Himalayas," Sykes said... "But we can speculate what the possible explanation might be. It could be there is a subspecies of brown bear in the High Himalayas descended from the bear that was the ancestor to the polar bear."}

 

^{If the samples match perfectly, isn't one exactly the other?}

 

Isn't a polar bear a polar bear?

 

Actually, the more I think about this, the more likely it is to me that either yeti is what it's reputed to be...or this bear is so weird that when it's confirmed, we'll say, well, that's it, isn't it? and be done.  It's about as silly to see a bear and think ape in the Himalaya as it is in North America.

Edited October 22, 2013 by DWA