Guest thermalman Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) All witnesses to an event do not see the same details. That's just a true fact. Perception, state of mind, and memory are just a few variables that are worth mentioning. Edited October 30, 2014 by thermalman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Hello HRP...yeah, I didn't attach much signifigance to my getting spooked. If I had to say though, I'd be willing to wager it was a lion, possibly stalking me or at least being interested. I've hear way too many people relate stories of having had that feeling before actually spotting a cat, or a cat track. We are very well adapted animals, and sensing a predator is hard-wired into our brains. Need proof? Your genes still extant in the world! What's up WSA? Your post makes sense although I am not in *cat* country. Just rely on your senses. If you get that creepy feeling then something is probably up. Eyewitness reports are unreliable. Memory is unreliable. Most reports are mis-identifications or outright fraud. So, with all the problems surrounding memory and eyewitness accounts, all of which are legitimate, the outliers like Salurious' encounter are what keeps me interested in this subject. MNSkeptic Can't *hang* with you there brother. Especially regarding the *outright fraud* statement. With that, you probably insulted a large portion of our membership. I look at it like this...Some are probably mis-identifications but not outright fraud. Why in the world would someone who has had an experience, and seeks to relate it, perpetuate *outright fraud*? It isn't worth the abuse one receives to do so IMHO. I feel like I say this ad nauseum, but folks who relate personal experiences, for the most part, are good and credible people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Crowlogic Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 What's up WSA? Your post makes sense although I am not in *cat* country. Just rely on your senses. If you get that creepy feeling then something is probably up. Can't *hang* with you there brother. Especially regarding the *outright fraud* statement. With that, you probably insulted a large portion of our membership. I look at it like this...Some are probably mis-identifications but not outright fraud. Why in the world would someone who has had an experience, and seeks to relate it, perpetuate *outright fraud*? It isn't worth the abuse one receives to do so IMHO. I feel like I say this ad nauseum, but folks who relate personal experiences, for the most part, are good and credible people. It is possible that people make up sightings in order to gain membership in the club so to speak. To be an insider in a rarity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIB Posted October 30, 2014 Moderator Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) It is possible that people make up sightings in order to gain membership in the club so to speak. To be an insider in a rarity. It cuts both ways. It is equally possible that people scoff at sightings in order to gain membership in another club "so to speak." To stand with a crowd rather than risk standing out. MIB Edited October 30, 2014 by MIB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DWA Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) I'll just echo WSA's post, and add to it for the benefit of the OP that Bindernagel's books are a good place to start for a Cliff version of the consistency in reports. He goes well beyond "big hairy and bipedal" to note numerous congruencies in the reports with morphological and behavioral data on the known apes, this from people with virtually zero experience with apes. But nothing but nothing beats leavening that read with a read of the reports themselves. As WSA notes, when I started reading the scientific proponents I simply received corroboration of my basic suspicions from reading the reports and extension of my understanding from their applied expertise. If one isn't devoting the effort, one isn't gonna reap the benefits. All there is to it. Edited October 30, 2014 by DWA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DWA Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) Oh, and MIB? Your club makes a whole lot more sense than Crowlogic's. A basic understanding of human nature, all that's needed to understand that the club of 'worldly' scoffers is one where almost all of us feel far more comfortable than the club of 'nuts.' As judged, incorrectly of course, by the society, now. And as to the allegation that most reports are misrepresentations or outright fraud: afraid one needs evidence for that. There is none. Nor is there for fear being a primary factor allowing dismissal of most reports. One would have to ask, for those in which the witness did express fear, what, other than what the witness says the witness saw, might possibly engender that. And one would have no evidence for one's response. It's an armchair toss-off, a wave of the hand, and invalid here. Edited October 30, 2014 by DWA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Crow Logic - I don't buy the idea people make up encounters to join a club ... People of all socio-economic strata are left with feelings of trauma ... some even feel victimized by their experiences, who believe it was of no choice of their won. Some will carry those experiences from childhood into adulthood. Reading some of the postings here I would have difficulty pointing out anyone lacking self esteem and personal insecurity that would cause them create tales for the sake of joining the club. We may read the reports of witnesses but what we don't see when the phone disconnects and the door is closed are the sleepless nights, the anxiety they experience and yes, fear too! Some carry guilt and feel cursed for what they encountered. Politicians, law enforcement officers, business owners and generally accepted people of high notoriety have witnessed "sightings," but fewer accept as a fun experience. We don't hear about those encounters associated with their place in life because its easier to ruin and stifle the message than admitting it is so. Few would find pleasure in running a gauntlet of battering ridicule for reporting something that memorable in that in their life, and I simply cannot believe that it occurs as often as one may believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyO Posted October 30, 2014 SSR Team Share Posted October 30, 2014 It is possible that people make up sightings in order to gain membership in the club so to speak. To be an insider in a rarity. Definitely and that would also point towards mental issues which I think are far too common within people that are interested and are active in this subject. It cuts both ways. It is equally possible that people scoff at sightings in order to gain membership in another club "so to speak." To stand with a crowd rather than risk standing out. MIB Then of course theres this too. Like soooo many things in this world, the truth is normally somewhere in the middle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 BobbyO Lol! Phew ... That was enough to make a man swallow his chew! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Crowlogic Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 It cuts both ways. It is equally possible that people scoff at sightings in order to gain membership in another club "so to speak." To stand with a crowd rather than risk standing out. MIB There is a population of people believing in Petrasours (flying dinosaurs) . They present fantastic descriptions and encounters supposedly with these things. However the stretch of logic and abandonment science of earth requires a walk on the lunatic fringe. Yet the people are sincere and can seem credible. But can anyone actually take it seriously? I can't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyO Posted October 30, 2014 SSR Team Share Posted October 30, 2014 BobbyO Lol! Phew ... That was enough to make a man swallow his chew! Haha, it's true though.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MNskeptic Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 MNSkeptic Can't *hang* with you there brother. Especially regarding the *outright fraud* statement. With that, you probably insulted a large portion of our membership. Well, that wasn't my intent (insult). If you read the first line of the second paragraph, this was intended to put context to the first paragraph, which was intended to paraphrase what one commonly hears from non-believers and scoffers who hear of sighting reports. Apologies for poor writing that didn't convey too well what I had intended to communicate. MNSkeptic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DWA Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) I did have to come back to have a chuckle at "insider in a rarity." Maybe it's time for me to come clean on my unicorn sighting. I'm now the ultimate insider (and if you don't believe me go Google the unicorn database). Please gang. Fact is no one on this broad continent wants to be that, including you me the people we know and the people they know. That's the ultimate wave-of-hand, what evidence me evidence? dismissal. I can understand given this why habituators don't feel any need to provide people bearing that attitude with proof. Edited October 31, 2014 by DWA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 very few modern people have no experience with apes. Most of us have seen them on tv or the internet or read about them in books or magazines. That information is a plausible source of ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DWA Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Naah, no it's not. Ask anyone with all that experience with apes what one looks like. The difference between that experience and sasquatch sightings is that people in the latter case aren't describing an ape. They are describing a thing that they saw, that to them has no name because to them it wasn't real, so here's the thing I saw. Again, toss-off "explanations" do nothing without an effort to at least figure out why people are coming forward to say this. Do we accept scientists' toss-off explanations for what stuff is? No. We and their peers need to see their evidence. Once again. Someone has to show me why the scientists vouching for these people don't accept all these waves of hand. If you can't: Them (and my read, and the results of my thinking about this) over you, simple as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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