Campsite Destroyed

[Bonehead74]

You don't arrive at 'truth' by repressing and repelling.

How about the winnowing process that is the stripping away of non-truths?

 

 

We all know that being a control freak is not healthy, and that's all that the campaign against hoaxing is: a desperate attempt to control. Leave people be. They're not hurting anyone. They only hurt our pride...

If I didn't know that you truly believe what you said there, I might have been offended. 

A campaign against hoaxing is a manifestation of a desire for honesty and transparency.

 

...and pride is not our most precious resource. Almost anything else is more deserving of protection than pride.

Agreed.

Always focus on what you want, not on what you don't want. What you want then flourishes, and everything else dies away.

I want the truth.

[LeafTalker]

I want the truth.

 

Which “truth†do you want?

 

Do you want to know whether Bigfoot truly exists, and if so, what Bigfoot is like?

 

Or do you want to know whether Person A did -- or did not -- have the experience Person A says he did?

 

Do you see the difference between those things? One is big, and the other is very, very small.

 

Why are you going after a small, insignificant truth? Why do you care about Person A? Knowing whether Person A did (or did not) do something (or see or hear or experience something) tells you nothing about the subject of Bigfoot. It only tells you about Person A.

 

There is no piece of information about Bigfoot that’s known to only one person. Many people have seen tracks. Many people have smelled strong odors in the woods. Many people have seen eye glow. Many people have heard (and recorded) howls and calls. Many people have heard wood knocks. Many people have heard speech in known human languages. Many people have heard speech in unknown languages. Many people have received gifts. Many people have seen BF with animals. Many people have heard mindspeak. Many people have seen BF vanish into, or appear out of, thin air.

 

Many people have even seen a BF.

 

So there is no single person whose testimony is more important than anyone else’s. Therefore, there is no reason to try to establish who is “lying†and who is telling the truth. It’s a meaningless exercise.

 

Again, if there were a single individual who was saying something that nobody else had ever said before, then it might make more sense to try to establish whether that single individual was telling the truth. But that will never be the case, and therefore, it’s a waste of time to try to establish who is trustworthy and who isn’t.

 

So, getting back to the truth thing: If you want to know the truth about BF, and if you think other people are so untrustworthy that they have to be subjected to some kind of vetting process before their information about BF can be believed (which we just established is nonsensical, because that information is widely available from many sources) – then you have only one choice. And your one choice is to go out into the woods and get the information yourself.

 

That’s the only responsible way of getting the “truthâ€. Otherwise, you risk making terrible mistakes: accusing innocent people of wrongdoing and frightening others into silence. 

[SWWASAS]

There is a huge difference between a sighting report and what's happened with Sasquatch Chronicles. They've gone from featuring sighting reports to a whole new level of claims.

In short, if they are to be believed, they are the authorities in all the different types of Sasquatch. All of these animals are dangerous. The government has a dedicated team of people that cover up any Sasquatch incidents and have been doing so for a long time. In fact, these government agents also listen to the show. These agents have focused on suppressing Bob Garret and harass him, his team and his family. If not for these agents, they would have video and other proof of these creatures.

While I agree that Sasquatch are potentially dangerous, I don't believe them to be as dangerous as these people claim.

I have also looked at Bob Garrets experience and research. Only recently has he made these extraordinary claims. He has not always told stories like these. What changed? When did he go from being a run of the mill BF researcher to a guy that has tons of dangerous encounters with BFs and secret agents?

These are extraordinary claims, way beyond what other researchers have experienced. Maybe I'm behind the times. Have other people here had run ins with these federal BF agents? I mean direct run ins and not stories from other people.

 

 

You comments got me thinking.   Lets set up a hypothetical situation and see how it might play out.     You are a couple of guys that at some point have an authentic encounter.     You talk it up and start a radio show.     Well you might get one show out of your experience and then what?    You retell it a couple of times,  do some embellishment to add details and fill in some time and get all the play out of it you can.      Then you start extra ordinary claims related to your experience and others to spice up the show.    Missing people, empty tents, etc.    You can only talk about one experience so much.       A couple of bozo's who do not identify themselves show up.    They claim or imply they might be federal agents to get you to talk but are actually they are bigfoot researchers who want to know what you know or perhaps don't believe you and want to expose your claims as fiction and make some sort of name for themselves.        You talk about this human encounter on your radio show and claim that these are federal agents.      NSA monitors pick up your claims about federal agents and it peaks their interest.      They send out inquiries to other agencies and ask if they have had dealings with these radio show guys.     No one has, because it never happened, but agencies normally do not exchange much information and one or more agencies wonder what is going on that interests other federal agencies.    So one or more agencies start poking around, trying to figure out what is going on with these radio guys.    Nothing has really happened previously, but now there is a low level investigation.     You pick up on this,  perhaps notice someone following or sitting out in front watching,   talk about it on the air, and any other agencies not already involved get interested and wonder if their turf is being tread on or they are being cut out of something that should rightfully be theirs.     Phones may be tapped, you get paranoid, talk about it more on the air, and it all escalates out of control.   Nothing has anything directly to do with BF,  it is all because you publically accused federal agencies of investigating you.    

 

 I would say that the best way to get federal agency interest directed at one's self, is claim that it has already happened on the air.  Is that is what is going on here?    

[Airdale]

Here is the link to the YouTube page with the Video Wes made in February of this year of the location of his sighting.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNiAkxEhv6c#t=42

 

Below are two snips I captured from the video showing the road in both directions. They appear to match SW's photos from the site, though apparently from a different point on the road. The mountains in the background appear to match, taking into account the obvious difference in focal length of the lenses. It is also obviously not on Yacolt Mountain as can be seen on Google Earth, as Yacolt Mountain stands by itself, with Bell Mountain to the SE being the closest neighbor.

 

 

 

One of the episodes, I'm still trying to find it, mentions an encounter by a man on Yacolt / Muppet Mountain. Here is a link to a "Bigfoot Hotspot Radio" (the original title of Sasquatch Chronicles) Facebook page with photos from Muppet Mountain.

 

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.330608763708405.1073741829.326109887491626&type=3

 

The one below looks more like the area in the video and SW's photos. 

 

 

This brings me back to the possibility of a confusion in place names. Possibly SW could shed some light on "Muppet Mountain"?

Edited April 15, 2015 by Airdale

[Guest]

Here is the video of WASRT investigation into Wes and Woody's sighting. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFvnFuwenvQ

[Airdale]

Thanks Skyla. The areas in the videos and SW's photos all seem to match up. The location discrepancy still appears to be in the place names. For anyone using Google Earth to look at the site of the GPS coordinates provided by Wes, the clearest view is the imagery taken on 7/18/2010. Click on the clock icon for historic imagery, then click once on the arrow at the left end of the slider in the upper left hand corner of the screen to find that date. Below is an overview of the area with the yellow balloon marking the exact coordinates.

 

 

Below is a wider overview showing the encounter site to the lower right and the actual Yacolt Mountain on the upper left.

 

Edited April 15, 2015 by Airdale

[Guest]

I’ll make it easy and share this much. There are reasons for everything. Sometimes we cannot see the answer we are looking for or find the results we want but there are reasons. I came from a small town before moving to a big city and going to college. I remembered a Bigfoot encounter that occurred in that small town about 50 years ago. I was a young boy Bigfoot was beyond my comprehension but I remembered it as being referred to as a monster, just as those gentlemen on SC podcast referred to it.

 

The first sighting public ever heard about was a claim that a monster allegedly attacked a young 16-year old girl and her mother leaving the girl badly bruised and the mother hysterical on some dark two bit country road late at night. The country road was literally out my back door. I don't remember it ever being referred to as Bigfoot, just a monster. As I said that was about fifty years ago, and since that time I read the witness description over and again. The description identical in every way to what we commonly know today yet, it was long before computers or Bigfoot was widely known so how could somebody know these details and more if this was all a hoax I wondered to myself...

 

Nevertheless a few years ago, I took the time to ferret out what information and details I could as any good private investigator could. I called in favors with a few people in a position to help and pulled together as much information and details about an incident.  I was appalled by the way these two females were treated in public. They were relentlessly ridiculed and mocked and called crazy and a liar. I mean who couldn’t sift through that information and not be humbled by the public rebuke suffered by these two people for no reason other than reporting what they claim they encountered.

 

There is no doubt in my mind what they experienced was real.

 

The town, business and politics were taken by surprise by the report, everybody was and it plainly obvious even the authorities were a bit taken back by the initial reports. Something had to be done by hook or by crook. In my opinion unfortunately the sword falls on the naïve and unsophisticated and the witnesses from a small town happen to fill the bill. From that point forward I believe it destroyed their spirit.

 

My sympathies grew as I began to look at the lone surviving party in the incident, the 16-year old girl who is now an aging grandmother. Can you imagine going through your teenage years and graduating class under such relentless ridicule?  Growing up in a small town is difficult enough never mind the stigma of the monster claim. So they spend their lives as I see it always trying to live that down, moving away changing your name or living the life in recluse. 

 

That’s exactly how I seen a 16-year-old and her mother confronting an onslaught of unremitting criticism proven by the fact of following the news articles and the need for several aliases. It wasn’t right then and it is certainly not good now.

 

Me, I have special place in my heart for people like that, that is, I never met the woman or her mother or grandparents though, and they all passed some time back as I understand it. I do feel sympathy for her and I will always empathize with her and what her mother and grandparents must have endured.  No peace, no rest. Therefore, it’s been my personal mission to change the attitude of ridiculing and mockery of Bigfoot victims where ever I can... and that's why you should too. 

 

After seeing what those poor women went through, one young girl now an old grandma and how it led to inexorable life changing events, I cannot and will not ever admit in public what I’ve experienced!  Quite frankly I don’t care what I may say in pseudo name and neither should anyone else, I will not publicly admit to is my association to Bigfoot but to a very few family members. When I say in public I do mean placing a name and face to the claim. I’ve been a lot of places and seen a lot of things and I am not a stupid man either.  I know where the landmines are and staking a claim of Bigfoot is one where I only go privately. In spite of where I’ve been or done I draw the line here with Bigfoot. There are reasons for what I say and at times they are cryptic.

 

I am no expert in Bigfoot, I don't believe I ever professed to be but I am well respected among my friends, my peers, my neighbors and the community and I have a family and children. I am somewhat known in a wide region for my opinions and the positions on issues I have taken outside of Bigfoot community. Even in retirement you might say I'm a public figurehead at least to many locally.

 

Nevertheless, the relentless hit-and-run attacks on me personally since rolling out my photos are taking their toll. Yes I expected criticism but this kind of unbridled vitriol from these two goes beyond the reach of fair play in opinion. It’s easy to go from point A to point Z and extrapolate everything in between then head for the forum and an entirely different thing to PM somebody and get the real skinny first. The corollary is when the bell rings you cannot unring it.

 

The position I have taken with this thread specifically Campsite Destroyed, the SC controversy and the all predicate principles involved parallel a lot of the points I attempted explain above by reasoning why we cannot jump to immediate conclusions based on how we want or would like the story to end … There very well may be reasons for things we cannot see or know.  - IMHO

Edited April 16, 2015 by Gumshoeye

[Guest ChasingRabbits]

 

 

 I would say that the best way to get federal agency interest directed at one's self, is claim that it has already happened on the air.  Is that is what is going on here?    

 

The government is interested in anything and anyone over which is has regulatory authority. I know this because I work in healthcare which is a highly government regulated industry. DEA  and its state counterpart have been known to send agents posing as patients into hospitals, clinics and private doctor's offices to see how easy (or hard) it is to get a narcotics prescription. Ditto for HHS' Centers for Medicare and Medicaid: they've sent 'plants' into hospitals, clinics, and private offices to see if the rules and regs are being followed.

 

So with that in mind, why would someone like Garrett be under scrutiny? The most likely answer is because he is a frequent visitor to National park lands which are under the regulatory authority of the DOI and its agencies. The reasons why a person would be a frequent park visitor could be legal (ex. bird watching, hiking, etc.) or illegal ( ex. maintaining a marijuana farm, operating a meth lab). Garrett claims he was a prospector at one time. Well, here's a US Geologic Survey mineral report on one area within the Sam Houston National Forest.  http://pubs.usgs.gov/mf/1983/1549/report.pdf 

 

Please don't think  I'm saying Garrett has a pot farm or a meth lab or is digging up the Sam Houston National Forest: I'm saying that Garrett's frequent presence on Park land is enough for the government to put him on its radar.  Even if you're a bird watcher and make frequent bird watching trips to a park, that would be enough to get you on the radar: the Feds want to know what you're doing and if what you're doing is legal.

 

Regarding military presence on NPS lands.....About a month after 9/11, a War of 1812 era historic fort in my area suddenly had a portion blocked off. From the battlement of the fort, you could see tents under camouflage netting, military vehicles, armed soldiers and a parabolic radar antenna in that closed off section. And every hour or so, a military vehicle would drive through the roads of this small National Park.  This fort was formally decommissioned by the War Department and transferred to the DOI in the late 1930s. It was recommissioned during WWII, then decomissioned and returned to DOI in 1946. And in 2001, roughly 1 acre of it was recommissioned again. So a military presence in the Sam Houston National Forest or in Yosemite or in Yellow Stone or any other Federal or state held land wouldn't be out of the ordinary for me considering what I've experienced over the years living where I do. It's all Federal land, DOI might "own" it, but those lands will go to which ever department requires it when it's required.

 

Seriously, for all we know the Feds have some secret military base in Garrett's Big Foot research area and want him out of there. And Garrett's involvement with the torn up camp was a serendipitous way to do it.

[SWWASAS]

I

Here is the link to the YouTube page with the Video Wes made in February of this year of the location of his sighting.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNiAkxEhv6c#t=42

 

Below are two snips I captured from the video showing the road in both directions. They appear to match SW's photos from the site, though apparently from a different point on the road. The mountains in the background appear to match, taking into account the obvious difference in focal length of the lenses. It is also obviously not on Yacolt Mountain as can be seen on Google Earth, as Yacolt Mountain stands by itself, with Bell Mountain to the SE being the closest neighbor.

 

Wes Video 1.JPG

 

Wes Video 2.JPG

 

One of the episodes, I'm still trying to find it, mentions an encounter by a man on Yacolt / Muppet Mountain. Here is a link to a "Bigfoot Hotspot Radio" (the original title of Sasquatch Chronicles) Facebook page with photos from Muppet Mountain.

 

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.330608763708405.1073741829.326109887491626&type=3

 

The one below looks more like the area in the video and SW's photos. 

 

Muppet Mountain.JPG

 

This brings me back to the possibility of a confusion in place names. Possibly SW could shed some light on "Muppet Mountain"?

Thanks for providing the video Airdale.      According to the video, the GPS coordinates and the location of the pictures I posted earlier are the same location.    That short little side road is just visible in one of my pictures on the left side because I took the picture towards the coordinates to the West.   .     That little side road where they initially pulled off  is the exact location of the coordinates.     At this point, I have two problems with the narrative.     His reference to Yacolt Mountain which is 11 miles away.     I suspect that is just lack of knowledge about the geography of the area.      The second was his reference to the moon coming up down the road.     That direction is West and the moon had to be setting.   Additionally as someone else pointed out the moon set relatively early that evening.         They were probably not in the area long enough to know which direction was what or watch the moon later set.    In his narrative he also made some reference to up or down and that is not related to elevation but direction of travel which many people do.   So I can give a pass on that.     Where he said the one came down moving right to left was location of the game trail I show in one of my pictures.     Looking at the ridge to the North I have to agree that they must move down from the area he pointed,  because that is relatively easy access to the river below from the high country to the North.    West or East of there the canyon walls are very steep, and approach vertical in some places.     So in that area of the river, that area I call the meadow in one of my pictures, that he points and describes vocalizations from in the video,   is the easy way down to the river in that area from high country to the North.    That and other "game" trails in the area were well worn and well used.     At the end of the video, that little area by the river, was where I found and helped put out the unattended camp fire the day I went up there.  

 

At this point, I have to believe that either something happened, and they are not familiar with geography of the area,   or they found the location and created the story based on the location.     I did notice that when he describe the large one, in the middle of the road,  which would block their path to leave the area, he got very emotional and stopped talking for a second or two.      Because of that, I am inclined to believe they did have an encounter.    Now that I know that the location I visited,  is their encounter location, I will deploy game cameras there.     It is one of the easier places for me to get to that could have activity.    I just have to figure out how to hide them good enough.     

 

I am not familiar with Muppet Mountain and a search of my USGS maps of the area I cannot see it either.     It seems vaguely familiar but  I can't find it on my maps.    Not sure where I is.   

Edited April 16, 2015 by SWWASASQUATCHPROJECT

[SWWASAS]

In my mind, Muppet Mountain is where I found this just a few miles from the Wes and Woody location. 

 

 

[Guest]

The government is interested in anything and anyone over which is has regulatory authority. I know this because I work in healthcare which is a highly government regulated industry. DEA  and its state counterpart have been known to send agents posing as patients into hospitals, clinics and private doctor's offices to see how easy (or hard) it is to get a narcotics prescription. Ditto for HHS' Centers for Medicare and Medicaid: they've sent 'plants' into hospitals, clinics, and private offices to see if the rules and regs are being followed.

 

So with that in mind, why would someone like Garrett be under scrutiny? The most likely answer is because he is a frequent visitor to National park lands which are under the regulatory authority of the DOI and its agencies. The reasons why a person would be a frequent park visitor could be legal (ex. bird watching, hiking, etc.) or illegal ( ex. maintaining a marijuana farm, operating a meth lab). Garrett claims he was a prospector at one time. Well, here's a US Geologic Survey mineral report on one area within the Sam Houston National Forest.  http://pubs.usgs.gov/mf/1983/1549/report.pdf 

 

Please don't think  I'm saying Garrett has a pot farm or a meth lab or is digging up the Sam Houston National Forest: I'm saying that Garrett's frequent presence on Park land is enough for the government to put him on its radar.  Even if you're a bird watcher and make frequent bird watching trips to a park, that would be enough to get you on the radar: the Feds want to know what you're doing and if what you're doing is legal.

 

Regarding military presence on NPS lands.....About a month after 9/11, a War of 1812 era historic fort in my area suddenly had a portion blocked off. From the battlement of the fort, you could see tents under camouflage netting, military vehicles, armed soldiers and a parabolic radar antenna in that closed off section. And every hour or so, a military vehicle would drive through the roads of this small National Park.  This fort was formally decommissioned by the War Department and transferred to the DOI in the late 1930s. It was recommissioned during WWII, then decomissioned and returned to DOI in 1946. And in 2001, roughly 1 acre of it was recommissioned again. So a military presence in the Sam Houston National Forest or in Yosemite or in Yellow Stone or any other Federal or state held land wouldn't be out of the ordinary for me considering what I've experienced over the years living where I do. It's all Federal land, DOI might "own" it, but those lands will go to which ever department requires it when it's required.

 

Seriously, for all we know the Feds have some secret military base in Garrett's Big Foot research area and want him out of there. And Garrett's involvement with the torn up camp was a serendipitous way to do it.

 

Whatever those men seen not one of us was there in spite of all the chest thumping, if you’re told to back off in form of a subtle cryptic message for the more intelligent among us or it can be communicated more persuasively for the dimmest among us all short of a written directive. As they say when you hit the sweet spot you’ll know it. You tread down the road at your risk, you poke and prod too much and you will know that too.  That goes for everyone here. You will likely not be told why but there are reasons but knowing the Feds are in there in the first place tells me all I care to know about it, and I'll vacate the area post haste!

[Guest diana swampbooger]

Is Wes & Woody's encounter considered a much softer target?

 

 

Sure would be a lot more interesting to see the 3 original (unedited) videos that Bob Garrett posted from last summer of the 'Torn Up Camp' for the folks who missed it.

[Guest]

For all we know, Wes and his bro could have had a minimal sighting, (as it is a know BF area..) and added-on, I think that happens, like ''fish stories''. But still, no one has investigated their past BF shows. They had another show 4-5 years ago. What was going on with them back then? C'mon, where are all the detectives?

[SWWASAS]

Whatever those men seen not one of us was there in spite of all the chest thumping, if you’re told to back off in form of a subtle cryptic message for the more intelligent among us or it can be communicated more persuasively for the dimmest among us all short of a written directive. As they say when you hit the sweet spot you’ll know it. You tread down the road at your risk, you poke and prod too much and you will know that too.  That goes for everyone here. You will likely not be told why but there are reasons but knowing the Feds are in there in the first place tells me all I care to know about it, and I'll vacate the area post haste!

I have related before watching a military helicopter shuttling in and out of an area from a ridge several miles away.. I was up there that day just watching nearby ridge lines through a powerful spotting scope looking for BF activity. The exact location as the stuffed animal picture I just posted. Strangely enough the location the helicopter was flying in and out of turned out to be what I have just found out to be the location of Wes and Woodies encounter. The only place to land there would have to be a rock quarry below the sighting location on FR42. That is the only place there wide enough for a large helicopter to land. How about that for coincidence? I watched for a while as the helicopter would land, be out of sight a few minutes, then fly off to the SE someplace, be gone for 20 minutes then return. I watched at this point more curious about that operation than watching ridges for BF. Then the helicopter lifted off and started its turn towards the SE but stopped the turn and turned towards me and began flying directly towards my location instead of heading off to the SE like it had done for as long as I had been watching. I had the funny feeling I was watching something they did not want me to see, so I put my scope in my truck and drove off. As I left in my truck, the helicopter turned and started heading SE again. I left the area with the strange feeling I had been caught with my hand in a government cookie jar. Coincidence? Probably. But you have to admit it is strange that all these things seem to be tied together with a common location. I would imagine that what I have just related would be very interesting to them.

Edited April 16, 2015 by SWWASASQUATCHPROJECT

[Airdale]

How do you figure they spotted you SW, (assuming their flying in your direction wasn't a coincidence) reflection from your scope objective lens? 

 

For all we know, Wes and his bro could have had a minimal sighting, (as it is a know BF area..) and added-on, I think that happens, like ''fish stories''. But still, no one has investigated their past BF shows. They had another show 4-5 years ago. What was going on with them back then? C'mon, where are all the detectives?

 

Just curious Wag, is there a reason you don't want to share what you know about the previous show? I spent half an hour searching both Wes and Woody and, other than the usual links to companies that sell background information such as Intellius, the only references were to Sasquatch Chronicles, its immediate predecessor Bigfoot Hotspot Radio, or to interviews related to the show.