Ape Canyon -- Did They Shoot One?

[Guest sixxgunner]

_{Thanks for the post. Good information to know.}

[Guest ChasingRabbits]

That's a yes on both accounts CR. The SS&S book was published in 1914 (I think) and has one design that's "kind of close" to the AC cabin. One thing that really helped this project is using Beck's 1967 mostly as a  "research guideline". The real story is getting as close as one can to the original source at the point in time. More precisely, the meat of the story is in the original accounts puiblished in July, 1924. The first article came out in Longview less than 48 hours after the attack began.

While not the most informative artcle, the Oregonian of July 19th and 20th, published two photos of the cabin. One photo of the "long" 20' side and one of the short side. The photo depicts the split log chinking that was knocked out. These photos really helped the project.

A small detail that was lost in the retelling was that a creature was digging under the cabin Thursday night, trying to get it. The long side photo shows that as well.

These guys were using whatever hardware was available I believe. Their main goal was to work the mine. So the cabin was built with local wood, trees, within 20 to 30 feet or so, split pine shakes for the roof and maybe 3 to 4" diameter boughs for the battens to hold the shakes. The nails seemed to range from little 10d for small stuff & up to 60d spikes. A "nail guy" helped me out in identifying some nails and noted that some nails used were a distinct "tear-drop" style, used a lot by the railroads. Longview/Kelso is a port and a rail town, so it makes sense.

 

Marc

 

 

Which cabin style in SS&S did it resemble (because there are some pretty cool styles in that book)? When I read the account, I visualized an A-frame cabin because that would probably be the most pragmatic and economic design, until I read the creatures were walking on the roof.

 

Fascinating that a creature was trying to dig under the cabin. I presume that the cabin's floor was packed dirt with the foundation sills directly on the ground?

 

PS: structures are an interest of mine and I often visit historic houses just to look at their design. 16 years ago I read Shelters, Shacks and Shanties when I was trying to figure out if a 1920's appearing wood frame house was a cabin on the local historical society's list: in my area, older homes often got "make overs" in the form of aluminum siding or brick. Anyhow, when I started reading about the teepee like wood structures attributed to Big Foot, the pics of them looked remarkably like the tee pee like structures in Beard's book. In fact, they were a dead ringer for them.

Edited April 30, 2015 by ChasingRabbits

[jayjeti]

Which cabin style in SS&S did it resemble (because there are some pretty cool styles in that book)? When I read the account, I visualized an A-frame cabin because that would probably be the most pragmatic and economic design, until I read the creatures were walking on the roof.

 

 

 

 

This is an old photo of the cabin at Ape Canyon.

 

[BobbyO]

I think if they killed one they would have come forward with the body. Especially back then.

Why ?

"I shot three times, and it toppled over the cliff, down into the gorge, some four hundred feet below."

[BigTreeWalker]

That is the cabin from the reenactment video. The original didn't have any windows.

[Guest]

Where is the cliff the BF fell off of after being shot? How far was it from the cabin?

What type of weapons were they using?

It seems to me that it would take a powerful weapon to kill a BF.

[BigTreeWalker]

SweetSusiq, The pictures I have seen show Fred Beck holding a Model 94 Winchester rifle and Roy Smith holding a Remington Model 8 semi-auto. The largest cartridges you could get in those rifles were .32 Special for the Winchester and .35 Remington for the other. Neither of which is very powerful by today's standards. It sounded like to me they shot a lot of rounds by their account.

Maybe Marc will answer your questions about the cabin.

[Guest]

Thank you BigTreeWalker.

 

Having actually seen a type of BF that had to weigh in around 800 pounds and was at least 8 feet tall, having something powerful enough to kill one of these creatures should it be attacking humans would need to be a very powerful weapon capable of stopping such a monster IMHO.

 

I am a female, not very familiar with weapons, so I hope that anyone who has to defend themselves against an angry BF will be very well armed with powerful weapons at hand and easily accessible to defend themselves.

 

Thank you for explaining that your weapons would stop an attack from a BF.

 

Plus 1 to you from me with thanks..

[BigTreeWalker]

Thank you BigTreeWalker.

Having actually seen a type of BF that had to weigh in around 800 pounds and was at least 8 feet tall, having something powerful enough to kill one of these creatures should it be attacking humans would need to be a very powerful weapon capable of stopping such a monster IMHO.

I am a female, not very familiar with weapons, so I hope that anyone who has to defend themselves against an angry BF will be very well armed with powerful weapons at hand and easily accessible to defend themselves.

Thank you for explaining that your weapons would stop an attack from a BF.

Plus 1 to you from me with thanks..

Thanks SweetSusiq.

I was explaining what I saw of the miner's weapons. By their account they seemed to accomplish the job. But with any weapon, shot placement is the most important thing. In other words make every shot count.

Edited May 1, 2015 by BigTreeWalker

[MarcMyrsell]

SweetSusiq! The initial shooting, before July 4th was with Marion Smith and Beck. In the 1924 newspapers, it was said to be about 300 feet away. In the 1967 Beck book, he noted it at 300 yards. Having identified the spring location, where this first shot took place, it had to be 300 feet. The narrative cited that the creature was shot "across a draw". The draw near the spring is about 300 feet across. So I go with feet and not yards.

The shootings on the subsequent days were quite close, 50 to 75 feet away. This makes sense as in the immediate vicinity of the cabin, there's not a whole lots of level (ish) ground. The final shot at the cliff would of have to have been within the "very-near" to 50 foot range. The '24 paper accounts tells us that the cabin was about 10 feet from the top of the drop. The evidence we found of the cabin jibes with that quite well. The cliff in question is that which drops down in to Ape Canyon proper. In 1967, Beck noted it as 400 feet down. I think it's more like 200 feet, but I didn't measure it. We did accidentally dislodge a couple small rocks while on site and the ensuing sounds of the rock tumbling in to the canyon was enough to wrench your stomach horribly. It's really dangerous and its a long ways down there.

I'm trying to figure out how to post pics with my post, but I'm a blogging imbecile and have asked our pal VAfooter for help. A picture is worth a thousand. So I'll try to get our rough site diagram and original cabin pics up as soon as I can.

 

Marc

[MarcMyrsell]

Thanks to VAfooter, figured out the pic thing.

 

Here's the only pic of the cabin I've found. However, I'm still looking for a bit of a Holy Grail on the project, as there is record of a newsreel crew that went of with Beck and Leroy Smith. So, at least at one point there was film footage of the site.

 

Marc

[BigTreeWalker]

Thanks Marc, interesting design with the arched roof.

Looks like something could have easily gotten onto the roof from where those stumps are.

Edited May 2, 2015 by BigTreeWalker

[Guest ChasingRabbits]

Thanks for that pic! That's the type of cabin I would have expected them to build. Beard calls it "The Pontiac" in SS&S.  It even looks like they used the Beard's bark shingling, too.

 

Just a quick fyi for other posters, "The Pontiac" is an "A" frame structure (realistically, it's an inverted "V").

[Bonehead74]

SweetSusiq, The pictures I have seen show Fred Beck holding a Model 94 Winchester rifle and Roy Smith holding a Remington Model 8 semi-auto. The largest cartridges you could get in those rifles were .32 Special for the Winchester and .35 Remington for the other. Neither of which is very powerful by today's standards. It sounded like to me they shot a lot of rounds by their account.

Maybe Marc will answer your questions about the cabin.

Beck's rifle was chambered in .30-30 Winchester per his own account.

[BigTreeWalker]

Thanks Bonehead, I probably read that years ago in their account, just didn't remember. In that post above I was just going by what I could see in the pictures I've seen, and what was available in those rifles. Still not much against a sasquatch!