Bigfoot And Ghosts

[norseman]

Not true. Go try and file a wildlife study with fish and wildlife without credentials. You wont get very far.

One can go out on their own and try to collect evidence yes. But thats simply flying just under the radar.

[hiflier]

Hello JDL,

Yes, I agree. But DWA's post was off on at least two levels. Slamming all credentialed scientists, slamming the one's in the public arena who trust them and issuing a post in the usual off topic manner about the usual pet topic of his own- science and it shortcomings. And now I'm off topic as well, sorry.

[JDL]

Not true. Go try and file a wildlife study with fish and wildlife without credentials. You wont get very far.

One can go out on their own and try to collect evidence yes. But thats simply flying just under the radar.

 

We're saying the same thing, just coming at it from different directions.  The problem isn't a monopoly on science, it is the protectionist attitude and system.  A well organized and conducted study with logical results has intrinsic value no matter who produces it.  Extrinsic value, though, is another matter when scientists and scientific organizations turn up their noses at those without degrees.

[Woodslore]

 

 

There are stories of "haunted woods" or "haunted forest". Most of the ones I've read are in the UK. But there are some in the US. Anyhow, these haunted places are sometimes associated with apparitions (ghosts, orbs/lights) or noises that have a human-like quality (screams, moans, whispering sounds, talking sounds.)

 

 

An Interesting point Chasingrabits. It makes me think of the Suicide forest in Japan. People report the sounds of crying, faces looking at them from behind trees, mournful moaning, sound as though 2 people are whispering to one another as though lost and afraid, etc. Here in Eastern Canada we have a number of forest ghost stories. I grew up hearing about the ragged, or hairy ghost in the woods. It was said to stand taller than a man and wail and moan like a mother who has lost her child, or a man who has become hopelessly lost in the woods. It has no neck, it's eye glow red or green depending on the time it is seen, and it's arms look to have ragged moss or long shaggy hairs coming off it. Scared the hell out of me as a child. I know the Highlands of Cape Breton are said to be haunted as well. People hiking the trails are said to have reported the sounds of children crying and people whispering to one another. They have even had some come out and report they heard a person on X location on the trail and think they might be lost or hurt.

I know B.C and Ontario, New Brunswick and Newfoundland also have stories of ghosts in the woods. Can't remember which place it is but one tells of a hairy (sometimes foggy) woman who would steal and eat children or lead them to fall off cliffs or hills when they come to look for her. If not mistaken the only way to keep her at pay was to keep a silver coin in your pocket (some stories), a knife on your belt (again some variations).   

[beerhunter]

Ghosts are ghosts period. As I stated before, two of my daughters and I experienced the real phenomenon twice in one night at an old empty residence I used to live in as a child. Now my father on the other hand, said as a child that he and his sisters used to walk by the local cemetery and were scared to the point of running home by the sounds of moaning emanating from the graves. My father later learned the drunks from the local bar would go to the cemetery and moan when sick. 

Happy Halloween!

[Guest DWA]

 

Not true. Go try and file a wildlife study with fish and wildlife without credentials. You wont get very far.

One can go out on their own and try to collect evidence yes. But thats simply flying just under the radar.

 

We're saying the same thing, just coming at it from different directions.  The problem isn't a monopoly on science, it is the protectionist attitude and system.  A well organized and conducted study with logical results has intrinsic value no matter who produces it.  Extrinsic value, though, is another matter when scientists and scientific organizations turn up their noses at those without degrees.

 

Exactly.  *All the progress* on this topic - and keep in mind we already know one hell of a lot about the biology and ecology of this animal - has been made by amateurs on their own time with their own money. 

 

No.  No one - including the academics - working this is getting paid for doing this.  That is what gets papers like Norse is referring to filed:  the mainstream's decision that it is OK to do this because it's not a taboo topic.  Right there is the fatal flaw of peer review:  if the peers aren't paying attention, they are obstructing scientific progress.

[dmaker]

Well, one would first have to publish a bigfoot paper in a peer reviewed journal before one could charge peers with ignoring it or obstructing it. 

 

So, how many peer reviewed journals have bigfoot articles? And before you mention RHI, let's restrict this to the same peer reviewed journals that any biologist would submit to? Not just the single bigfoot friendly journal on the planet? You know, just to be objective and fair.

 

Why can't the peer review process used by every other journal where discoveries are presented and accepted, even by enthusiasts on this board, be good enough for bigfoot papers? Every time there is a novel discovery dealing with the history of mankind people here get all excited. And rightfully so, that stuff is exciting. No one seems to have a problem with Nature when it publishes something that is perceived as friendly to enthusiasts, so let's not suddenly claim that Nature, for example, is not a fair example of a journal due to bias, etc.  Nature seems fair enough when you like what they have to say. 

Edited October 10, 2015 by dmaker

[Guest JiggyPotamus]

I have always assumed that the sasquatch themselves were responsible for the paranormal claims in the first place, similar to how most local monster legends were likely triggered by sasquatch. I think that such an explanation is more plausible when it comes to accounting for both paranormal and bigfoot claims. However, I definitely believe in paranormal activity, at least to a certain extent. Besides sasquatch that is the only unaccepted belief that I share. Unaccepted by the majority of the population I mean, as well as being unproven scientifically. So ghosts and bigfoot, although I have never subscribed to the idea that they are related. Bigfoot is simply an undocumented primate, while "ghosts" are the result of some as yet unexplained scientific phenomena. I think that consciousness itself extends beyond a person's physical body. In fact, I believe that the physical body is actually what limits consciousness, instead of being responsible for its creation. This hypothesis itself would go part of the way to explaining ghostly occurrences. Perhaps I am wrong about bigfoot being completely unrelated to paranormal activity. Or perhaps there are ghosts of bigfoot out there. It stands to reason, at least when working from the assumptions I have made regarding consciousness and the paranormal, that any animal is capable of being a "ghost." The only prerequisite is consciousness, to what degree I do not know. We have not even thoroughly established whether non-human animals truly possess consciousness.

[Guest ChasingRabbits]

I've heard of shadow people. In the late 90s, they were especially popular in the paranormal world. Back then the general consensus was shadow people were non-human entities. i don't recall reading shadow people encounters outside buildings (ex. homes, office buildings).

 

RE: suicide forest in Japan, notice the proximity of it to Mt. Fuji. I've noticed that paranormal activity is somehow increased or perceived to be increased at volcanic sites: it probably has a geological reason, like an anomaly in the magnetic field.

[ShadowBorn]

The more time that one spends in the woods motionless, one can see how other known animals can be ghost like as well. So sure why not these creatures, why not can they be ghost like as well as deer coming in on a bait pile. Hearing those strange sounds that seem to happen at odd times like when you least expect it to happen but then happens. How about the falling acorn or even a pine cone a branch that is hanging by a thread.

 

That branch that so happens to fall when you be walking by looking for bigfoot. But that does not matter since you will insist that it was bigfoot that threw it. It is only when you debunk it that you finally realize that it had nothing to do with bigfoot. There was a reason I changed to Shadowborn and that is that these creatures know how to use the shadows well.  They can conceal them selves very well and we will not see them until they choose the time. They will play games on folks that they know they feel safe around. So if you want to call them ghost sure why not since we only see them when they choose too. In a way they are tricksters and are not ghost like that as well  except real ghost are in a realm that we do not understand yet.

[JDL]

When evaluating junior officers in field exercises, there was one stage where they were required to put together an operations order at night.  I would give them the coordinates where they would be required to meet with another group to coordinate and then get there early and sit down at the base of a tree.  Every time they would show up, wait a bit for me to show up, then decide I was lost or something and make their plan.  Never once did they see me, though a couple of times they almost stepped on me.  I recall another time when an NCO came walking up and stopped right next to me to light a cigarette.  I took a step back and lightly tapped him on the right shoulder, as I stepped behind him to his left, he crouched and swung to his right with his arms out, so I tapped him on the left shoulder.  I stepped back directly behind him as he swung to the left, then said, "Good evening" in his ear.  He jumped.

 

Most people aren't that observant.

 

Neither was the copperhead that crawled into my lap one night.  That time I jumped.

[Patterson-Gimlin]

I like the thread  being born on Halloween.  Ghosts imho are just as believable as  undiscovered man apes.