Let's Talk Caves and Sasquatch

[Yuchi1]

Hello hiflier, glad to make your acquaintance.

 

Yes, if BF exists as we are told to believe, it is very intelligent.  Which to an extant I do believe.

 

Where I currently reside, Michigan, its been 12 - 16 degrees.  So essentially, 16 to 20 degrees below zero yet most animals that reside in the state still manage to survive without caves.  These animals include rabbit, deer and even bear. There is a way to survive and there is most certainly still food.  As far as extreme heat, well, we only hit about 95 - 98 without considering the heat index so we'll save that discussion for later.  

 

Regarding being cornered, yes, some would lead you to believe that BF is omnipotent regarding humans and being caught ( despite the billion, dillion, zillion reports some member here have read (thus earning their junior certified scientist badge) ) I do not for a second buy that they are always perfect.  I have to believe that being in a cave would greatly reduce their ability to avoid detection based on a multitude of factors, a few being, lack of escape, and reduced scent and hearing detection of a human approaching.  

 

Back in my pro-kill days during a night hunt while heading to a rendezvous point, I walked within 15' of a fellow hunter sitting under a tree in a ghillie suit and even though I had a headlamp on, still did not see him.  This could lead to the possibility that a similar situation would occur to someone using illumination in a cave with the resulting night blindness to one's periphery. Plus, in many caves the bat guano and snakes give reason for looking down more than up and around.

 

edit: grammatical

Edited January 16, 2016 by Yuchi1

[Guest Crowlogic]

The cave argument is a non sequitur.  Bigfoot proponents will contest that bigfoot chooses only caves it knows humans will never find, or they will contest bigfoot knows how to disguise it's presence so there's never evidence of it's habitation.

[Yuchi1]

CL,

 

Have you been in caves much?

[hiflier]

Hello All,

Yes, TWIST, that article was specific to that cave but the acoustic dynamic mentioned wouldn't be specific to just that cave. Not every cave is going to be the same. If BF is smart the choice of where to install itself will be based on experience and that might be something passed through the generations of a territorial clan.

So lets take this a bit further....What would be a situation that would make one cave better than the next? I can think of several but for now I would like to look at time of year. How about we discuss winter. If there was ever a season to be in a cave that would be it. Also we could pinpoint the PacNW for starters and look at the Olympic Peninsula. Or not. The Rockies in general or the Cascades would set a good stage but basically winter is a good place to begin either way. What would make a cave a really good choice to hole in up for the season? What might experience tell such a creature? What does it need other than perhaps a safe place for females to go through a birthing process?

Like you I have been trying to solve this mystery. Narrowing down choices for doing so is part of that process. It's too broad to just say BF lives in the forest. The forest is a big place and I think we can do better by getting into the mind of Sasquatch as an animal that is built like a Human even though it isn't going to possess the same imagination to innovate something in the way of technology. That tells me there something lacking there. It leaves a very basic creature and so this thread is also for addressing that

[Guest Crowlogic]

CL,

 

Have you been in caves much?

Only ones that had no signs of bigfoot habitation.  What say you?

[hiflier]

Hello Crowlogic,

 

The cave argument is a non sequitur.  Bigfoot proponents will contest that bigfoot chooses only caves it knows humans will never find, or they will contest bigfoot knows how to disguise it's presence so there's never evidence of it's habitation.

I disagree with everything you said. Many of us I assume have been in caves. Many archeological finds have been in caves. But no one has been in them all. New ones are discovered all the time.

Edited January 16, 2016 by hiflier

[Yuchi1]

 

CL,

 

Have you been in caves much?

Only ones that had no signs of bigfoot habitation.  What say you?

 

 

We squirmed around in several (Tennessee river, north Alabama) back in my adolescent days however, had no knowledge or awareness of BF back then so had we met up with one, would have figured it for some of those east Tennessee mountain guys we heard about.

 

There are several on our lease (Leflore county, Oklahoma) that are in the plans to be explored closely in the next ~90 days.

Hello Crowlogic,

The cave argument is a non sequitur.  Bigfoot proponents will contest that bigfoot chooses only caves it knows humans will never find, or they will contest bigfoot knows how to disguise it's presence so there's never evidence of it's habitation.

I disagree with everything you said. Many of us I assume have been in caves. Many archeological finds have been in caves and yet But has been in them all. New ones are discovered all the time.

 

IIRC, in the cable channel series on the **** Dodge fella, he wintered in a cave near the coast?

[MIB]

The cave argument is a non sequitur.  Bigfoot proponents will contest that bigfoot chooses only caves it knows humans will never find, or they will contest bigfoot knows how to disguise it's presence so there's never evidence of it's habitation.

 

I seldom agree with you but this time .. you're right.   The evidence simply does not support the assertion.

 

MIB

[Yuchi1]

How many instances of people purposely exploring caves for BF evidence are documented, out there?

[ShadowBorn]

 

Plus, in many caves the bat guano and snakes give reason for looking down more than up and around.

Yuchi1

So what are you trying to say here? That we should be looking up in high places while exploring caves like when we are in the woods on tree's.

 

The cave argument is a non sequitur.  Bigfoot proponents will contest that bigfoot chooses only caves it knows humans will never find, or they will contest bigfoot knows how to disguise it's presence so there's never evidence of it's habitation.

 

Crowlogic

 

No matter how you twisted you are right we are always going to make excuses. Right ! That these creatures are so smart that only choose places where humans cannot find them right. That they do not choose bedding next to deer bedding at night in open fields .Right ! yes, I have proof of this too. 

 

Maybe the cave systems could be used as a way of travel for these guys  and also why we have reason why we do not find long track ways. I do not in my opinion believe that these creature stay in one spot for long periods of time. In my personal opinion these creatures are in a constant movement, do not have a set pattern that makes them easily track able. There is not a way to say that you can set up on them and be ready for their movement before they arrive. If this was so then the proof would be out by now. The Habs have it right by staying silent on what they are doing . They have a bond with them may it be by honor or by a pact but their secret will stay with them.

[Guest Crowlogic]

Hello Crowlogic,

 

The cave argument is a non sequitur.  Bigfoot proponents will contest that bigfoot chooses only caves it knows humans will never find, or they will contest bigfoot knows how to disguise it's presence so there's never evidence of it's habitation.

I disagree with everything you said. Many of us I assume have been in caves. Many archeological finds have been in caves. But no one has been in them all. New ones are discovered all the time.

 

Oh I see we've just not looked in the right caves.  Straw man argument.  It's a big world, bigfoot is adept at hiding itself etc, etc.

"What would make a cave unattractive to an intelligent creature like Bigfoot?"

 

The lack of escape,  the fear of being cornered. 

Exactly what does a 12 ft 1200 pound super ape have to fear?

Edited January 16, 2016 by Crowlogic

[Yuchi1]

SB,

 

All I'm saying is (from my experience) looking down was the pragmatic action plus, I/we had no idea of BF at that point in time.

 

CL,

 

Once all the caves have been examined and only until then (discovery aside), will the discussion be settled. Until then, we're left with statistical probabilities and then I'm reminded of what Disraeli said about statistics, "there are three kinds of lies; lies, **** lies and statistics".

 

 

edit: grammatical

Edited January 16, 2016 by Yuchi1

[Guest Crowlogic]

^^The difference between you and me is you're using statistics the way a drunk uses a lamp pole, for support not illumination.  Your straw man is almost as flammable as Hiflier's.  The world is big mysterious and diverse is more of a mind construct than it is a reality at this point in history.  Some are saying bigfoot keeps perpetually on the move, some are saying it is fiercely territorial, some are saying it has a culture and marks it's clan mates with wood structures and counts off the pieces to add as the babies arrive.   So which is it?  If it's anything except the first possibility then bigfoot is holding put somewhere and is it realistic to say that when a wood structure is found that the secret cave is somehow many miles away?  Imagine that,  they telegraph their presence with wood structures for all the world to see but the caves are perfectly remote and never encountered by bigfoot researchers, cavers, mining prospectors, geologists, hunters, rangers, hikers, and surveyors.  Not a single one has ever brought in a compelling artifact, or bio sample indicating that bigfoot is up in the caves.

 

 Animals tend to use the environments  that are within the reason of the animals ability to utilize.  Don't expect a bear to be perched up on a ledge that a Condor is using.  If we get to caves as human's with our biological structure then bigfoot with is's very similar structure is more likely to be drawn to the same places we are and for many of the same reasons. That is to say bigfoot can't fly (or can it?) and it isn't a mountain goat or big cat.  It'l likely go to the places bipeds go to and those are the very same ones we go to.

[hiflier]

Hello Crowlogic,

Speaking of inflammatory how about losing the "strawman" dialogue and have a decent conversation??

 

...Not a single one has ever brought in a compelling artifact, or bio sample indicating that bigfoot is up in the caves.

Looks like Yuchi1 has his work cut out then doesn't it. And yet you say this:

Animals tend to use the environments that are within the reason of the animals ability to utilize. Don't expect a bear to be perched up on a ledge that a Condor is using. If we get to caves as human's with our biological structure then bigfoot with is's very similar structure is more likely to be drawn to the same places we are and for many of the same reasons. That is to say bigfoot can't fly (or can it?) and it isn't a mountain goat or big cat. It'l likely go to the places bipeds go to and those are the very same ones we go to.

Edited January 16, 2016 by hiflier

[hiflier]

Hello Crowlogic and All,

Look this is a Bigfoot Forum. But in truth it's so much more than that. What I've learned of wildlife, the forest, authority groups and agencies, habitat and so many other peripheral subject makes the Forum obviously a place to learn things not Bigfoot as well. This thread is no different. Acoustics is the byproduct of what I'm learning here. Things like how early man found his way deep into caves and caverns by being more sensitive to echoes and therefore echo locating his way around in places where torches wouldn't work. The new find in Southern Africa comes to mind.

I'm learning more about the Human ear and how the ear canal functions as a collector/amplifier. Parabolic dishes do the same thing. A cave can be like nature's parabolic dish but it can also be a megaphone to the outside. Think about that next time some mentions how huge and loud a howl was echoing across a valley. Can we get back on the subject of winter now?

Edited January 16, 2016 by hiflier