SWWASAS Posted January 16, 2016 BFF Patron Posted January 16, 2016 (edited) Caves are problematic. First of all while they are shelter of sorts, if you had a tribe of BF or humans for that matter living in one, you would have to establish protocol to prevent the cave from being a caldron of disease. For prevention of disease, it is far better to not be cooped up with a bunch of others of your species in an environment like a cave. While there are exceptions, most of the human cave occupation in Europe was during the last ice ace. It might have been a shelter of last resort just to make it through the long winters of the ice age. For humans, the art associated with caves, points to them being spiritual places either exclusively or in conjunction with shelter. Perhaps BF had no attraction caves because they seem to have no interest in rock drawings, and do not need caves for shelter like humans? There is something about the BF brain that does not support the creative bent that humans have. Probably wired differently. That would seem to carry over into construction of fabricated tools. Humans were doing art, right along with fabricated tool development, creation of baskets, and construction of clothing throughout much of our history. BF may not need some of that, but perhaps more because it is not capable of that level of creativity, than need. You cannot tell me that a BF in Michigan or Canada would not welcome use of clothing in the winter. Edited January 16, 2016 by SWWASASQUATCHPROJECT 1
georgerm Posted January 16, 2016 Posted January 16, 2016 (edited) Raise your hand if you've lived with a bigfoot clan for more than a year in an area where there are all kinds of great dens, caves, log structures, etc.............................. opps ....... no hands. Well, I'll be ....... So that puts us in the..... green horn ......... ignorant........ newbe ......... beginner category with training wheels when it comes to caves and Bigfoot. It's a good thread but the bickering will ruin it soon. Then we can go back to the forest service and bigfoot! Maybe we have it back..ass wards. Bigfoot might like to den up in a cave, then when some curiosity seeker comes along, it grabs it and eats it. It's a trap system. A huge 9' bigfoot up to 1000 pounds is not worried about being trapped.......... it wants to be trapped. Come and get me. Come on in fool an ambush is ready! Bigfoot expends no energy and the food comes to it. Pretty smart ................ Bigfoot probably knows humans like to explore caves so it cleans up and leaves during the day through one of the multiple exits. It buries all bones and left over hides and waits for the next victim. Edited January 16, 2016 by georgerm 1
SWWASAS Posted January 16, 2016 BFF Patron Posted January 16, 2016 (edited) Could it be that Ape Cave on Mt St Helens was a BF sanctuary until the Forest Service turned it into a tourist attraction? Humans are known to ruin the neighborhood if you are a BF. As I was writing this wondered if anyone had ever done a archeological examination of the cave floor. Will have to look into that. Would of course ask the Forest Service if it had been done with respect to Native American habitation. The NA have to have known about the lava tube for a very long time. Of course it is totally silly of me to even associate something called Ape Cave with BF. Probably named by boy scouts visiting the area in 1912, just before they threw rocks at the miners cabin then named it Ape Canyon just North of there. . Edited January 16, 2016 by SWWASASQUATCHPROJECT
Twist Posted January 16, 2016 Posted January 16, 2016 "What would make a cave unattractive to an intelligent creature like Bigfoot?" The lack of escape, the fear of being cornered. Exactly what does a 12 ft 1200 pound super ape have to fear? Trailcams duhh 1
hiflier Posted January 17, 2016 Author Posted January 17, 2016 Hello All, Can we get back on the subject of winter now? AHEM!
BigTreeWalker Posted January 17, 2016 Posted January 17, 2016 Could it be that Ape Cave on Mt St Helens was a BF sanctuary until the Forest Service turned it into a tourist attraction? Humans are known to ruin the neighborhood if you are a BF. As I was writing this wondered if anyone had ever done a archeological examination of the cave floor. Will have to look into that. Would of course ask the Forest Service if it had been done with respect to Native American habitation. The NA have to have known about the lava tube for a very long time. Of course it is totally silly of me to even associate something called Ape Cave with BF. Probably named by boy scouts visiting the area in 1912, just before they threw rocks at the miners cabin then named it Ape Canyon just North of there. . Funny you should mention a scout group. Here is the story of the naming of the caves. http://www.wta.org/go-hiking/hikes/ape-cave "The primates that gave their name to two lava tubes found along this trail weren't monkeys-they were members of a 1950s outdoor club who found and explored the tubes. They called themselves the Mount St. Helens Apes, and the lava tubes became known as their caves." I knew Mr. Reese who was a member of this group. He was very interesting to talk to about their explorations in the Mt St Helens area. I never asked him about bigfoot. Wish I had. If BF are using the lava tubes in the area it would be an interesting snowshoe hike to look for tracks in that valley that contains so many of the tubes. It's 42° in the lava tubes year-round.
georgerm Posted January 17, 2016 Posted January 17, 2016 Guys find a nice tunnel and don't have a light to explore it. They hear growls. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWoCJXD8CRg Here's a typical bear or bigfoot den. Wonder why he sends his kid to explore? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2s4xeIPeHIA
TritonTr196 Posted January 17, 2016 Posted January 17, 2016 I don't think Bigfoot uses caves for traveling. Very few cave systems in the states are large enough and long enough for it to be of much use too a Bigfoot for traveling. Maybe taking shelter during a storm in a rock shelter overhang is about it. I use to do alot of caving when I was younger and there is simply no way a large animal can travel through any cave system for very far before they get stopped.
hiflier Posted January 17, 2016 Author Posted January 17, 2016 (edited) Hello TritonTR196,Allow me to sweeten the pot if I may: Number of mines in Washington-515; Oregon-589. http://www.abandonedmines.gov/Abandoned Mines:ID- 8-16,000WA- 2,000OR- 5,800MT- 4,900NV- 10,600CA- 17,700 These are probably big and deep enough to stand in. A word of caution: they are also big and deep enough to die in if one isn't careful and that includes Humans as well livestock along with any unwary wild animals. It happens. Edited January 17, 2016 by hiflier 1
SWWASAS Posted January 17, 2016 BFF Patron Posted January 17, 2016 (edited) I went looking for one of those WA mines one day out of curiosity. Was on my USGS map. Never did find it but found a very old overgrown road leading down to it so think I must have been close. When I got in the area I started worrying about being on top of it and having it collapse under me. That made me lose interest in finding the entrance. Funny thing is that I was very near there a couple years later when I had the close cougar encounter. Made me wonder if the cougar was using the mine as a den. Edited January 17, 2016 by SWWASASQUATCHPROJECT
hiflier Posted January 17, 2016 Author Posted January 17, 2016 (edited) Hello SWWASASQUATCHPROJECT, Collapsing at the surface is a real problem in Oklahoma with its type of geology which is a lot of shale and sedimentary layers. PacNW is rockier and the problem while still there is lessened. For this thread I'm also researching cave acoustics as well as bats. Caves are interesting features to be sure. Cougar? Possibly you may be right there. Edited January 17, 2016 by hiflier
SWWASAS Posted January 17, 2016 BFF Patron Posted January 17, 2016 The ground here can be solid basalt layers but we also get a lot of pyroclastic flow accretions with a lot of ash with rock inclusions sometimes just a few feet apart. The ash flow stuff can be very soft and you can dig it out with a shovel. I suspect most mines were looking for gold so they would tend to be in the hard rock flows. By their nature the basalt flows have a lot of cooling fractures depending on the depth of the flows. The most dramatic of these are the deep flows where the rock cooled very slowly and formed into columnar columns tens of feet tall. Anyway most mines require some sort of cribbing to be stable and with age that tends to rot or be eaten away by termites making them a danger to be in or on top of. There have not really been any big gold strikes in the basalt flows, unlike granite which tends to include gold with the quartz. But we do have some placer miners who work claims in some of the rivers. Cold wet water work in streams that are running off high snow fields in the high elevations. Wet suits and sluice boxes on rafts in the rivers that are fed from hoses they suck the river bottom with. I suspect most are more of a hobby thing that barely pays their equipment and operating costs. But gold does have that allure that is hard to resist.
Yuchi1 Posted January 17, 2016 Posted January 17, 2016 Hello SWWASASQUATCHPROJECT, Collapsing at the surface is a real problem in Oklahoma with its type of geology which is a lot of shale and sedimentary layers. PacNW is rockier and the problem while still there is lessened. For this thread I'm also researching cave acoustics as well as bats. Caves are interesting features to be sure. Cougar? Possibly you may be right there. With as many earthquakes as we've had in Oklahoma over the past 20 years, I'd imagine that most, if not all of the caves that were susceptible to collapse, already have collapsed to some degree. In north Alabama the karst soil found near many cave formations has been problematic in several instances.
spacemonkeymafia Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 On two occasions I found a dead deer at the mouth of a cave. I don't really y suspect bigfoot on that one. More than likely a nonexistent mountain lion that I've heard and found tracks of. On the other cave we were approaching it to explore in daylight. All hell broke loose around us. Trees shaking, whoops, roars, and sighting of several large individuals. We gave them their space. They followed us out a certain distance. In this case, yes, a cave probably was being utilized by them.
Recommended Posts