Has Bigfoot Science Stalled?

[Guest DWA]

Bigfoot's real. 

 

I keep saying this.  At the frontiers of science the ones that know are the ones doing the work.  If one hasn't carefully read every report and cross-indexed it at length with everything one knows about the world's workings, one isn't gonna be there.

 

There is too much talk here about conspiracies liars and fakes...and virtually none about animals, human psychology, the history of science and patterns of evidence.  See how many posts I have?  That's how much feeding I've done.  If you aren't with me by now you are not likely to get there...until you do what I have done.

 

No spoon-feeding ever occurs at the frontiers of science.  All that I have seen and read is accessible to 100% of the world's population.  But one has to leaven it with extensive thought, which I have laid out here at great length.  Can't do more than that.

 

OK, Hint.  If one has read Meldrum and Bindernagel, one knows what I had already done...by the time I started reading them.  They added a few ideas to my quiver...but essentially the main thing they did for me was confirm that I had gotten right where they were.

Edited January 24, 2016 by DWA

[Patterson-Gimlin]

All the reading in the world will not produce a single specimen. Until that happens our tall friend will never be accepted as nothing more than legend, folklore and great stories. Again I admire your strong faith in what you perceive to be as facts. For the record I hope you are right.

[Guest DWA]

See, people keep thinking science's job is to prove stuff to the ignorant.  That is part of the deal.  But science's job is to make the most of evidence.  We know where the suckers are.  We know what their tracks look like...and a bunch of part-time amateurs - people that I know and if you can't trust them, now you have to just give up - have all seen one in their research area.

 

(Please don't get me on "you only have their word."  You only have Einstein's word unless you are smarter than him.  You only have science's word on practically everything science has told you.)

 

They can get their specimen any time they want.  The animals are real, and that is enough for me.  I need do nothing else.  This isn't "you have nothing until you have proof."  This is "if you have the evidence, you can get the proof."  I don't have the time or money or desire to bag a bigfoot.  But I have more than enough to assess the evidence that tells me they're real.

 

(Why are you arguing with me when all the science is on my side?  Why aren't you showing me why I'm wrong?

 

You can't.)

It doesn't matter what the ignorant think.  It only matters what the facts...ARE.

Edited January 24, 2016 by DWA

[Guest OntarioSquatch]

They can get their specimen any time they want. 

There's one group that's been going at it hard for the last four years in what could be the most active area in the world and they've yet to succeed in collecting a specimen.

[Guest DWA]

By the standards of full-bore professional science, they don't even count as part-time.  Never mind the crazy "don't shoot it might be a suit" rules of engagement.

 

But all of them - every one - has seen one in the field, and there is no reason to doubt that.

[Patterson-Gimlin]

See, people keep thinking science's job is to prove stuff to the ignorant.  That is part of the deal.  But science's job is to make the most of evidence.  We know where the suckers are.  We know what their tracks look like...and a bunch of part-time amateurs - people that I know and if you can't trust them, now you have to just give up - have all seen one in their research area.

 

(Please don't get me on "you only have their word."  You only have Einstein's word unless you are smarter than him.  You only have science's word on practically everything science has told you.)

 

They can get their specimen any time they want.  The animals are real, and that is enough for me.  I need do nothing else.  This isn't "you have nothing until you have proof."  This is "if you have the evidence, you can get the proof."  I don't have the time or money or desire to bag a bigfoot.  But I have more than enough to assess the evidence that tells me they're real.

 

(Why are you arguing with me when all the science is on my side?  Why aren't you showing me why I'm wrong?

 

You can't.)

It doesn't matter what the ignorant think.  It only matters what the facts...ARE.

I am not arguing with you. I am simply pointing out the facts . Everything you have said is a lot of nothing . No offense. Not taking the word of romantics like yourself who want to believe is the logical thing to do. Then you say they can get a specimen anytime they want one . Now you lost me. That is just plain nonsense. If that was the case. It would have been accomplished by now.

I am well aware of the job of science. Enjoy the rest of your weekend.

[Guest DWA]

I'm not the romantic.  Cold hard facts aren't.  You too.

[hiflier]

Hello DWA,

 

It doesn't matter what the ignorant think...

 

Yep, Mr. Ignorant that's me alright.

[Incorrigible1]

Why are you arguing with me when all the science is on my side?  Why aren't you showing me why I'm wrong?

 

Hmm, a thorough search for bigfoot articles in scientific journals reveals exactly zero. A search for bigfoot displays in scientific museums reveals the same.

 

The only thing on your side is mind-numbing obstinance.

Edited January 24, 2016 by Incorrigible1

[hiflier]

Hello Incorrigible1,

 

Now jest hold on thar pahdna. There's that there big skeeltun in Pocatello. Ever notice how Idaho sounds a bit like IDK  Oops, shucks, there I go being ignorant again

Edited January 24, 2016 by hiflier

[georgerm]

 Our frustrations are surfacing, and it won’t do any good to do the 'bigfoot stomp' on each other. Again, many of us on the forum are the only ones we can talk openly with. If I bring the topic up with my family and friends the snickers start like a box of snicker bars. Cut each other some slack.

 

If you had millions to put together a research team to study bigfoot how would you get the science restarted and unstalled?

 

The original questions were:

 

My guess is a very low percentage of the public knows and believes bigfoot really exists as we do? What can we do about it? How can the public be informed and not turned off? We have many questions to answer.

 

Bigfoot has been shown to exist to a village, a group, and some VIPs but the evidence slipped through the cracks. I posed about 20 newspaper documents dating to the early 1800s where a bigfoot body was brought into a small community on a wagon, horse, or some other way. It didn't last too long with no refrigeration, and they buried the stinky corpse somewhere. A taxidermist didn't stuff it, so bigfoot failed to be proved.  

 

So how can we help prove bigfoot? Due to mockery and high thresholds of bigfoot proof, university bigfoot study grants seem impossible to attain.

 Are there or have their been university grants for animals that we believe to exist due to reports? Snow lepoard, celocanth, spotted owl, …………….. my spelling is off but you get the picture.

 

If we had grants to universities that would finance bigfoot researcher's needs then reliable evidence and proof would soon follow. Do you agree? Seems like not many, if any universities, want to apply for bigfoot study grants probably due to the 'mockery factor'. Their closed minds or fear of mockery stifles getting into the 'know'. Presently evidence collected by us, the volunteer researcher is helping but not enough.

 

enjoy the mystery ........................... while it lasts............................. you are on the cutting edge.

[hiflier]

Hello georgerm,

Believe it or not I have developed a plan for just what you are talking about- funding. Seriously. The idea came to me last October and I'm working hard on the follow through. I wrote a book starting last November and am in the process of finalizing the editing and proofreading. It's an involved story that I won't go into here but my goal is to generate funds from sales for research.

[Bodhi]

My writing is large so I can see it ...............don't be alarmed. The laptop and glasses don't work well. Is the field of bigfoot science like an airplane that is stalling and will soon head up, then down into a fog bank only to disappear? wow.....poetic.......That's not a pleasant event or thought. We can live in denial but it could happen. What efforts or events reversing this trend? What is adding to the stalling? 

 

My guess is a very low percentage of the public knows and believes bigfoot really exists as we do? What can we do about it? How can the public be informed and not turned off? We have many questions to answer.

 

Bigfoot has been shown to exist to a village, a group, and some VIPs but the evidence slipped through the cracks. I posed about 20 newspaper documents dating to the early 1800s where a bigfoot body was brought into a small community on a wagon, horse, or some other way. It didn't last too long with no refrigeration, and they buried the stinky corpse somewhere. A taxidermist didn't stuff it, so bigfoot failed to be proved.  

 

So how can we help prove bigfoot? Due to mockery and high thresholds of bigfoot proof, university bigfoot study grants seem impossible to attain.

 

Are there or have their been university grants for animals that we believe to exist?

 

If we had grants to universities that would finance bigfoot researcher's needs then reliable evidence and proof would soon follow. Do you agree? Seems like not many, if any universities, want to apply for bigfoot study grants probably due to the 'mockery factor'. Their closed minds or fear of mockery stifles getting into the 'know'. Presently evidence collected by us, the volunteer researcher is helping but not enough.

 

Well enough from the 'soap box'.  Pick a question to answer and run with it.

 

 

I'm not so sure there's much science involved by those involved. I don't mean that as an attack but I just don't see evidence of a scientific method being used.

There are a lot of ideas, I do not think they rise to the level of hypotheses though.

 

What is the true range for the animal?

Do they migrate?

Do the live in groups gorillas or are they solitary like orangutans?

Omnivore or vegetarian?

Do they use wood knocks, infrasound, howls (are there any great apes which use howls?)

 

There are a lot of stories with conflicting details, is any person or group working to separate out the wheat from the chaff?

What has the collection of purported footprints brought in terms of knowledge of the animal? Has any trackway led to a feeding area or a den? Has Meldrum's collection of prints added to the knowledge of how the animal makes it's living?

 

I don't see the scientific process at work, I just don't. Look at any other field of science and then look at what's being done with sasquatch. It isn't science and maybe at this point that is fine. Unless some tangible evidence is produced it might be premature to even propose a hypothesis. But to ask the question has the science stalled presupposes something not in evidence in the first place.

 

And can we PLEASE drop all of the "woo". The "mind speak" and "portals" and the like. If sasquatch isn't a flesh and blood animal then we might was well forget science and break out the Ouija boards.

[hiflier]

Hello Bodhi,

Really good points there. Some claim to have sightings without ANY scientific program at work. Still others have a program but generally it's still in the observation stage of looking for sign. And still others who have or think they have sign are really only left with guesswork as to whether the sign is a hoax or not and that decision can be very subjective or not depending on what the sing is and where it was discovered. Others who are aware of scientific methods have not had any opportunity in which to apply them. Most all are starting with a picture and trying to make anything they think looks like evidence stretch into evidence. And this has been the case for a long, long time. So it seems natural for some Humans to need woo for answers which puts the subject even farther from a solution.

Money. It comes down to that. Or sheer luck; that too? And speaking of money I need to clarify something about the book when I said, "I wrote a book starting last November and am in the process of finalizing the editing and proofreading. It's an involved story that I won't go into here", I meant the book creation process was an involved story- not what's in the the book itself. As far as the book goes there IS no storyline. It's a hunting book. Sorry if there was any confusion.

Edited January 24, 2016 by hiflier

[SWWASAS]

One possibility that I want to explore this winter season is there is evidence of what looks like a collapsed lava tube in the "Critical Habitat" area. I have attempted to find an opening but the area is very difficult to explore due to the heavy bush, down trees, etc. Without the leaves on underbrush, it will be easier to explore. December had record rain and I did not get out much. The area is in the Middle of the Yacolt Burn, a large fire complex that burned in 1902 and killed 38 people in Washington. Lots of down trees all over the place related to the burn. Like you say, now that I do not have to worry about being growled at, and things sneaking up behind me, I can explore the area more thoroughly. Perhaps there is a hidden opening to the tube I have not found and it was used by BF for some purpose.

Friday I returned to the area and spent the day. My objective was to explore the possibility that it did contain a lava tube. Winter is the best time to penetrate the areas thick underbrush since leafy plants are for the most part, leafless right now. Rather than derail this thread I will take it to my field work thread. I think I answered what attraction this area had for local BF and got one possible clue on recent BF activity.