When is the last time a well funded expedition when out for a few months looking ?

[7.62]

DWA nice read on the NAWAC

 

thanks

[Guest Cricket]

I read the entire first NAWAC report and I also read the link DWA provided for this latest study.  I would like to see them recording information in a way that takes it to a different level, one where they can do something with the variety of activities they are encountering beyond just verbally noting them in journal form.  I did one primate observation project, it was admittedly not done in a natural setting but at a zoo, yet I did have a plan before I started.  I sat and recorded observations over a 5 hour period at one minute intervals.  I was looking specifically at spatial relationships between squirrel monkeys and howler monkeys that shared an enclosure, and I was able to quantify my observations and extract some kind of patterns.  And I picked up on a few interesting things that were not readily apparent.  Granted, actually being able to watch what you're studying makes a huge difference, but I still have the feeling that the kinds of things that are happening in these NAWAC expeditions and also the various tree structures so many people encounter could be approached in a more systematic way.  On another occasion I was asked by my Southwest archaeology professor to write a taphonomy study paper for potential publication based on the field notes some of his previous students had taken over a period of a couple months regarding a buffalo carcass on a private ranch.  I was not involved in the actual project at the time, so all I had were their notes.  Yes, they took daily observations, but I ran into the similar kind of data gathering methodology problem as what I'm noticing in reading the NAWAC reports, and I had to abandon the paper after several weeks of trying to work with the information I was given.  There were some methodological problems in how they conceived and recorded the observations, inconsistencies from observer to observer, that kind of thing, observations not made in way that could be transformed into data that could be processed in a systematic way, etc.  Very disappointing.   

Edited June 25, 2017 by Cricket

[OldMort]

On ‎6‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 7:01 PM, Martin said:

Peter Byrne got $5,000,000 for Bigfootin in 1993 from the  Academy of Applied Science.

 

http://www.bigfootencounters.com/interviews/franzoni.htm

 

Richard Greenwell in 1999 completed a well documented expedition into the Six Rivers National Forest.

 

http://sbwm.erols.com/bdwilner/.../cryptozoo/sixrivers.html

 

Regardless of newbie claims, serious money and expertise has been invested in the search for bigfoot.

 

Thanks Martin. The Greenwell link is really fascinating!

 

[BobbyO]

On 22 June 2017 at 2:55 AM, Twist said:

When I go in the woods for a week, I usually spend about 250 - 300 a week.  That is just to camp and enjoy.  No equipment to document or record other than an ipad or iphone.  Most of that is beer money btw.  I'm game !!! lol 

 

Then add loss of earnings on top of that right ?

[Twist]

Just now, BobbyO said:

 

Then add loss of earnings on top of that right ?

 

Personally because I only go out for a week at a time I'm on paid vacation time, without a an exception to the rules which can happen in my company I could get two weeks paid off.  For a whole month I'd be doing 2 paid and 2 unpaid unless I asked for an exception to the rules. 

 

So yes, the loss of earnings could jump the numbers considerably.  

[BobbyO]

Ahhhh ok of course.

 

As a "self employed" it's always in my head.

 

I forget that there's a world with paid vacation etc hahaha.

[Twist]

lol yeah it's one of the few perks of working for the man vs. being the man.  

[7.62]

5 million to me is an astronomical amount of money to be funded for this type of endeavor .

 

I was thinking gear wise  and all supplies needed minus individual money needed $200,000  could outfit a nice expedition .

 

The problem is bills don't stop being mailed to us in the real world . , mortgages , truck payments etc..

 

Edited June 26, 2017 by 7.62

[Guest Cricket]

Here's what an expedition needs!  Forget the plaster: 

"...Subjects walked bare-foot at their self-selected normal walking speed down a

6.1 m long mechanized gait carpet (Gaitrite, Inc.) which

collects real-time data on walking parameters, such as

stride length, velocity and foot fall angle. Continuous

with the gait carpet was an HR Mat VersaTek (Tekscan,

Inc.) plantar pressure mat that collects high-resolution

(4 sensor elements/cm2) data at 185Hz..." 

http://www.bu.edu/motordevlab/files/2015/01/ajpa22699.pdf

 

Seriously, I keep reading and hearing reports that BF comes around these extended expedition camp sites, sometimes very close, so having something like this in key spots might actually work. 

 

[FarArcher]

4 hours ago, 7.62 said:

5 million to me is an astronomical amount of money to be funded for this type of endeavor .

 

I was thinking gear wise  and all supplies needed minus individual money needed $200,000  could outfit a nice expedition .

 

The problem is bills don't stop being mailed to us in the real world . , mortgages , truck payments etc..

 

 

I think some of these "expeditions" is a reason for a bunch of guys to go out and drink, get out of the house, and away from the wife.  Then you'll have those who are enthusiasts who have a total lack of good, solid field practices - and they nullify their own efforts.  Then you'll have less than a handful of interested, real scientists, but again, they go looking and lacking light, movement, or noise discipline - they too, nullify their own efforts.

 

Others go out with preconceived notions of how best to get good evidence of these things, and if they think for a moment they're up against an animal - well - if you don't know what you're seeking - you'll never find it as you'll use the wrong practices.  A deer hunt is much different from a bear hunt, which is different from a rabbit hunt, which is much different from a lion hunt, which is different from a Cape Buffalo hunt.  Same with fishing.  You fish for bream in the Gulf of Mexico - your luck will positively suck.

 

But I credit those who are serious, who take care to take the time to go and try to get any kind of evidence.  One day.  One day, we'll have good, solid evidence.

 

Because they're out there.  As many here know.

[Yuchi1]

The link provided by DWA regarding NAWAC's "operation" IMO, furnishes another catalog of what not to do in such an endeavor. For instance, if you want to kill one of these entities wouldn't the time of year where visibility was optimum and a dearth of food resources dictating more movement by the subject be (on it's face) a better option? Well, it could be only if you had access to ~6200 acres of private land instead of 10 acres and held to that spot and did not commit trespass on adjoining land.

 

Additionally, there are a couple of inaccuracies contained within it such as the statement there were no permanent residences in the area. Within a 1.5 mile radius of the Branson 10 acre plot, there are five (5) residences in existence with two (2) of those having the second/third generation of habitation by family members. I wouldn't describe access as rugged since your basic Honda Civic could easily drive to the front gate of Area "X". However, in deference to their apparent urbanite mindset, the area may have appeared as something out of darkest Africa.

 

 

 

[wiiawiwb]

One thing in particular I found fascinating with their conclusion, to a person, that wood apes produce a sound similar to wood knocking.

 

That would certainly explain why many of us have wondered how a wood-knock reply could occur so quickly after a wood knock we made.

[Yuchi1]

^^^ When reading through the Monograph, they recorded ~42 incidents of trees being felled/slammed over near the cabins. You'd think that would have furnished a helluva kill zone?

[hiflier]

The Ouachita National Forest and therefore Area X are crawling with copperheads, diamondback rattlers, and water moccasin snakes. Would a bite to the foot of a BF be as dangerous for the creature as it would for the snake??!?? Even if Sasquatch had vision in the infrared wavelength, snakes are cold blooded and so take on the temperature of their surroundings. Would this then mean that even with IR vision the snakes wouldn't be detectable?

Edited July 3, 2017 by hiflier

[Yuchi1]

Snakes are indeed prevalent in the area however, the black bear density has exploded like lawyers showing up at a auto wreck.

 

We had to pull all the feeders off the mountain as they were wrecking them left & right. Now, the sows/cubs are showing up in the river bottom possibly having been run off and escaping the boars prowling the mountaintop.

 

We've found fresh scat almost every trip up onto the higher benches looking for burial evidence in the caves and crevices.

 

Another critter that's made a fresh appearance in significant numbers the past ~24 months are feral swine. The landowner recently spent $1K+ to have a trio of his Rhodesian Ridgebacks and one Mountain Cur stitched up after a fight with a boar that weighed >400# on the cotton scales.

 

A year ago last October I walked into a group of sows and footballs while checking out a lane under the bluff along the Arkansas River side of our Pawnee lease. The big gal charged me and am here to testify the .38 Hornady +P will penetrate to the vitals.

 

A week later while up top on the western edge, climbing up to a hanging stand I had perched out over the bluff top, I PO'd a huge boar that apparently had been bedded under an outcrop ~20 yards from the stand.

 

He ran back and forth along the rim looking for me growling and snorting akin to a bear growl. The bow was still slung on my back but managed to unholster the 1911. Couldn't get a good shot as he crashed through the cedar brush near the stand. Finally, he bailed off into the coulee down to the river bottom.

 

Bottom line, the Kiamichi's are full of bear and hogs. They are usually big & black which possibly creates the catalyst for misidentification, especially if a person's mindset has already been pre-primed to be looking for something else.