The Sasquatch Mind.....and Body

January 18, 2018

18 hours ago, ioyza said:

Ohhh, none. In truth I was being a bit glib about presenting a speculation: perhaps they progress along a different axis of cultural or intellectual advancement, one that can't be measured by technological achievements.

Although I'd also say, though it isn't direct evidence per se, that consistent evasion of 50+ years of our efforts to prove their existence demonstrates a certain superior intellect.

But consider it this way: some humans have achieved some remarkable things through meditation, controlling heart rate or body temperature for example. Perhaps there are powers of mind far beyond our comprehension, and sasquatch, not being so consumed with material problem solving by necessity, progressed along that path perpendicular to our own.

There are reasons to think that could be the case. The Native Americans seem to think along these lines, and habituators frequently talk about them this way too. There are also those who claim experiences with sasquatch that transcend what we think of as "normal," and we insist that those posts get their own home down below the general section. I think MIB's point is astute and that's kind of been my creeping realization with myself over the past year or two: who am I to scoff at others' alleged experiences, when I seven or eight years ago would've scoffed at my own experiences since then?

One final line of reasoning on intelligence vs culture: the Sierra Sounds and their spoken language. This is evidence-based, and it certainly indicates we're dealing with something way beyond extant great apes. If they have a spoken language, is it reasonable to expect that they produce no cultural artifacts because they're incapable? If they're too primitive of mind to produce technology, why do they seem to understand the uses of our own, such as guns and cameras? If they do understand our technology to some extent through observation, why don't they try to emulate it? Why don't they steal a grill lighter and build a little fire to cook over?

My assertion is that they don't need to, they realize it would draw unwanted attention, and they choose not to.

All good points. I was curious if you had experiences that you had not chosen to share. There are some in that camp here. I think I have heard their speech one time. Sounded like a young girl speaking some kind of Asian language. But since I did not see the speaker I cannot say definitively that it was a BF. If they do have speech that certainly puts them in some rough equivalency to humans and differentiates them from animals.

Use of fire is problematic. As I have mentioned before, they might use it in certain circumstances if they happen on a lightning caused fire. Fire of opportunity as was indicated in early use by humans. . One has to have developed some level of technology to create fire from dry materials. We really do not see that level of cultural artifact tool use by BF in anything else. Could be there, but just not observed. Who knows! But as Native Americans and early European explorers found out, if you make fire in enemy (unfriendly) territory, you risk detection. Smoke rising is a dead giveaway someone is out there in your territory. That can be mitigated by only burning fires at night where it is more difficult to see the smoke and having the fires in depressions or gully's or caves where the light cannot be seen. Even those measures are not 100 percent reliable in masking the use of fire. Smell of fire spreads down wind for long distances. You could be right that given the problems of hiding fires from humans, BF either uses fire rarely or not at all by choice. I see humans running around in near freezing weather in shorts with no coat so maybe BF are like those humans and don't need fire for warmth. Caves or lava tubes seem to be a likely shelter during cold weather. The outside temperature could be well below freezing and the interior of the cave or tube relatively comfortable, especially if several BF are sheltering inside raising the temperature even more. They have had thousands of years to find such caves or lava tubes. I wonder how many of them the NA knew about and avoided but are now lost to human knowledge.

Edited January 18, 2018 by SWWASAS

January 19, 2018

On ‎1‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 9:28 AM, southernyahoo said:

I often toy around with the two conflicting theories about sasquatch in my mind. On one hand it has to be incredibly smart and intent on hiding and keeping it's entire species off our official books, yet primitive enough to live without fire and elaborate tools and shelters. If they have a language they'll be on the human side of things, and it would nearly take a language to convey the message they have to hide among themselves.

Incredibly smart yes. But as for it's intent keeping it's entire species off our official books goes? It has not succeeded because it's an impossible outcome- the thousands of reports say so. Instead, I am sure that there are those HUMANS who have been intent on keeping the entire species off of the official books. I could say so much more but then I would be seen as the epitome of the classic crackpot that agencies and the media have steered the publics perception of such folks into.

Spring is only a couple of months away and it has been brutally cold this year. I doubt anyone will bring in a live one- or even shoot one. It HAS to be a carcass or skeleton left over from the winter or chances are 2018 will end up another year with nothing to present to science. Now is the time to seriously plan for an all out search for a specimen's remains as a result of being too old, sick, injured, or starved to have survived the winter season. Late Winter or early Spring is key though as it is the only way to beat any scavengers and Nature to the punch. This has been my mantra for three years now as I STILL think it holds the best chance for success.

January 19, 2018

10 hours ago, hiflier said:

Spring is only a couple of months away and it has been brutally cold this year.

That depends on where you're at. We broke 2 record highs this week. A town 100 miles north of me crushed their record by 9 degrees. The old record was 62, the new one, 71. Saturday I was hiking at 3700 feet where there should have been a foot or two of snow ... none. Sunday, I was at 5100 feet where it would normally be waist deep ... none, bare ground. Monday I was fishing in a creek at 3500 feet that normally should be bank full and muddy ... low, clear, green water ... and where there should be 18 inches of snow, none. So while the east is getting whacked, parts of the west are experiencing one of the warmest winters on record ... so far. The pattern is changing, at least in the short run, to something more normal for us. Looking at the long term seasonal forecasts from NOAA, we should expect normal precip and temp for 2-3 months, then it is supposed to get warmer and drier than average through the 14 month forecast.

The point is .. where you're at, absolutely, the winter presents seemingly unique opportunities, but those opportunities do not translate to similar opportunities elsewhere across the continent.

MIB

January 20, 2018

20 hours ago, hiflier said:

Incredibly smart yes. But as for it's intent keeping it's entire species off our official books goes? It has not succeeded because it's an impossible outcome- the thousands of reports say so. Instead, I am sure that there are those HUMANS who have been intent on keeping the entire species off of the official books. I could say so much more but then I would be seen as the epitome of the classic crackpot that agencies and the media have steered the publics perception of such folks into.

Spring is only a couple of months away and it has been brutally cold this year. I doubt anyone will bring in a live one- or even shoot one. It HAS to be a carcass or skeleton left over from the winter or chances are 2018 will end up another year with nothing to present to science. Now is the time to seriously plan for an all out search for a specimen's remains as a result of being too old, sick, injured, or starved to have survived the winter season. Late Winter or early Spring is key though as it is the only way to beat any scavengers and Nature to the punch. This has been my mantra for three years now as I STILL think it holds the best chance for success.

Yeah, I was omitting the help they get from us in staying off the books and of coarse anything supernatural. One would think that even a cover up would collapse sooner or later, but at the end of the day there has to be the evidence available for all to accept. If that evidence has ever been had, then I'd have to conclude that it was decided for us that they are better off unproven, or that we would be.

January 20, 2018

I've always believed they're better off unproven. Once the successful hunter lays a body upon the morgue table, all hell will break loose.

Women and children will leave the forest on day one. Those uncertain will never set foot in the woods and the public at large will take cover. The bounty hunters will come running and dangerously populate the woods. "Gotta git me one of them thar squatches!"

I pray that no sasquatch is ever presented for examination.

January 20, 2018

25 minutes ago, southernyahoo said:

Yeah, I was omitting the help they get from us in staying off the books and of coarse anything supernatural. One would think that even a cover up would collapse sooner or later, but at the end of the day there has to be the evidence available for all to accept. If that evidence has ever been had, then I'd have to conclude that it was decided for us that they are better off unproven, or that we would be.

And that will go for on how long? Indefinitely?

16 minutes ago, wiiawiwb said:

I've always believed they're better off unproven. Once the successful hunter lays a body upon the morgue table, all hell will break loose.

Women and children will leave the forest on day one. Those uncertain will never set foot in the woods and the public at large will take cover. The bounty hunters will come running and dangerously populate the woods. "Gotta git me one of them thar squatches!"

I pray that no sasquatch is ever presented for examination.

I don't wish to sound difficult for either of you because I hold you both in high respect BUT! You both need to comes to terms with the idea that Sasquatch will eventually be discovered/disclosed. What you are saying then is that even though proof may be somehow hidden from the public- or otherwise not desired as a public discovery- that the current status quo is fine? It leaves the 'carrot' dangling for an awful lot of believers who want the truth does it not? It allows Finding Bigfoot to run for 15 more seasons to find........nothing.

My point is what's the hold up? Preparing the public for discovery makes no sense as the public cannot BE readied later any more than now. It's the same for the UFO crowd also who use the same phrase regarding preparing the unready public gradually before Alien disclosure. It's a game in both camps that needs to be stopped. Tell me NOW that Sasquatch are real. Tell me NOW that Aliens are real. And get it over with. But if someone is around shooting off their mouths regarding taking any action to get either of those 'truths' out in the open someone always comes along and effectively takes the fuse out of the cannon. Happens every single time. NO ONE is allowed an answer.

How nice that someone claims they have seen a Sasquatch, How nice that someone claims to habituate them. As nice as those things sound though they WILL NOT save their habitat if one has been paying attention to what the environment on the verge of experiencing. It isn't just Sasquatch here, it's US now too. But Humans are important enough to have ever put the breaks on our own destruction of our environment. Greed is a juggernaut that will not be stopped. The question is: Can the discovery and disclosure of a Sasquatch stop the juggernaut? Or is diffusing the seriousness of the issue more important and so more heavily invested in? I'll vote for the latter because as far as I can see neither Human nor Sasquatch nor any other living creature is going to win this one. It's simply too late.

The ethic behind a couple of folks here who are pro-kill is spot on. They already know there is only one way to halt the laying to waste what is left of our ecological sanctuaries. That there is one and only one answer. In fact I'm pretty sure we all know what that answer is too no matter how much it may seem wrong. In the long run it is morally correct and thinking more in the long term helps greatly in clearing out any confusion regarding that.

Just lobbing my two rock into the camp. Had to get it off my chest. And now back under my own rock........where I've learned I belong.

And

January 20, 2018

I'm reminded of the Chinese proverb about being careful about what you wish for. Now, with sasquatch be considered a myth or legend in most circles, there is a truce that does work.

Women can take their kids on a hike in the woods without fear of an 8' hairy monster following them. It's only a myth. Do you think that family is going to skip along the trail when it's confirmed sasquatches are really out there? Not a chance. How about the urban family that jumps in the station wagon and goes into the wild for a camping weekend? At the first snap of a twig, they'd be out of their tents, in the car and barreling down the road for home. Help me. Just get me and my family out of here alive. How about schools that have a playground near the edge of a forest? Ok kiddo, no playing outside today.

Human behavior will dramatically change when that day of revelation comes. Say goodbye to cub scout, girl scout, or boy scout excursions into the back country. Say good bye to adventures of birding enthusiasts who won't dare step into the woods to catch a glimpse of the ivory-billed woodpecker. How about a lot of hiking clubs? No question whatsoever that many will hang up their hiking boots rather than go where king kong lives.

Right now, we have an uneasy, or uncomfortable, truth that simply works. We can label it in any manner we like. In some cases, ignorance truly is bliss and maybe, just maybe, in this instance it's best.

January 20, 2018

Not so sure about most of that since right now naturalist idiots are promoting more packs of wolves in areas once devoid of them While wolves are normally reclusive, avoid humans, and attacks against humans are rare, the thought of wolf packs are not terribly comforting to me. The larger the packs the more aggressive and dangerous they are to humans. I consider wolves and BF about the same level of danger. But that is not enough for the naturalists. They want to expand grizzly bear into areas where they have not been for a 100 years. The bears were eradicated because of their danger to humans and livestock. That disregard for human life just shows you that some don't really care a much about human safety as they want some sort of natural diversity of wild animals. So if BF were accepted, I don't see danger to humans even being a factor to the vocal naturalist crowd. They might push for nature preserves and restrict human presence in very active BF habitat. Certainly BF would be considered endangered at the outset. RIght now the location of some of the wilderness areas in SW Washington are suspect to me. As seen from the air, some seem rather unremarkable and one would think that far prettier areas nearby would have been designated wilderness areas instead of the ones that were. One wonders why one area and not others get the designation.

January 20, 2018

Doom and gloom abounds, hereabouts.

January 20, 2018

I think there would be some initial fear from some of the general public if BF were acknowledged. I also think it would pass rather quickly, BF’s do not seem to be out killing humans now so the fear would fade with the lack of news reports possibly.

January 20, 2018

I agree in that most people know how dangerous grizzly are but still venture out in the woods. BF are so reclusive I don't think most with any knowledge of them would be afraid. I worry more for the BF than I do the humans. We had a local poacher ring that killed dozens of animals without permits or season. Morons like that would want that trophy.

January 20, 2018

Agreed that trophy hunters would come about, BF would still be awfully stealthy however, I do not doubt it would adapt and survive lol

January 21, 2018

22 hours ago, hiflier said:

And that will go for on how long? Indefinitely?

Until we're deemed ready I guess. I think we might be getting derailed a little here, but the sasquatch mind is key here, and would affect post "proven" decisions about whether and when they would be exposed as real.

January 22, 2018

On 1/19/2018 at 7:00 PM, hiflier said:

And that will go for on how long? Indefinitely?

I don't wish to sound difficult for either of you because I hold you both in high respect BUT! You both need to comes to terms with the idea that Sasquatch will eventually be discovered/disclosed. What you are saying then is that even though proof may be somehow hidden from the public- or otherwise not desired as a public discovery- that the current status quo is fine? It leaves the 'carrot' dangling for an awful lot of believers who want the truth does it not? It allows Finding Bigfoot to run for 15 more seasons to find........nothing.

My point is what's the hold up? Preparing the public for discovery makes no sense as the public cannot BE readied later any more than now. It's the same for the UFO crowd also who use the same phrase regarding preparing the unready public gradually before Alien disclosure. It's a game in both camps that needs to be stopped. Tell me NOW that Sasquatch are real. Tell me NOW that Aliens are real. And get it over with. But if someone is around shooting off their mouths regarding taking any action to get either of those 'truths' out in the open someone always comes along and effectively takes the fuse out of the cannon. Happens every single time. NO ONE is allowed an answer.

How nice that someone claims they have seen a Sasquatch, How nice that someone claims to habituate them. As nice as those things sound though they WILL NOT save their habitat if one has been paying attention to what the environment on the verge of experiencing. It isn't just Sasquatch here, it's US now too. But Humans are important enough to have ever put the breaks on our own destruction of our environment. Greed is a juggernaut that will not be stopped. The question is: Can the discovery and disclosure of a Sasquatch stop the juggernaut? Or is diffusing the seriousness of the issue more important and so more heavily invested in? I'll vote for the latter because as far as I can see neither Human nor Sasquatch nor any other living creature is going to win this one. It's simply too late.

The ethic behind a couple of folks here who are pro-kill is spot on. They already know there is only one way to halt the laying to waste what is left of our ecological sanctuaries. That there is one and only one answer. In fact I'm pretty sure we all know what that answer is too no matter how much it may seem wrong. In the long run it is morally correct and thinking more in the long term helps greatly in clearing out any confusion regarding that.

Just lobbing my two rock into the camp. Had to get it off my chest. And now back under my own rock........where I've learned I belong.

And

Bulldozers and asphalt parking lots always trump bounty hunters. What luck have we had in shooting one thus far!? Is that going to change because one individual slipped on the proverbial banana peel? No.

But once the parking lot is built, the golf course, the condo, the grocery store? It’s gone. That habitat is lost forever. Go look at the I5 corridor. It’s a concrete jungle from the Canadian border down in to central Oregon. Gone.

Will such a discovery stop the bulldozers? This isn’t just another animal folks. Presumably it’s the only other bipedal primate left on this earth. We are not alone. What could a discovery like this teach us about human evolution? I think without a doubt that Bigfoot habitat would be identified and set aside and patrolled by rangers not unlike the Virunga. That eco tourism would flourish. And legislation would be passed protecting the species forever.

That is my belief FWIW.

January 22, 2018

This is the way I see it, which should be no surprise to those who have been around a while. Regardless of the Sasquatch intellect, someone knows that the creature exists- beyond of the 'knowers' here that is. The real issue is 'that someone' isn't talking, and none of us have access to 'that someone'. So no one can gain the truth about Sasquatch outside of a researcher in the field or someone on this Forum. The easy thing to say, and we hear it all the time, is that there is no way anyone will hear the truth uttered by anyone in any kind of official capacity- not through mainstream science and through government nor any of its bureaus or agencies. My question is, and always has been: Is this really true?

Edited January 22, 2018 by hiflier

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