Guest PastorTim Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I have recently read a bunch of info on tree knocking since the debut of a certain show where a certain researcher and organization president made claims that he discovered tree knocking even though Jeff Meldrum documents the phenomena back to 1959. The problem is that this idea of "tree" knocking is not logical. I am not denying that something is responding, but I just find it foolish to think that a.) bigfoot always carries a club that sounds the same when smashed upon every tree, or b.) that bigfoot can always scramble to find that club in darkness within to find the perfect club seconds after hearing a researcher hit a tree. I just do not buy this tree knocking idea and there is no evidence of it except for a sound that sounds like a wood knock. I think it is much more plausible that the knocking is either a type of clap or chest strike that can be easily seen in other primates. There are quite a few articles that I won't link to here, but it is much more logical for bigfoot behavior to replicate known primate behavior instead of illogical theory with no evidence. Just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 PastorTim, I recall reading somewhere that tree knocking is known among chimpanzees, but they strike a tree with a cupped hand. The one tree knock (purported, of course) I heard certainly sounded as if someone whacked the crap out of a tree with a Louisville Slugger, so it's hard for me to imagine that hand (even huge hand) to tree contact was involved. I would think bigfoots would have no problem finding wooden clubs throughout their forest homes and would be perfectly capable of wailing them against trees if they wanted to. Whether it's wood on wood, hand on wood, or hand on flesh will likely have to wait until someone catches one in the act. I've read one report where a guy saw a bigfoot using a club to knock trees, but it wasn't to communicate, it was to knock a raccoon out of a tree. Pteronarcyd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PastorTim Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 PastorTim, I recall reading somewhere that tree knocking is known among chimpanzees, but they strike a tree with a cupped hand. The one tree knock (purported, of course) I heard certainly sounded as if someone whacked the crap out of a tree with a Louisville Slugger, so it's hard for me to imagine that hand (even huge hand) to tree contact was involved. I would think bigfoots would have no problem finding wooden clubs throughout their forest homes and would be perfectly capable of wailing them against trees if they wanted to. Whether it's wood on wood, hand on wood, or hand on flesh will likely have to wait until someone catches one in the act. I've read one report where a guy saw a bigfoot using a club to knock trees, but it wasn't to communicate, it was to knock a raccoon out of a tree. Pteronarcyd Thank you for your response, but it still isn't logical. It isn't a matter of being able to find a club in the forest. Anyone can do that. It is a matter of finding a club in 10 seconds in the dark, making sure it is the right size or snapping it off a tree, answering with the same tone every time, and doing this consistently. If you take a stick and knock it on a tree, it will make a different tone depending on the tree type, size and stick attributes. These proposed wood knocks do not do that. They always sound the same even though the animal is obviously moving. Next time you are in the woods at night, pay attention to where a club would come from or try to go get one within a few seconds of hearing a knock. It cannot be had in 10-30 seconds. It doesn't matter who the searcher is. I have never heard or seen documentation for chimps hitting a tree for communication purposes. I'm not sure if that is a logical form of communication either, since a chimp's flesh to wood wouldn't make a relevant noise. It would not be much different than you or me doing it. You cannot make a relevant noise even remotely similar to the proposed wood knock. Even a bf hand to tree would not produce that sound. Thanks for the input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Holliday Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 (edited) assuming this is bf/bf related , i suspect a lot of knocking by researchers goes unanswered. so perhaps bf either knew it wasnt one of his buddies, was not able to find a club in 10 seconds or so as mentioned , or was never there to begin with. as far as the assumption knocks are the same tone consistently every time, a fellow would have to hear a lot of knocks over time to conclude all knocks are consistent. knocking is something easily duplicated by a person, so with out actually seeing ol' bf dialing up his buddies( can you hear me now?, back woods style) you really couldnt say for sure it was a bf. if in fact bfs do knock, or do something similar to a chimp, & with the size bf is reported to have, i suspect a squatch would have a lot more "horsepower" to apply , and thus could be capable of either hitting something soundly with or w/ out a stick. ever hear a ticked off wild turkey gobbler cluck at close range? its a coarse sound that sounds a lot like a sharp knock,& i duplicate it w/ a box call by sharply striking the lid on the call just right. so if it is a bf making a knocking sounds perhaps w/ all that horsepower it could generate a vocal " knock " as well..... just a thought. as usual, its all speculation at this point......... Edited June 13, 2011 by slicktrick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 PastorTim, I can't comment on multiple knocks, as I've only heard the one. It sure sounded like wood on wood to me. Is there a gorilla chest thumping clip you can provide a link to that is similar to what you are hypothesizing? Thanks, Pteronarcyd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indiefoot Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I've asked a couple of times and still haven't seen a photo of a tree with evidence of being used or of a club with the kind of attributes and marks you would expect. As often as this type of thing is reported, I keep expecting someone to find a tree with the scuff marks and a club laying near by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PastorTim Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 PastorTim, I can't comment on multiple knocks, as I've only heard the one. It sure sounded like wood on wood to me. Is there a gorilla chest thumping clip you can provide a link to that is similar to what you are hypothesizing? Thanks, Pteronarcyd Please actually read "The Year of the Gorilla" by George Schaller. It is a scientific approach and documentation of behavior. He discusses how different primates make hollow sounds that sound like tree striking. At tims their sounds can be heard a mile away. There are actually many fascinating things that apes do to make sounds we dont understand and cannot replicate obviously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TooRisky Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 (edited) I have recently read a bunch of info on tree knocking since the debut of a certain show where a certain researcher and organization president made claims that he discovered tree knocking even though Jeff Meldrum documents the phenomena back to 1959. The problem is that this idea of "tree" knocking is not logical. I am not denying that something is responding, but I just find it foolish to think that a.) bigfoot always carries a club that sounds the same when smashed upon every tree, or b.) that bigfoot can always scramble to find that club in darkness within to find the perfect club seconds after hearing a researcher hit a tree. I just do not buy this tree knocking idea and there is no evidence of it except for a sound that sounds like a wood knock. I think it is much more plausible that the knocking is either a type of clap or chest strike that can be easily seen in other primates. There are quite a few articles that I won't link to here, but it is much more logical for bigfoot behavior to replicate known primate behavior instead of illogical theory with no evidence. Just my opinion. On a recent 3 day scouting trip I had some in close knocking at night... Listening to it I realized it was a rock on wood sound... So they are not scrambling around looking for a club, they grab a larger stone and wrap it on the tree trunk, which makes more sense... Edited June 13, 2011 by TooRisky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PastorTim Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 On a recent 3 day scouting trip I had some in close knocking at night... Listening to it I realized it was a rock on wood sound... So they are not scrambling around looking for a club, they grab a larger stone and wrap it on the tree trunk, which makes more sense... I don't doubt that primates do this either, and I don't doubt that bf may at times use a rock for striking. This is pretty easily documented among primate behavior. I just have serious doubts that the times that some of us have heard "wood" knocking, that bf runs, finds a rock or club, and beats a tree. Possible at certain times? Sure, but not very likely in the normal knocks I have heard of have heard recorded. I think there are those of you who know what I am talking about. When bf is there, he is just there. His knocks are not calculated. They are just a quick response to your knock or a call. Each time I have heard it (7 times) there was no time for a rock or club grab after my knock or call. It seems to be instant communication of some sort. Some hypothesize location give away. I think a lot of these theories stem from people who are experts behind their screens but never in the woods at 2am testing theories. Props to any of you who get out there and shame on those who are just IT experts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Holliday Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 bad day today pastor tim? just wondering with the " expert behind the screen "remark, hopefully things are well with you sir. so far the real experts seem to be the squatches apparently, IMHO. FWIW, ive heard knocks on 3 occasions similar to supposed squatch recordings. twice from a distance & once fairly close .. each time there was a nearly identical knock or knocks that followed closely thereafter but from further away than the first (speculation of a reply maybe??) so if it was a hoaxer he brought a friend ( cant say for sure it was or wasn't, as i couldn't see the source in the dark woods) so, im no BF expert by any means, just a hunter w/ a lot of time out there. a few posts back in this thread i mentioned the hard cluck/ knock sound of an old gobbler up close when its fighting mad, it sounds nearly wood on wood, and its a vocal sound. & no, gobblers are not squatches, but my point with that was the fact its vocal, so who's to say the "tree knock" associated w/ bf isn't possibly some sort of vocal sound as well? that might explain your instant replies & eliminate the need for a stick/rock as well. you seem to have your mind made up it isn't a stick, rock etc., so what is your theory based on research as opposed to the other guys?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bipedalist Posted June 14, 2011 BFF Patron Share Posted June 14, 2011 I think some of these alleged wood knocks could be pops or tocks with tongue in roof of mouth too. I've recorded some of these clear as a bell. Hard to figure out what else could make them at 3am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TooRisky Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 (edited) I don't doubt that primates do this either, and I don't doubt that bf may at times use a rock for striking. This is pretty easily documented among primate behavior. I just have serious doubts that the times that some of us have heard "wood" knocking, that bf runs, finds a rock or club, and beats a tree. Possible at certain times? Sure, but not very likely in the normal knocks I have heard of have heard recorded. I think there are those of you who know what I am talking about. When bf is there, he is just there. His knocks are not calculated. They are just a quick response to your knock or a call. Each time I have heard it (7 times) there was no time for a rock or club grab after my knock or call. It seems to be instant communication of some sort. Some hypothesize location give away. I think a lot of these theories stem from people who are experts behind their screens but never in the woods at 2am testing theories. Props to any of you who get out there and shame on those who are just IT experts. Well you seem to be having a problem with the whole timing and stuck on what appears to be a situation where the species is struggling to find something either club or stick to use... My recent encounter was that I started the knocking and brought the species in from far away, after the start I was reacting to the species as it came closer... So knocking was a challenge, the species took the challenge and came towards the knocking, it then knocked as it got closer and was returned by me... So the species as it came closer was finding the rock along its path and then made the challenge knock... I in turn returned my knock after a few minutes... This went on till 1 or 2 in the morning when I was vocally challenged from across the creek from me... I feel your thinking is off base on this topic, realize this species moves and uses the things it finds along the way to do what the species does, in this case find good rocks to knock against a solid tree trunk as it seeks out what it considers a possible intruder, which is speculation at this point... This was written up and documented on our website and you are invited to read it and the numerous other encounters that are out there on the internet... The biggest thing one needs to have is an open mind, and have the courage to actually get into the field to test your theory. Edited June 14, 2011 by Squatchdetective Violation of Rule 1a Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Please actually read "The Year of the Gorilla" by George Schaller. It is a scientific approach and documentation of behavior. He discusses how different primates make hollow sounds that sound like tree striking. At tims their sounds can be heard a mile away. There are actually many fascinating things that apes do to make sounds we dont understand and cannot replicate obviously. PastorTim, Thanks for the recommendation, but your summary of the book tells me what I want to know -- that gorillas can make a woodknocking sound by chest thumping. If so, it seems reasonable to assume that a bigfoot could do the same; except -- why can't humans do it? When I beat my chest I get a flat, dull sound -- nothing like the vibrant sound of a purported woodknock. What does a gorilla have that I don't have? Pteronarcyd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 (edited) I think some of these alleged wood knocks could be pops or tocks with tongue in roof of mouth too. I've recorded some of these clear as a bell. Hard to figure out what else could make them at 3am. Yes, I would agree...and have recorded the same. I think there might be different kinds of "knocks" produced, by the subject. I have heard some knocks, that were louder...and no mistake (to me) , that they sounded just like wood on wood. Others I've heard (including recordings) were more questionable, and could be produced from some kind of chest beating or clapping. All the opinions in this thread, could be correct. Just my two cents. Edited June 14, 2011 by imonacan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BFSleuth Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 I have recently read a bunch of info on tree knocking since the debut of a certain show where a certain researcher and organization president made claims that he discovered tree knocking even though Jeff Meldrum documents the phenomena back to 1959. The problem is that this idea of "tree" knocking is not logical. I am not denying that something is responding, but I just find it foolish to think that a.) bigfoot always carries a club that sounds the same when smashed upon every tree, or b.) that bigfoot can always scramble to find that club in darkness within to find the perfect club seconds after hearing a researcher hit a tree. I just do not buy this tree knocking idea and there is no evidence of it except for a sound that sounds like a wood knock. I think it is much more plausible that the knocking is either a type of clap or chest strike that can be easily seen in other primates. There are quite a few articles that I won't link to here, but it is much more logical for bigfoot behavior to replicate known primate behavior instead of illogical theory with no evidence. Just my opinion. This hunter observed BF tree knocking behavior: http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_report.asp?id=27075 I'm not sure why you think this behavior is "not logical". During disputes primates will grab branches and thrash about in loud displays. If BF is a primate then this behavior would be within the repertoire of a large primate. If BF is a hominin, as many are now theorizing, then trying to peg BF behavior only to expected primate behavior wouldn't necessarily apply either. Homo sapiens from ancient times used drumming for communication, and it would be logical to expect that other hominins may also have this trait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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