How Has This Forum Affected Your Belief In Bf?

[Guest]

As I said in my previous post, "You took what I said out of context. I didn't say "calling someone out". I was not talking about individuals"

You said in response, "Insofar as everyone is entitled to their opinion, to a very valid degree "calling someone out" on their opinion is also a way to suppress their opinion and leads down the slippery slope of censorship."

My response to you had nothing to do with the difference between Paranormal and Supernatural.

The internet certainly is full of opinions, but twisting the words of someone else's opinion to suit your own isn't the best way to get your point across, IMO.

Will apologize as you are correct I was refering to Paranormal and you hadn't mentioned it.

However....for clarity, it would be helpful if you defined what "Supernatural Bigfoot People" as a group means to you? Not asking to start a debate, just for clarity. PM me it would be easier.

Thanks,

GJ

[kitakaze]

I actually leaned towards believing until I began to spend time on the old BFF and came to understand that squatch "facts" are nothing of the sort.

I found that the old truism "keep repeating something and it will become the truth" is a very honest representation of the "facts" surrounding this myth.

People with no training, experience, skill, or certification are cited as "experts" with such stunning regularity that they are accepted as such. Farenbach for example. His notions concerning gross hair morphology is outdated and inaccurate; and, the fact that his "sasquatch hairs" are "indistinguishable from human hair" is such a dead giveaway as to make someone familiar with the topic belly laugh.

The idea that there exists a cross cultural myth throughout the North American Indigenous population about a giant hairy bi-pedal primate is an utter crock - yet people actually believe this and use it as a reason for "believing" when there is absolutely no validity to this "fact"! People actually cite other squatch believers and squatch websites without any realization that they are not citing real research that has been verified by in depth study and peer review! THE ACTUAL PEER REVIEWED RESEARCH IS TOTALLY IGNORED!

Of course - the fact that "beliefs" that are touted as being "real" by the squatch proponents that go hand in hand with the other "beliefs" that are purposefully and conveniently ignored is very telling.

Who on this board believes that Indian maidens were kidnapped by giant beavers and mated with and produced beaver/human offspring? (Algonquin). Why not? Why should that belief be less alluring than giant hairy bi-pedal primates kidnapped Indian maidens and produced offspring? Because it fits in with what you WANT to believe, of course.

What about Gods in the form of bears giving three Chiefs the ability to write and when discovering that the Chiefs did not share this knowledge with the people - turn them into a Giant Stone? (Sto:lo). Why not believe that story as much as the same tribe's story about squatches? Because it fits in with what you WANT to believe, of course.

I learned that the "Skookum Cast" was definitely an elk lay. No ifs and/or butts (pun intended) about it.

I learned that Chilcutt did a flawed analysis of casts of questionable provenance. He did not come even close to what he knows is the minimum standard of "evidence" with his so-called "dermal ridges" that were shown to be casting artifacts by actual dedicated researchers who followed tried and true research methods that are repeatable and falsifiable.

I learned that the so-called "Four Horsemen" were very poor in the way of research and interviewing skills. They were much more interested in self promotion and the being the first with the "find of the century" than any sort of real investigations. I learned that their lack of any proper investigative and proper research abilities has caused many of the problems in today's beliefs about this phenomenon. If anyone had bothered to ask: "Say Roger, exactly how did you get that film developed and here so fast?" - one of the greatest pieces of "evidence" would have been put to rest very quickly.

I learned that the vast majority of people have no idea what a living foot does when it hits the ground and lifts off in various soil types.

Most of all - I learned that "belief" is very much uninfluenced and uninhibited by the actual truth.

All this IMHO, of course.

edited for spelllink

[Guest Cervelo]

THATS FRIGGIN AWESOME! Rockinkt and Kit!!!

[kitakaze]

Leaving aside the rest of the post, I don't understand why so many Skeptics insist on placing infrasonics in the "out there" or "wild" spectrum of potential capabilities for BF. The existence of infrasonics and it's use by various creatures is increasingly well documented, as are the potential effects of infrasound on the perceiver, which is an intriguing explanation for heretofore not readily understood or explained side-effects of some reported BF calls, as well as the "woods go silent" phenominon.

Just one of the new things and theories I learned about from visiting this forum.

I don't want to derail this thread, but I do have a question. Elephants, hippopotamuses, rhinoceros, giraffes, okapi, and alligators are all animals that can be found on land that communicate with infrasound. Which, if any, of the animals have been observed and recorded silencing all other animal life around them, including insects?

[kitakaze]

As a result, my personal desire to see the BF species documented has never been stronger in many ways, if only to finally be able to rub it in the faces of the psuedo-skeptic/denialist crowd and put a pin in their overly inflated opinion of themselves and their "arguments".

Just curious, will it suck lemons for you if Bigfoot is catalogued as a real species an skeptics happily accept the proof and are just as stoked as believers that Bigfoot is real? It's all hypothetical, I know, but I personally would be jumping for joy. I've already gone on the record that I would literally eat crow.

[Guest]

I don't want to derail this thread, but I do have a question. Elephants, hippopotamuses, rhinoceros, giraffes, okapi, and alligators are all animals that can be found on land that communicate with infrasound. Which, if any, of the animals have been observed and recorded silencing all other animal life around them, including insects?

You forgot to add "Cause the African natives extreme nausea as the elephant herd runs by the village".

[Guest]

Sweaty Yetti really helped me cement my beliefs with the work that he did in the PGF forum about why and how the PGF is real, and I've been committed to my belief that BF does exist since then.

[kitakaze]

You forgot to add "Cause the African natives extreme nausea as the elephant herd runs by the village".

The reason I wrote nothing of nausea is because I do not dispute that infrasound can disrupt the normal functioning of the middle and inner ear and in doing so can cause nausea and impaired equilibrium. I am, however skeptical that infrasound made by any of the animals I listed can cause all animal life, including insects, to go silent.

[Guest]

The reason I wrote nothing of nausea is because I do not dispute that infrasound can disrupt the normal functioning of the middle and inner ear and in doing so can cause nausea and impaired equilibrium. I am, however skeptical that infrasound made by any of the animals I listed can cause all animal life, including insects, to go silent.

I wondered about the insect thing too. I also wondered about the nausea caused at certain levels. If these other known animals produce infrasound in that same range, you would think that at some point someone would have gotten the car sick feeling while researching elephants or being near one of the herds while they were migrating. But you are right, different thread, different topic.

[Guest]

As a result, my personal desire to see the BF species documented has never been stronger in many ways, if only to finally be able to rub it in the faces of the psuedo-skeptic/denialist crowd and put a pin in their overly inflated opinion of themselves and their "arguments".

Petty? Sure. But there it is.

Yes, it is petty.

But further and worse, it's flawed logic to even think that any substance of rub (I prefer cumin, sage, brown sugar, rosemary and chili powder to name a few) would need to be rubbed in any skeptic faces. You see, at this point, it is perfectly logical and reasonable to operate under the presumption/assumption, given the beyond lacking, paltry evidence for BF, that BF actually exists.

Let me put it this way. If unicorns were proven to exist tomorrow, would or should all those who doubted their existence until then suddenly feel some sort of sweet, grainy and succulent rub smeared upon their over-weight unshaven faces? Of course not.

Why?

Because....until unicorns were proven to exist, it was perfectly reasonable up to that point to think and operate under the understanding (assumption/presumption) that unicorns were not real.

Once unicorns were proven to exist, there would be no need to feel ashamed, embarrassed or wrong for holding the previous position that they did not exist.

Sorry to break it to you, but it's the same with Bigfoot. If Bigfoot is proven real tomorrow, absolutely no skeptic here should feel any concoction of rub land upon his or her face.

[kitakaze]

WTB1, Mulder will simply tell you that thousands of people have not reported seeing unicorns. I think a more relevant analogy for a social construct in Mulder's case would be reports of alien abduction, which IIRC, he is skeptical of.

[Guest]

The reason I wrote nothing of nausea is because I do not dispute that infrasound can disrupt the normal functioning of the middle and inner ear and in doing so can cause nausea and impaired equilibrium. I am, however skeptical that infrasound made by any of the animals I listed can cause all animal life, including insects, to go silent.

Kit, I've been out in the woods and a sudden silence fell. I remember looking around and thinking that I'd better head home..and I did leave, something besides me caused all wood noises to settle down and become quiet. I'd forgotten about that until I read your post.

You know how a person can sit quietly and after a while the noise restarts, well, it did not restart and I felt frightened and returned home.

[Guest Yeti1974]

And so if aliens land on the White House lawn tomorrow and say they've been "abducting" people for years, you don't think anyone at CSICOP would be forced to eat a little crow?

Nice guys. Move along now.

[Guest]

WTB1, Mulder will simply tell you that thousands of people have not reported seeing unicorns. I think a more relevant analogy for a social construct in Mulder's case would be reports of alien abduction, which IIRC, he is skeptical of.

But Mulder's a big boy. He should be able to auto-select any comparable, unproven phenom. If he can't then maybe he isn't the 'big boy' poster I thought him to be.

The crux of my point remains. No skeptic here would need to eat crow or apply rub if BF turned up on an slab tomorrow.

And even if I'm wrong, and BF DOES turn up...well, nevermind. You get the point.

[Guest Yeti1974]

But Mulder's a big boy. He should be able to auto-select any comparable, unproven phenom. If he can't then maybe he isn't the 'big boy' poster I thought him to be.

The crux of my point remains. No skeptic here would need to eat crow or apply rub if BF turned up on an slab tomorrow.

And even if I'm wrong, and BF DOES turn up...well, nevermind. You get the point.

No, the crux of your point has been totally demolished, you just refuse to see it because for you an extreme skeptical position must be the most rational thing on the planet.