Finding Bigfoot Crew Pushes The Gentle Giant Agenda A Bit Much

[MarkGlasgow]

You can understand the Moneymaker/BFRO stance on this. They have a database packed with non-threatening encounters. Indeed their own experiences follow suit.

Perhaps we need to get these guys a Sasquatch Chronicles membership so they can catch up on all that beheading action they are obviously missing out on?

[Woodslore]

 

 

There aren't any credible reports of a Sasquatch actually attacking someone, 

How do we know that? I mean it seems whenever a person reports that it was aggressive it gets labeled right off as hoax (or so it seems). Rock throwing, tree throwing, those sound like attacks or aggressive. Native accounts talk about attacks. Russian report, yeti reports. Think we need to start accepting some of these encounters as having a little more meat on the bone. Read a fair number of reports were Sasquatch was aggressive, or acted in a manner that spoke to that effect. Read a lot of attacks. I refuse to believe that all of these are fake and hoax and that this is a gentle giant. 

 

 

You can understand the Moneymaker/BFRO stance on this. They have a database packed with non-threatening encounters. Indeed their own experiences follow suit.

 

I don't think a group trying to get proof and classification for an animal is going to report attack encounters (kind of puts up a road block). Also how many reports do they throw away? A person trying to prove their own theory will ignore things that speak to the contrary. It happens a lot, in a lot of different circles. Though I am not saying that is happening. Just saying have someone who is suppose to be an expert on the subject say they have never heard of a Sasquatch attacking or killing people, has not done a lot of looking. Lot of reports for that. 

Now to make it clear. I do not think that Sasquatch is a blood thirsty monster roaming the woods killing people for sport or for food. Nor though do I belief this is a gentle animal. I think if you are going into the field thinking this is a gentle forest animal that will/can not hurt you, you are fooling yourself. We are talking about an animal that is 7-10 feet tall. 400-800 lbs. Breaks the legs of deer, boar, clubs raccoon's, killed dogs, cattle, etc (all reports I have found before). Hunts in packs/groups this is an animal to be cautious of. People study bears, chimps, gorillas they go prepared and knowing what they can do. Hey people study moose, or even raccoon's they don't go in thinking "oh this is just a little furry critter it can't hurt me". Think we have to start thinking of this creature in a bigger picture. Though that is my view. I'm not a researcher. Been in the woods and had some strange things happen. Heard strange things, seen strange things. Though don't count myself as a researcher so take it for what it is worth. Also not attacking anyone, I quoted what I did because it just doesn't seem so cut and dried to me. Thanks.

[MarkGlasgow]

I'm not entirely convinced that the BFRO have a set agenda when it comes to portraying BF modus operandi.

The Finding Bigfoot show however may have a different angle. Considered wholesome family view by most. I guess the production company and producer won't want frightening encounters relayed to scare their core audience.

I agree however Woodslore, many accept BF to be a skilled hunter who will make short work of its sizable prey or perhaps something or someone who may get too close to its offspring.

[JDL]

I have heard more than one complaint that the BFRO rejects reports that do not fit their paradigm.  Puts them in the same camp as Crow.  Just a matter of degree.

[MarkGlasgow]

Ha ha ha but the Finding Bigfoot Crew goes laughing all the way to the bank.

Yep. Everyone in Bigfoot world is uber rich and sell several million copies of their books.

I also hear that Colin Farrell has agreed to play the part of Thomas Steenburg in the blockbuster new movie which will capture all the drama and excitment of a five day field trip in a damp, cold Alberta wilderness.

And skeptics reckon that footers believe all kinds of nonsense....?

[Guest JiggyPotamus]

I view this as an extremely interesting, and important, topic. Like you pointed out, opinions on the matter vary, yet I believe there are some things that everyone can agree upon. First, that sasquatch are "wild" animals, no different from any other animals in their habitat in that respect. All that means is that these animals are not accustomed to interacting with humans, thus their treatment of humans will vary considerably depending on a variety of factors. Even domesticated animals retain their natural instincts, (instincts being behaviors designed to aid the animals in the wild), and instinct will play an important role whenever animals and humans interact. This is the case both in the wild an in domesticated situations. Dogs for instance maintain their pack mentality regardless of whether they're in the wild or in someone's home. Cats will chase string, oblivious to the fact that a person is controlling it, not for fun but because of instinct.

 

The main unknown where sasquatch is concerned is what I call the instinct vs intelligence debate. I believe that it is relatively self-evident that intelligence allows an animal to override their instinct. For instance, human society generally suppresses certain instincts, and it is our intelligence that makes this possible. I also believe that the other way in which instinct can be overridden is through conditioning. Repeated behaviors that run counter to instinct. This happens mostly in domesticated situations, but can also happen in the wild. Animals can adapt to various situations, although I still believe this is based upon intelligence, and therefore conditioning is not necessarily a concept that is separable from intelligence.

 

So I've attempted to establish that all animals behave instinctually, and that intelligence and/or conditioning allows an animal to behave in a manner that differs from their instinctual reactions. I do not know for certain how this relates to sasquatch, but what I believe is that sasquatch generally avoid humans based upon instinct. When they do have some level of interaction with humans they are overriding their instinct to flee, what I call the avoidance instinct. I think intelligence is what allows them to suppress their instinct in most instances, while conditioning is present in a small percentage of such cases. "Habituation" cases would likely be a form of conditioning, centered around food. Even a non-intelligent, wild animal can be conditioned with food. Realize however that this is a very generalized way of looking at these things, because all animals vary to some degree.

 

To get to the point of the thread, how does violence towards humans fit into the sasquatch picture? We must first define what violence towards humans entails. Physical harm or psychological harm? If a few sasquatch were acting aggressively towards a person by hiding out in the woods and vocalizing, shaking trees, and throwing rocks, I would term that "violent" behavior. Such an occurrence would fly in the face of the claim that sasquatch are "gentle." Sure, they are not physically harming the target, and may just be attempting to force the person away, but my point is that this would still disprove the idea that sasquatch are so docile that they always flee in the presence of a human. I also think that a sasquatch who flees into nearby woods upon contact with a human, and simply remains quiet and out of sight, watching the human, shows that sasquatch are not fleeing because they are afraid of humans. Therefore I think a case could be made that sasquatch are potentially dangerous because they are not afraid of humans. I think we could agree that a bear who was afraid of humans is not as dangerous as a bear who had no fear of humans. Note however that a much better case could be made for the idea that sasquatch are not afraid of humans, as watching a human from the woods is not really a sufficient reason. I do want to attempt to prove that point here, rather I just wanted to say that I believe as much. There are a number of cases which could be used to establish that sasquatch do not fear humans.

 

Now I could be wrong about fleeing being an instinctual behavior that is overridden by intelligence. Perhaps it is intelligence that causes them to flee. I still do not believe they are afraid of us, and that this fact alone makes them dangerous. Then of course they CAN flee now, but what about a cornered sasquatch? What about the entire sasquatch population being cornered through industrial and domestic expansion? I firmly believe that accepting the myth of docility is dangerous in itself.

Edited June 26, 2015 by JiggyPotamus

[Guest diana swampbooger]

Nice one, JP. Agreed.

[Guest]

+1 Jiggy.  Nicely thought out and written.  The FB crew seems to except, aside from Rene maybe, that Sasquatch throws rocks and breaks trees.  That is at least a bit aggressive.  The Forest Friend concept would indicate they would do nothing more than curiously watch and maybe initiate contact.  Indeed, that seems to be the case with some reports, but there are many which contradict this as well.  Again, great post!

[Doc Holliday]

As per usual, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

 

hey, wait a minute........ that's my line

[BobbyO]

I borrow it every now and again Doc, but should have credited you, sorry..

[Hammer102492]

I watched the Caddo Lake episode and enjoyed it, as I do most episodes.  Whatever your opinion on tactics, it's made for TV and is entertaining.  One thing I thought a bit odd was how hard everyone except Rene pushed the gentle giant portrayal.  She seems to have taken an antagonistic approach this season.  I can't say either way and agree that most documented encounters seem to indicate Sasquatch heads the other way when people are around.  I also can't say they are safe and cuddly.  I just think they pushed it a little too hard and it became obvious there was an agenda presented, as opposed to approaching with a totally open mind.  There are reports of violent behavior, even very old reports.  Maybe the Southern Swamp Squatch is a different breed than the PNW type, but not if you take PNW Indian accounts seriously.  What do y'all think?  Please, let's not turn this into a BFRO bashing thread.  I respect what they do and to each his own.  Thanks.

 

Good topic.  Don't think that FBF is pushing an attitude of gentle giant.  TV editors portray the best they have on film for the location.  The invetigators are really doing good field work.  There have been plenty of times where they have said that they got the creeps, but pushed on to see if there was anything they could track down.  Bobo had a tweet recenctly about how one of the witnesses who had it in his gun sight, didn't realize how much danger he was in. 

 

Regarding being scared of them, anyone that has come very close, just speaking from my 3 experiences, well, let's just say, you feel like you're a hippy in a biker bar.  They are VERY INTIMIDATING! 

 

After one experience, I started a thread here about why you would go looking for SSQ.  It was after a Salt Fork experinece in June of 2013.  An Army buddy and I felt we were surrounded by them and very vunerable.  Then he saw one in his night vision goggles.  I was reduced to speaking out loud to them saying that we were just peaceful people and I'm sorry if we invaded your space.  I was genuinly in fear for my life.  I had no way out and if they wanted to tear us up, they could have.  It wasn't deer moving around us.  There were BIG foot falls and branches breaking and green eye glow.  I flipped on my head lamp and called for reinforcements.  That diffused the situation, much to my buddy's dismay.  I didn't care, I maxed out.  It was real.

 

Then there is the time that I heard BIG foot falls behind me off the porch where I had my back to the house and couldn't see anything.  I stopped and listened as they got closer and when they stopped, it was right next to my head, 7 + feet off the ground, almost literally breathing down my kneck.  I froze in absolute fear and after telling myself that this couldn't be real, I was able to move enough to back away, grab the computer and go into the house and I literally did not come out for 2 days.  What breathes 7 feet in the air?  Not a deer, which we are used to roaming around close by.  If I raised my hand, that's about where the mouth was breathing heavily, about 5 feet from where I could raise my hand.  Maybe one was playing games to see how close they could get to the lady on the porch, (I sit outside a lot, sometimes very late). To think that I could have turned around and saw something crossed my mind, but there was NO WAY did I want to see what was making that sound.  To this day, I keep the garbage can on that side of the porch so I don't fester about a hand reaching out.  Stuff of nightmares for sure. 

 

Then there was the first and only time that someone here called it.  It was two weeks after my sighting, My brother in law let out two screeches, and the two sounds that came back absolutely buried us.  I had to get out of my camp chair just to absorb the energy.  So very powerful.  Like who would ever want to mess with that???  OK, you win.  You are the F of the forest.  We get it!!  Never did that again. 

 

But what I do think about the FBF crew is all about, is getting people out into the woods.  It's so beautiful, we need to preserve the habitat.  You hear and experience so many things at night that are cool.  And if you get a knock or a howl back, then that's just icing on the cake. 

 

I used to hear a lot of knocks around here in 2013.  I rarely hear them now, and I always enjoy it when I do.  Do I ever want to get too close again?  NO WAY.  Well, maybe that's not true, I do want to see one again, but I respect them and what they could do to me.  I believe they are mostly peaceful beings.  Sometimes, maybe they even want to interact to get close.  I'm sure that the SSQ, like anything, can tell or feel your energy, and they will react accordingly. 

 

Maybe they just like playing games and having fun.  In 2013, on 3 different occassions I had rocks or something slap the house where I was laying.  Once downstairs by the open window when I was lying on the couch, and once a rock went near the open window where my head was in the bed, and the third time close to the window on the other side of the bedroom.  All three times, the lazy cat bolted.  Maybe they thought that was fun.  It freaked me out.

 

I had major tree crashes happen on the hill nearby too.  Power knocks were a regular thing.  It was totally frightening for me and at one point for 2 weeks I told my husband that we had to sell the place.  So, yeah, they can be very scary.

 

My sighting was a quick jump over a country back road.  I had never seen anything jump 7 feet in the air before and look big black and hairy.  I had never heard of bigfoot in Ohio before. 

 

Had the BF fever and things have calmed down.  We don't have any activity here anymore except for a possible knock a few weeks ago when I broke a log in the fire. 

 

It's hard to say what exactly was going on, but that's just what I think.  Close encounters should never be taken lightly.  Mutual respect is where it's at.  And a peaceful attitude.

 

Thanks,

 

Hammer

[Hammer102492]

P.S.  After we heard it answer our call backs, close by, I didn't get off the porch for a month and a half.  That was Memorial Day 2013.  Then I got over it, and in late August 2013, a gal we were camping with that I didn't know well at the time, had a class B sighting in the back field where we were all standing looking at the stars.  I was the only BF person in the bunch.  BFRO documented her sighting and posted it too,

 

Once again, after that, I didn't get off the porch for another month and a half.  Then all the stuff in the fall happened.  It was crazy.  Not to mention totally mind blowing because I didn't think anything much about BF before that.  I saw the FBF show a couple of times because my sister-in-law was using the word squatchy, but frankly, I thought the show was kind of stupid.  I have since watched every episode, and even was on the Ohio one.  I certainly didn't know anything about BF in Ohio until two nights after my sighting and I looked up a google search to see if anyone had ever seen one in Ohio, and found the BFRO site.  Then I read a report for my county that occurred 11 months before, a mile from where I had seen it.  That blew my mind and I haven't been the same ever since.

 

Now all the locals are coming out of the woodwork telling their stories.  I have to thank FBF for raising awareness.  It's not a taboo subject around here anymore.  I couldn't keep my mouth shut about it, and maybe I helped others speak up.  I cared about what people thought about me, and I had a very good reputation, but I had to speak up.  I couldn't hold it in.  That's just how I am. 

 

If I can throw a lifeline to someone who has or is, experiencing BF activity around here, i hope I can help them like others have helped me, including the good folks with BFRO, (Mark Maisel), BFF, (my new friends, you know who you are), and FBF, (especially Cliff Barackman).  In the meantime, I am building the local network and we all have each other's phone numbers now if anything major comes up. 

 

Yes, bigfoot may be gentle giants, but when they move into your neighborhood, it's a big deal. 

Edited July 1, 2015 by Hammer102492

[Martin]

Yep. Everyone in Bigfoot world is uber rich and sell several million copies of their books.

I also hear that Colin Farrell has agreed to play the part of Thomas Steenburg in the blockbuster new movie which will capture all the drama and excitment of a five day field trip in a damp, cold Alberta wilderness.

And skeptics reckon that footers believe all kinds of nonsense....?

 

And Will Ferrell as Jeff Meldrum.

[beerhunter]

And Will Ferrell as Jeff Meldrum.

With Jack Black as Moneymaker. Seriously though, has anyone noticed this season there are better recordings of purported BF sounds happening during the group's outings?

[Guest]

 Native accounts talk about attacks. Russian report, yeti reports. Think we need to start accepting some of these encounters as having a little more meat on the bone. Read a fair number of reports were Sasquatch was aggressive, or acted in a manner that spoke to that effect. Read a lot of attacks. I refuse to believe that all of these are fake and hoax and that this is a gentle giant.

 

One should remember that, unless there were specific treaties, ALL ''Native American'' tribes were ''hostile'' to each other, over food, territorial resources. So BF could be considered another hostile tribe. Plus different species, and like chimps and monkeys, look at humans as a fast food source now and then.

 

 In the PNW, there were fewer hostilities between Native tribes because of abundant resources, and there are many tribes that traded with BF in the PNW, I don't recall hearing about inland tribes trading with BF (on a regular basis?).

 

The more resources they have in x environment, the more ''laid back'' they might be. The fewer resources, the more hostile they might be. Would be good to look at an overview map of this information and compare the info.

Edited July 2, 2015 by Wag