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It’s the Philip Morris - Bob H. Recreation from 20 years ago. It’s an abomination. Again, it’s not that Roger was a con man. He was. It’s not that Bob G. gets dates wrong or facts wrong from 60 years ago. He does. The 800 lbs Gorilla in the room is Patty walking across that creek bed. Which 20 years ago they failed spectacularly to recreate.🤷‍♂️

Depends on her mood I suppose lol. I'm currently typing this one handed after testing the theory with my wife 😂.

Getting my overlanding/exploring rig more capable. While not nearly as awesome or capable as Norseman's Ram, it can go on some roads that stock pickups might not be able to. Just a leveling kit with 37s, a 13.5k winch, and beefy bumper.

"O Ye of Little Faith." We have the answers in our midst. Go back to the BFF 1.0 and review the analysis and discussions about Patty's proportions, including calculations, related to that. I am fortunate to have followed them daily, in real time, watching issue after issue unfold and then be addressed with calculations. It was a true pleasure. I believe Gigantofootecus first posted his observations about Patty's proportions in November 2005. He used photogrammetric calculations to arrive at his conclusions. Anyone claiming PGF is a hoax has to get past those calculations--good luck, you better brush up on cosecant-squared theta, you'll definitely need it. Absolutely fascinating work to formulate his conclusions. Then came Bill Munns with his detailed treatise which methodically examined every aspect of Patty's body in the PGF from head to toe. He left no stone unturned with his stunning and detailed work viewed from the perspective of an expert in filming and suit construction. There probably is no one who knows more about the PGF than he. Then, SwetiYeti painstakingly presented his elbow/arm proportion analysis. It's all there for everyone to view. There is no new video that can undo the spectacular work nor refute the conclusions heretofore by BFF members with respect to the PGF, in my opinion.

Here is the PGF section link: For newer members, Kit was a long time and strongly anti-PGF skeptic on here some time back. His postings can still be found in the PGF section if anyone is interested in his comments. I saw those comments a few days ago when all of this broke. I guess he is still around... Welcome back SW! Supposedly, Bill Munns has seen it, but I do not know that to be a fact. I am very interested in his opinion of this.

I don't know. I will likely gut the entire rear box and build it up from there. But that will take a ton of time. And I don't have a shop. First steps will be to do maintenance on the rig and do some minor corrosion repair on the aluminum. Going to buff and wax the exterior, detail the interior, and sell the Stryker system. Once I get the rig cleaned up and repair all the little things, then I will evaluate it's retail value vs. cost/time of converting it to a class C motorhome. I'm also planning on building an RV pad and snow shed, along with a smaller shop, on some property in Idaho. I may want to just focus on that project since this summer is going to be hell in the Idaho mountains due to the low snowpack and winter that never came. The camping season is going to be about a month or so before they shut down the woods and ban campfires due to extreme fire danger. But there are some amazing ambulance conversions out there!

I am not a huge fan of Money maker. But I think he is right, it comes down to the suit. And as I said before we shall see if it stacks up.

This is a really fascinating video, thanks so much for posting! It's kinda nitpicking, but I think it's an important point that it's not really a 'debate' as no one is trying to 'win' or score cheap points, it's very much a discourse and that is so much more productive. I feel like a lot of these discussions turn into debates where people compete against each other to try and 'win' the argument and at the end of the day everyone loses. For full disclosure, I am sceptical by nature. I'm an atheist, I don't believe in ghosts and I don't believe aliens have visited earth. On the topic of bigfoot or sasquatch I'm very much torn as when I see the 'Patty' film it just looks real and genuine to me. That looks like a massive, weighty, bipedal ape that is definitely not a human in a suit and moves with a real looking cadence. However, there are so many questions surrounding other evidence sources such as testimony, hair samples, lack of body, lack of better definition visual record etc. As I said, I'm actually really torn on this subject as it's a bit of a Occam's razor to me: Is it simpler for me to explain away the lack of a cadaver, lack of fossil record, lack of good visual record or is it easier for me to explain away the 'Patty' film which I think looks very much real. I just can't explain away the film, I've tried to rationalise it and have read Mr. Munn's fascinating book and I can see no way realistically in 1967 that a couple of Cowboys pulled that off as a hoax, I think they filmed a real live animal there but that brings up just so many questions....................

It’s 2026 and people are still desperately trying to discredit the film. So far all attempts have failed as none of them address the issues that exist with replicating the film subject with 1960’s costume technology.

Such surely brings into question any conclusions our new member draws.

I volunteer to perform a blindfolded feel test on any purported Patty "suit" and live female test subject.

Interesting, as even Kitakaze is suggesting it's the Ahtanum Valley footage, which is discussed I believe in Greg Long's book, so it seems Joshua is at odds with Marq Evans on this. Okay - the breast thing is a bit suspicious, but we can't tell until we see those boobs.

Lots of good channels. I particularly like Studying Sasquatch, Hellbent Holler, and Small Town Monsters.

Got the emergency lights hooked up. Neighbor kids love them, lol.

Moose stand 7 to 8 feet tall at the shoulder, are 9 to 10 feet long, weigh 1,200 to 1,800 pounds and where there is a high concentration of them, there are still large amounts of ripe growth available to them and other animals. They run up to 35 miles per hour. Brown bears are 4 to 5 feet tall at the shoulder and 8 to 10 feet tall when standing on their hind legs. They weigh up to 1,500 pounds and can run 35 miles per hour and can kill many moose, caribou, elk and deer in a year. So, I don't find those descriptions of sasquatches ridiculously far fetched, just somewhat exaggerated due to witness perception.

One of the questions regarding the PGF is how was it that Patty could leave a deeper impression in the sandbar than Roger's and Bob's horses. There was well-known poster here on BFF who did an experiment on a sandy beach and posted his results (and video or pictures I think). It turned out that his foot impression was deeper than a horse whose rider had it walk near his tracks. I was flummoxed how a heavy horse on small hooves would not be deeper that a much lighter person with larger feet. The moral of that story is that the mechanics of a foot's movement are far more important than the weight of the person/animal making the impression. I wish I could remember the BBF poster's name but cannot. It was a while ago.

I'm partial to Cabin in the Woods. And a close second is Hellbent Holler.

So allegedly Patterson burnt the patty suit in a barrel which took 30 minutes but didn’t burn the rehearsal footage.. how convenient!

So I am able to collect hairs from them on a pretty repeatable basis over time, and am interested in starting a routine of getting these hairs I collect collected in the best way possible and also getting them tested(of course). I can likely fund the effort myself. I work a lot, this is a very busy time for me, but would like to get this effort rolling. Anyone that has some pointers on how to proceed can PM me or preferably just reply here.

It’s over for Patty but there was Bigfoot before and after so Bigfoot is not dead.

The end of Patty 😢

Hairymanroad, a YouTuber, went to SXSW to watch the second screening. Based off of his, and one other individual who went to a screening from the BF community the 40sec of 1966 film, in the words of Jeff Meldrum, "looked like a test run". Then goes on to describe how "it was "patty" but slightly different, a different guy in the suit. The lines were all the same." It's not looking great guys. Steenberg, and small handful of others, seem to have been told the same message from Meldrum starting in April of 25. "Something big is coming in relation to the PG-film". I want to see the film too, they are shopping around for a market release but according to the director they have two more film festivals to attend before anything like that will happen.

I’m hearing Bob Gimlin confesses to a hoax in this documentary. If that’s true it’s over for the Patterson, Gimlin film.

Pre-Clovis? Not so fast. Interesting discussion regarding whether the Monte Verde site, in Chile, is truly Pre-Clovis. Monte Verde is a linchpin site in the Pre-Clovis theory debate. The video author interviews a paleoarchaeologist who has submitted new research disputing the accepted age of the human artifacts found at Monte Verde.

Q&A with Eric Palacios (the guy who saw the Capturing Bigfoot documentary and whose YouTube debrief was posted earlier). In this YouTube video, you get good questions from Todd Prescott and Thomas Steenburg. Eric provides clarifications about what was claimed in the video.

Appreciate that! Thanks, man The Half Inch Wrench guys are good. I always enjoy Small Town Monsters stuff.

Seeing is believing I guess, I will withhold judgement til I see it.

If what Eric is saying here is accurate, Meldrum was stunned and said it looks like a test run for the pg film. It's 30min long but worth the listen. Again, going back to my opening statement, what I saw, what 75% of our report base states, and many other reports around NA, what I saw only looked like Patty in the sense that it was covered in hair. Sasquatch stories predate the PGF and will likely continue until human extinction. The truth is out there, it's just not likely to be anything close to what we think it is. https://youtu.be/WBuWLe1MC_A?si=GORMNkDynvfkrHQl

I am not killing the messenger. You were cherry picking some “gotcha moment” Rogan video short against Meldrum. Which is a crock. It doesn’t even remotely represent what Meldrum said in the full interview let alone years of conferences and his BOOK!? Really? Have you read it? So hence forth I will be scrutinizing you based on this slanderous event you perpetrated on this forum. Sorry.

Meldrum was just repeating Joe’s line where he explores what he thinks is a possibility. The only arguments presented here by skeptics are that people close to Patterson claim it’s a hoax. Meanwhile Patty herself has characteristics that aren’t repeatable with costumes.

Kind of like Meldrum’s “confession”??? Give me a break.

Allegedly in the film there is a "rehearsal" of sorts. those who have seen the footage cant tell if it was part of the original movie Roger was going to make or actually a rehearsal for bluff creek. It is supposed to start streaming this Thursday, time will tell.

I cant speak to the involvement in the current film, I'm sure your all too aware of the effort he was making toward his own though. I have seen him being active on the Coalition page on FB since the morning of this release. Its the first I've seen of him in ages.

I don't understand your concern about someone "gutting" the PGF. It stood the test of time here on BFF under an electron-microscope type analysis and it is entirely irrelevant who Patterson and Gimlin were personally. Go ahead and try to destroy their reputation. It doesn't change the fact that a video is out there every aspect of which has been analyzed here at BFF over the many years. In my opinion, anyone who wishes to claim the PGF was a hoax has to specifically disprove Gigantofootecus' ASH ratio calculations and Patty's forearm ratio. Not knowing those two issues intimately, much less at all, tells me everything I need to know about someone's ability to intelligently discuss the PGF. Moreover, have they read Bill's Munn's works, which, in my opinion, are a veritable treatise on the PGF, or even know who he is? There are many people who have opinions about a lot of things they possess little or no knowledge. Let them come here and debate both critical, and tangential, issues of the PGF itself.

Score!

Just got back from a 3200-mile road trip from Washington to the AZ/Mexico border and back. I won an auction for a 2009 IH ambulance in Marysville, WA so had to take a sidetrack to there and pick it up. Plan is to convert it into an RV for exploring the Idaho woods. I would have loved to find one in 4x4, but realized most of my weekend trips didn't really need 4wd. The new rig is very beefy and not in too bad of shape. Going to strip the interior and build a log cabin-themed interior complete with little wood stove.

Thanks for the info. I haven't delved into it, but I have one question, if anyone knows an answer: Is Kitikaze (old BFF skeptic) involved with the latest attempt to disprove PGF?

I already know Roger was a con man. And I am very well acquainted to the dusty old bars filled full of Cowboys. The pranks, the cheats and the shenanigans. I was one of them. Albeit a generation behind. For me? The smoking gun would have to be an explanation for Patty herself. I will leave it here. Maybe it will draw more attention that way. 👍

Hi Skinwalker13, Yes, indeed. I was following the discussion on Reddit last night, and contributing to it. See my post from a while ago. This seems like the debunking doc. There is or was a 3 hour one in the pipeline that was staking the claim for authenticity too. I eagerly await that, and hope it has not been halted by the sad passing of Dr Meldrum. It may not be quite the death blow to the PGF that it's being talked up to be though. Being here in the UK, I haven't seen this yet - but from the descriptions that have been posted on Reddit, I believe the ''footage reveal' they are talking about sounds a lot like the footage mentioned in the Harry Kemble memo, which if true would be kind of neat as this has never seen the light of day probably since Harry reported seeing it. I wrote a comment saying as much on Reddit yesterday. They are calling the footage a 'woodsey dress rehearsal' for the PGF. The film makers and hardened sceptics will no doubt puff this up for all it's worth as some kind of smoking gun, which if it is the Kemble footage, it most certainly won't be. As far as I know there is no connection between the Kemble footage and the PGF, apart from Roger - but they were filmed in different locations months apart using different cameras, filmstock and techniques and in wildly different circumstances.

Sasquatch Theory and Half Inch Wrecking Crew. Oh, and Outlaw Country.

We are working on that currently.

If I had a dollar for every person that said that black tailed deer stood about five feet tall and weighed three-fifty or that a coyote was about four feet tall and about seventy pounds, I would be rich. Deer and coyotes are not as high nor weigh as much, as people imagine them to be. The same could happen in the opposite. People under estimating them. People are surprised to find out a wild turkey can weigh as much as 30 pounds or that a golden eagle weighs as little 6 to 15 pounds. informed, experienced perception is important.

That's a pretty truck

We should go camping this summer! 👍

Honorable mention for Creek Devil, he's a great voice with consistently solid historical data.

How is The Sasquatch Archives not one of the choices?!?! I'll even type it in all caps to express my surprise - HOW IS THE SASQUATCH ARCHIVES NOT ONE OF THE CHOICES?!?!

All of the above mentioned have merit, I'll include an unrepresented channel, Driftless. I like his approach, he asks the right questions and has come up with some good strategies giving impressive results, IMO.

No doubt! He really took Bigfoot out of the folklore and hoax word into the modern world. "Science" -in the purist elitist meaning of the word- tells the Bigfoot world we need to have a more science-based approach. Then, when someone like Dr. Meldrum delivers exactly what they demanded they knock him down for not being scientific enough. The rest of the science world not blinded by arrogance applaud Meldrum, give him the credibility he deserves, and will give him his due. Im guessing most people in science liked him and respected him. I would even bet many who didn't secretly applauded the guy. One of these guys on TV (Dr. Began?) said words to this effect: Sometimes in history those who are ridiculed turn out to be right. I'm not saying I agree with Dr. Meldrum but I have to applaud his science approach, knowledge. To some extent he is very brave to take on this topic. If the public ever has proof of bigfoot (dead or alive) I predict Dr. Jeff Meldrum will retroactivity be looked at as a visionary. Maybe a building or institute will be named after him.

Extremely sad. First and foremost obviously for his family. He seemed a very genuine and likeable man. Secondly for the Bigfoot community, who've lost one of the most intelligent, erudite and respected believers. Thirdly, for the man himself, who sadly never got to see the object of his interest confirmed by the mainstream and never got to study Bigfoot as a proven species rather than a cryptid.

Interest in many things comes in waves, ebbs and flows. Is it possible your time of joining the forum coincided with one of the peaks? I know this to be true of my own. Thinking of a parallel .. no athlete runs 4 minute miles 7 days a week. It is true of our interest here. I think the period we are in now with less interest, less bright shiny things to draw our attention, is more representative of bigfootery over the long haul. There is also a change of medium when it comes to information exchange. There are TONS of small bigfoot groups on facebook. Lot of people trying to monetize their interest which I think distracts from the larger communities like this one. There is not much to do but get out there and do your own thing in the woods.