What Evidence Makes You Believe That Bigfoot Exists ?

[Guest RedRatSnake]

Found it ~

Chilcutt developed an expertise in primate skin patterns as an offshoot of his ongoing study of the human fingerprint. His archive of more than 1,000 ape-skin impressions — prints he collected from tranquilized orangutans, chimpanzees and gorillas — is the largest such collection in the world. When Chilcutt visited Meldrum's lab, it seemed his hunch would turn out to be accurate. He quickly determined that the ridges he found in the first track Meldrum gave him were from a human finger.

But when he examined the rest of Meldrum's collection, Chilcutt found two casts with coarse ridge patterns similar to each other but different from humans or known great apes. One cast of a footprint discovered in Washington's Blue Mountains in 1985 astonished him with the distinctive puckered scars of several healed wounds.

"When primate skin heals, the ridges curl inward toward the wound," he said. "Someone would have to know a real lot about biology and dermatoglyphics to know that. Anybody that smart wouldn't be messing with fakes."

Legend of Bigfoot put to test

[Guest BitterMonk]

Just to clarify from the linked article..

After he spoke about his finding on National Public Radio, a sheriff's deputy sent in a cast of a track he'd found in Georgia in 1977.

That's either a typo or a grossly inaccurate statement. I've spoken with all the parties involved in the Elkins Creek cast incident and the date is nowhere near the one quoted.

[Guest ChrisBFRPKY]

Same animal as in same individual? No. Chilcutt has never claimed to find dermal evidence of the same individual from separate tracks or trackways. For that matter he's never claimed to have found more than one cast from the same trackway that exhibited the same ridge detail.

I think Chilcutt has done a comparison of different castings that seemed to come from the same individual. The comparison was of an injury that had since healed as noticed on the second castings, the dermals had curved inward toward the center of the healed wound or something of that nature. Now I don't know if Chilcutt actually found the tracks that were in question or not. I think he was looking at someone else's collection, possibly Meldrum's?? Someone with a better memory please assist...Chris B.

Edited for Spelling..and to say that RedRatSnake already beat me to it....Good Work RRS lol

Edited September 20, 2010 by ChrisBFRPKY

[Guest RedRatSnake]

BM i know this is a subject you have been into, what do you think of the possibly of a good match despite that inaccurate info, he is about the only guy that has the experiences on apes and prints far as i know so i lean to his finding on at least this case.

[Guest BitterMonk]

I think Chilcutt has done a comparison of different castings that seemed to come from the same individual. The comparison was of an injury that had since healed as noticed on the second castings, the dermals had curved inward toward the center of the healed wound or something of that nature.

Again, no. If he has stated so elsewhere I'd love to see the citation because that would be some ground breaking stuff if shown to be valid.

BM i know this is a subject you have been into, what do you think of the possibly of a good match despite that inaccurate info, he is about the only guy that has the experiences on apes and prints far as i know so i lean to his finding on at least this case.

Are you asking me if an individual could leave multiple prints that might later be found? Sure, why not. I've shown and others have to that at least in a controlled environment fine dermal ridge detail can be preserved in substrate and subsequently recorded in plaster. Now whether or not that would ever happen in the real world, let alone with a bigfoot (not to mention the same bigfoot) is an entirely different matter.

[Guest TooRisky]

Not sure if this was the gentleman's account that TooRisky was referring to....

My link

The International Bigfoot Society

http://www.internati...ort.php?id=3493

IBS Report #: 3493

Location: COWLITZ county, WA. UNITED STATES

Sighting Type: 1

Latitude:

Longitude:

Day:

Month: MAY

Year: 1980

Time:

Elevation:

Data Source: TR 91 SEPT 1999

Credibility: 3

Locality: MT ST HELENS

Researcher: Fred Bradshaw

Witness: MR Bradshaw

Sighting Type: 1

Summary: DEAD BF FROM MT ST HELENS SEEN

Sighting Text:

TR 91 SEPT 1999 *

Fred Bradshaw report concerning dead Bigfoot bodies near Mt. St. Helens.

My father worked for Weyerhauser Co. at Green Mountain ,WA, east of Vancouver. The site has security on their roads to check on the equipment and check closed areas to keep people out.

My father was working the day Mt. St. Helens blew up. He was at a meeting in Kelso, WA, and as he was a supervisor, when Mt. St. Helens blew it's side out, all heck cut lose.

My father was sent back to Green Mountain right away but like most he wasn't allowed to go very far because of the mud slide coming down the river. He did get to the town of Toutle, WA, on highway 504 off I-5. He and his crew were placed at different spots to watch mud flow and of course help people get out of the blast zone after the major blow up. He was sent to the area of Sprit Lake to keep people out.

When the second major blow up of the mountain came, my father and the other guy with him reported in, and they got out of there.

He was then placed in charge of the helicopter landing zone. It was his job to help keep people out of the landing zone and let aid crews in so they could care for injured.

Later. when all the people were out and bodies out, the National Guard was brought in to clean up. They hauled dead animals out that they placed in piles; deer in one, elk in another and so on. They were covered up with tarps and later burned.

But my father was placed in charge of one pile of dead that were covered and no one was allowed to go near. Armed U.S. National Guard personal were around this pile, and one day when they were going to move this group of bodies, and my father was very close to it and was told to keep his mouth closed. And when the tarps were removed he saw the creatures, some badly burned and some not. They placed them in a net and lifted them into a truck and covered it over. My father asked a guardsmen what will they do with them and he said study them or what ever...he didn't want to know. He said it's like other things you don't ask, and off they went . AND NO ONE KNOWS WHAT HAPPENED TO THEM. My father and the rest were debriefed and sent home.

Thanks bro this is one of the reports of the bodies... The guy I am talking about flew the National Guard Chopper, he is a relative of mine, and saw the bodies in the covered net....

[Guest]

Thanks bro this is one of the reports of the bodies... The guy I am talking about flew the National Guard Chopper, he is a relative of mine, and saw the bodies in the covered net....

Please, please, please, stories?

[Guest RedRatSnake]

Thanks for the replies BM

The article i posted just seems to be to be great evidence that there was / is at least one individual BF out there roaming around, unless someone can come up with another explanation for the casts.

[Guest BitterMonk]

Thanks for the replies BM

The article i posted just seems to be to be great evidence that there was / is at least one individual BF out there roaming around, unless someone can come up with another explanation for the casts.

I'll agree that on surface it is compelling. The problems start when you begin to actually examine (and test) the claims. Again though I'll stress that Chilcutt has never claimed to have examined more than one cast with the same individual's dermal ridge pattern present.

Edited September 20, 2010 by BitterMonk

[Guest]

Not sure if this was the gentleman's account that TooRisky was referring to....

My link

The International Bigfoot Society

http://www.internationalbigfootsociety.com/html/dsp_report.php?id=3493

IBS Report #: 3493

Location: COWLITZ county, WA. UNITED STATES

Sighting Type: 1

Latitude:

Longitude:

Day:

Month: MAY

Year: 1980

Time:

Elevation:

Data Source: TR 91 SEPT 1999

Credibility: 3

Locality: MT ST HELENS

Researcher: Fred Bradshaw

Witness: MR Bradshaw

Sighting Type: 1

Summary: DEAD BF FROM MT ST HELENS SEEN

Sighting Text:

TR 91 SEPT 1999 *

Fred Bradshaw report concerning dead Bigfoot bodies near Mt. St. Helens.

My father worked for Weyerhauser Co. at Green Mountain ,WA, east of Vancouver. The site has security on their roads to check on the equipment and check closed areas to keep people out.

My father was working the day Mt. St. Helens blew up. He was at a meeting in Kelso, WA, and as he was a supervisor, when Mt. St. Helens blew it's side out, all heck cut lose.

My father was sent back to Green Mountain right away but like most he wasn't allowed to go very far because of the mud slide coming down the river. He did get to the town of Toutle, WA, on highway 504 off I-5. He and his crew were placed at different spots to watch mud flow and of course help people get out of the blast zone after the major blow up. He was sent to the area of Sprit Lake to keep people out.

When the second major blow up of the mountain came, my father and the other guy with him reported in, and they got out of there.

He was then placed in charge of the helicopter landing zone. It was his job to help keep people out of the landing zone and let aid crews in so they could care for injured.

Later. when all the people were out and bodies out, the National Guard was brought in to clean up. They hauled dead animals out that they placed in piles; deer in one, elk in another and so on. They were covered up with tarps and later burned.

But my father was placed in charge of one pile of dead that were covered and no one was allowed to go near. Armed U.S. National Guard personal were around this pile, and one day when they were going to move this group of bodies, and my father was very close to it and was told to keep his mouth closed. And when the tarps were removed he saw the creatures, some badly burned and some not. They placed them in a net and lifted them into a truck and covered it over. My father asked a guardsmen what will they do with them and he said study them or what ever...he didn't want to know. He said it's like other things you don't ask, and off they went . AND NO ONE KNOWS WHAT HAPPENED TO THEM. My father and the rest were debriefed and sent home.

I've always been intrigued by this report. I'd bet, if this report is accurate, and the USNG were the last ones standing around the bodies... our Uncle, has (or had) the specimen(s), that so many researchers seek.

TR, if your relative was there, and flew the chopper and saw the bodies, I can understand this being some real convincing evidence for you.

[Guest parnassus]

One thing that sticks out in my mind as far as evidence is this, The Indians of the Pacific Northwest and Canada have been making Totum poles and other forms of religious totums for hundreds of years, There are Totum poles that were carved well over 200 years ago that depict animals that are indigenous to the Indians area that they lived in, On these Totum poles are animals such as Bears, Wolves, Eagles, Coyotes and such, and in some instances an APE. The Indians of that time would not have known anything about Apes since there is no monkey or ape that is native to their area. They would only ahve known the animals that they were use to seeing. To me these is real evidence that they do in fact exist. The Idians of that time didn't carve these Totums for fun. They carved them for spiritual reasons, to show respect to the animals that were in the area.

I don't think your stories about totem poles reflect mainstream interpretation, which holds that there a variety of reasons for carving totem poles, and that they were not objects of worship. Many simply were decorative objects, that may have celebrated family ties, or were built to shame certain persons. Please see this book, for example, or wikipedia. Can you give any sources from non-bigfoot believers, to support your statements?

Edited September 20, 2010 by parnassus

[Hairy Man]

wikipedia should never be used for a source for anything... as my professors in college use to say, original sources baby, original sources...

After reading through your link, there isn't anything I can see that disputes what spoiler stated. He didn't say native people "worshiped" totems, he said they had spiritual meaning. That is 100% completely accurate. Modern viewpoints matter little...viewpoints should be what the native people believed the artwork represented. Our interpretation is meaningless, because we weren't the creators of the art.

And never forget, myth doesn't create a "character" - Myth is generated by an observation - I see this - something happens - maybe that observation is responsible for what happened. I see a large bird - thunder happens - bird created the thunder. It IS NOT "I need to explain thunder - so I make something up to explain it".

Edited September 20, 2010 by HairyMan

[Guest rockinkt]

No in other words I am not going to research for anyone but my self... I go out and research on my dime and my time... the same is with my at home research, I do it for me and post results, now if you disagree well spend the time to rebutt my findings or confirm my findings, either way get off your ass and do your own research....

I also have to say as a professional Mechanical Engineer and consultant you will have to pay for my services, so put forth the $100.00/hr for my information like many do and I will happily forward the info you so ask for.... Or become a member of WASRT and then be in the inner circle of the information that this team has gathered in its years of experience in the field... That is if you qualify as a member of this team...

In other words - you've got nothing to offer but stories without any shred of evidence to back them up. :lol:

[Guest rockinkt]

wikipedia should never be used for a source for anything... as my professors in college use to say, original sources baby, original sources...

After reading through your link, there isn't anything I can see that disputes what spoiler stated. He didn't say native people "worshiped" totems, he said they had spiritual meaning. That is 100% completely accurate. Modern viewpoints matter little...viewpoints should be what the native people believed the artwork represented. Our interpretation is meaningless, because we weren't the creators of the art.

And never forget, myth doesn't create a "character" - Myth is generated by an observation - I see this - something happens - maybe that observation is responsible for what happened. I see a large bird - thunder happens - bird created the thunder. It IS NOT "I need to explain thunder - so I make something up to explain it".

I do not agree that myths are all generated by observations.

How does one explain origin myths?

Some myths of the Sto:lo are certainly explanations of what is observed. Transformer rocks are a great example.

I think that there are quite a number of myths that are made up to explain observations or unknowns.

[Guest]

Parnassus, since there are numerous articles, etc in support of the totemic presentation of apes by NAs, how about YOU provide a link to support YOUR presumption? I'm a little tired of "skeptics" trying to put BF advocates on the "proving the negative" end of the stick. You want to make the positive claim all the ape totems are in fact NOT ape depiction, lets see your cards.

Edited September 20, 2010 by Mulder