What Is Sasquatch?

[Guest]

What could be more constructive than providing science with a type specimen?

Great white hunter came first, Jane Goodall? Second........

I don't know Nathan...... It could be some form of Mimi cry, or hoaxing I just do not know.

But if they have language then they should be fully human and exhibit all of the traits that primitive man does.

norseman.. i don't get why something has to be human in order to have a type of language ? Dogs bark..cats meow..how do we know they don't understand what each others saying?

[NathanFooter]

 norseman ,  I can't speak for certain on the cases I am not involved in but in my case I can tell you that I can count all of the people on 1 hand that know where my site is.  All of these individuals are people I have known for years and I would trust them with my life if need be. 

 

 I know that does not mean much over all because trust still includes the human factor but I simply am saying the site is very secure from hoaxers and such.  I learned early on about area security being number one. 

 

 If you where large and powerful enough, tools would not be worth the time or energy to craft let alone need.    Most forms of food only need crushed or ripped open, modern humans simply do not have the raw strength due to our small size.  I know if I had the power to rip deer hide apart by hand I would never use a knife.

 

 I can see where you consider mimicry of humans to be a possibility for such sounds, fair response.

[MIB]

. I'm talking UNDENIABLE. Proof. like the head of a squatch or something.

 

Undeniable ... by whom?   There are people who consider the moon landing a hoax.   Deniable / undeniable is not black and white, it's shades of gray.   I understand your point, but someone has to decide how many people have to accept that something is sufficiently dark gray enough to be called black.   In the end, that determination is somewhat personal and arbitrary.  

 

"Fer instance", you mentioned the PGF.   I consider it rock solid because physically shaky or not, nobody has successfully duplicated it, in fact, the results of the attempts have been laughable.   Proof of sasquatch' existence has been settled for me since about 1976 when I saw one.   I'm not so weak-willed that I require others agreeing to validate my beliefs.    Everyone else could recant everything they've shared and I still saw what I saw.

 

The question, then, comes back to the topic of this thread, not WHETHER sasquatch is, but WHAT sasquatch is.   Within the question of what, the trail forks, one leading towards biology, the other towards behavior.  

 

Biology is interesting.

 

Behavior, laying out there in the dark in a sleeping bag looking up at a shadow of something 9+ feet tall blocking out the stars, is far beyond merely interesting. 

 

When we ask what a sasquatch is, and the answers come back as comparisons to us, it says something about what we think we are.   Is being human merely being part of our subspecies or does it have a correlation to components of behavior that we might or might not all share?    Who are we?  What is human?

 

MIB

[Guest]

For the record MIB I believe the PGF to be legit

[Guest]

I just gotta laugh.   Famous maybe, in a bad way.   Multimillionaire ... laughable.   What did it serve Roger Patterson?   Being the one who provides proof leads to a life I'm pretty sure I don't want.   Never mind the question of conscience.

 

MIB

 

If someone actually had the dead bodies of two sasquatch they would likely be one of the most notable historical figures of the 21st century.

 

The only thing Roger Patterson ever got was a one minute film. Scientifically, this film doesn't mean squat. To the general public, this film doesn't mean squat. To me, the film is probably real, but still doesn't mean squat.

 

If someone had two real bigfoot bodies, the species would be proven beyond doubt, ending the mystery once and for all.

[norseman]

norseman , I can't speak for certain on the cases I am not involved in but in my case I can tell you that I can count all of the people on 1 hand that know where my site is. All of these individuals are people I have known for years and I would trust them with my life if need be.

I know that does not mean much over all because trust still includes the human factor but I simply am saying the site is very secure from hoaxers and such. I learned early on about area security being number one.

If you where large and powerful enough, tools would not be worth the time or energy to craft let alone need. Most forms of food only need crushed or ripped open, modern humans simply do not have the raw strength due to our small size. I know if I had the power to rip deer hide apart by hand I would never use a knife.

I can see where you consider mimicry of humans to be a possibility for such sounds, fair response.

Nathan,

I trust you and consider you a friend, I hope you understand that I am not calling your honesty into question.

But I have yet to hear any recording that could not have been made by a human.

Humans are incredibly strong Nathan for our size. There are men that can rip a phone book in half. That does not mean they cannot create art or sew or flake stone.

I find your argument conflicting.......Sasquatch is human. But here is all of the ways they are different from us. Everything from night vision to infrasound.

At what point do the differences add up to something not human ? Or rather of the genus homo?

[NathanFooter]

 norseman , I view you as a friend as well and I know you are not questioning my honesty , I was just stating for the public record here my situation { of witch the results being discussed come from } to better everyone's understanding of how I go about my work being the conversation here is public and all.   I did not mean for it to sound rude or of disagreement, I apologize if it seemed of such.

 

 I guess it really does boil down to that last line in your above post, what makes that line in the sand that defines us as human, it is tough to explain and understand being that this line changes as time passes and new discoveries are made.

 

 To be as defined as I can on this , I at this point I am leaning toward the North American Sasquatch being something like or related to Homo Denisova that has adapted mentally and physically in a very different direction than modern humans.  

 

 I really do not want to humanize the sasquatch , I am not a romantic of such ideas.  It is simply just that what I seen and what I have heard looked and sounded alarmingly human like and less ape like.

[Lake County Bigfooot]

Strictly speaking we cannot call Sasquatch either human or ape, there are too many

elements of both incorporated into this creature, seeming proto language and culture,

but yet a seeming lack of tool use, perhaps our whole perception on the matter is

skewed by what science has told us and we are trying to cram the square into a

round whole, I am sure that some of that is at work here.  I for one am happy to leave

the whole thing a mystery and when we get the vantage point to make clearer decisions

on the matter, well then....I know the implications of kill no kill, but even that is really

not on the table, if someone is convinced that killing one will be for the good of the whole

of the specie, then I say they will have to face their own conscience in the matter, I cannot

condemn them to think so, nor can I fault anyone who wants to shut down the forest

industry to protect them.  I think I understand the rationale of both individuals, and the passion

to have the specie protected and documented to protect them.

Edited December 14, 2013 by Lake County Bigfooot

[southernyahoo]

But I have yet to hear any recording that could not have been made by a human.

 

 

Not sure I follow here. All the recordings are of people? Or, they all could be hoaxed?

[norseman]

^^^^^^^

Both. Either mistaken identity or skullduggery.

[Guest]

It's not a matter of believing its a matter of peer review. Ketchum does not cut mustard!

A shame you did not follow the samples submitted to other labs. If you had, you would clearly see the writing on the wall. When the results came back human, the labs disregarded the sample. Now, you feel because Dr. Ketchum has gone the wrong way via publish, it wipes all the validation the other labs have done? Or you read "somewhere" the samples were contaminated because they came back human.. They were supposed to as a hybrid, but these other labs had no idea what they were testing, called "blind study" ... If you do not like Dr. Ketchum for her choices is one thing, but you should respect the processes she took to submit to other labs blmd as part of the testing and review phase. You are lumping two thing together to discredit dr. Ketchum and I am of the option this is a mistake, so I will state my opinion again. I believe any validation done by other labs submitted by dr. Ketchum.

[southernyahoo]

^^^^^^^

Both. Either mistaken identity or skullduggery.

 

Check out the thread I started on laryngeal air sacs.

[norseman]

I had a friend that was riding his horse in the mountains. Up ahead of him in dense timber something was vocalizing and thrashing around. His horse freaked and refused to go further. He described the sound to me and I picked out a Sierra sound file and played it for him and he confirmed the similarity.

It was the file where the vocalizations are guttural deep pitches that trail off in whistles.

I still say a Homo Sapiens can make the Seirra sounds. But it was interesting to me that my buddy who has no dog in the fight and wouldn't lie to me........fingered that sound file.

It's doubtful it was a hoax as well, because of the remote setting. So who knows?

[NathanFooter]

norseman  , Just know that bit you just shared is very neat to hear .  Thanks for sharing.

[norseman]

Thanks.

I think from reading this thread that there are a lot of people who believe that this creature is a form of human.

I don't think this is the case. But possibly the Almasty is, as it's reported they wear animal skins, and utilize fire.

Also orangs build nests with covers to stay out of the rain. I think its improbable that a creature with the mental aptitude to better its life would choose not to do so.