N A W A C - Field Study Discussion (2)

[WSA]

I wish them well, too. Credibility is fine, but you eventually have to pony up the evidence. "The check's in the mail" seems to be all that accompanies the claims.

 

How long has it been, now? Numerous observations of accounts without accompanying evidence. 

 

Credibility is earned by presenting information that is easily confirmed by examining the validity of one's claims. Without anything but accounts of observations, there's not much to base the credibility of an organization on. To me, that's reminiscent of forming a theory and then attempting to fill in the blanks to support it as you go. Science doesn't work that way. There has to be supporting evidence to form a hypothesis based on established facts.

 

Having said this, it would be great if the NAWAC were to put forth evidence of their claims to prove me wrong and render my doubts as popycock.

I dunno. I sometimes pick up on a somewhat petulant vibe around this whole aspect See....and I suppose it is the nature of humans to want mysteries cleared up as soon as possible. Some of that is a good thing, too much of it is not. I'm always trying to strike that balance in how I view this subject.  Of all the arguments pro and con, the mere passage of time is probably not the strongest one to make. I was watching a documentary the other night about the discovery of the remains of Richard III. Without a doubt, that was due in large part to just stumbling, blind luck. Everyone involved marveled at the turn of circumstances. Put that on a comparison with the happenstance of the P/G film, and you've got a pretty good fit, I believe.  Because something like that arguably happened once, we might tend to think it is easy to accomplish, and the lack of something similar in 50 years tends to cast doubt on the original event. But, it would the same error in logic that would make somebody believe we could easily locate the grave of Alexander because a stab in the dark found Richard. Nobody would believe one event informs the other, but here we seem to have that idea. There are dead rulers littered across the planet, and only a few will be found. When they are found, it is on a timetable not of our choosing. Looking helps, yes, but I for one will telll you that it is better to be lucky than good. Luck keeps its own schedule. I could be long in my own grave before that number hits. So be it.   

[Guest Stan Norton]

^ Now, There's a surprise...

 

Really? Please explain. I thought you were a proponent of all possible explanations? One of them must include wood apes, no? 

[WV FOOTER]

What would you all do if the evidence presented, turned out to be valid? This is a serious question?

[norseman]

Really? Please explain. I thought you were a proponent of all possible explanations? One of them must include wood apes, no?

Well on a Bigfoot forum at least...

[Guest Stan Norton]

What would you all do if the evidence presented, turned out to be valid? This is a serious question?

 You mean if X contained wood apes, a special ops team, a meth-eating mariachi troupe, stoned teenagers and redneck hoaxers, as well as NAWAC? Wow. That would be amazing!

[WV FOOTER]

LOL, ya got me there Stan. I should have been more specific. I meant the evidence regarding the presence of a wood ape. But in light of the  other outlandish claims...

[Guest Stan Norton]

LOL, ya got me there Stan. I should have been more specific. I meant the evidence regarding the presence of a wood ape. But in light of the  other outlandish claims...

 

On an emotional level I am a fully paid up member of the wood apes are there club. On a purely cerebral level I demand evidence that is unequivocal and that is, so far, lacking (I often find myself siding with some our most vociferous cynics on this forum). On a professional level I see no problem whatsoever with sasquatch being a flesh and blood entity. I fluctuate constantly between these options but like to think of myself as a cautious optimist!

 

The purported evidence from X fits in very well with what I take to be the real sasquatch, so there's nothing I've yet heard from there that makes me have doubts on that score. Time will tell and I'm patient!

[WV FOOTER]

Couldn't agree with you more. I believe, but will not be convinced until I get my own sighting, not a glimpse, a 100%, now I'm scared, "Holy ****" it's a Bigfoot, feeling. Patience is the first attribute, right behind an area of possible habitation, when searching for Bigfoot.IMO. 

[the parkie]

How long has it been, now? Numerous observations of accounts without accompanying evidence. 

 

Bipto pointed out on numerous occasions that the only evidence ever proffered would be a body or part thereof. Their ongoing strategy has meant no effort expended in garnering any other type of evidence for several years, and perhaps several more. They see it as pointless. A body or nothing.

 

Were you unaware of this?

[WV FOOTER]

I do believe that Bigfoot obviously is very, very intelligent for their existence to remain questionable for so long. With that being said, and the NAWAC wants a body, I could believe that Bigfoot, wood apes, could detect the ill intent present in their peaceful lairs, thus staying out of sight, if not leaving the area altogether. JMO

[See-Te-Cah NC]

Bipto pointed out on numerous occasions that the only evidence ever proffered would be a body or part thereof. Their ongoing strategy has meant no effort expended in garnering any other type of evidence for several years, and perhaps several more. They see it as pointless. A body or nothing.

 

Were you unaware of this?

 

I was aware of that fact, but was sorely disappointed when he decided that he wouldn't address his claims regarding the "tree break" incident and took off down the road.

 

So, claiming that a slab monkey would be the only proof he'd provide substantiates the claims made along the way? Really? Somehow I doubt that Bipto and the credentialed members of the NAWAC would accept claims presented to them without proof based on a promise, or at least they shouldn't.

 

At any rate, he has and continues to slam the BFF for allowing questions from skeptics and proponents skeptical of his claims. Why is that? All we did is provide him with his own thread to post his observations in. If he can't handle questioning or those that don't believe his claims, that's not our problem. It's his problem.

[Guest Stan Norton]

Bipto pointed out on numerous occasions that the only evidence ever proffered would be a body or part thereof. Their ongoing strategy has meant no effort expended in garnering any other type of evidence for several years, and perhaps several more. They see it as pointless. A body or nothing.

 

Were you unaware of this?

 

Bingo. NAWAC on the face of it offer nothing more than the usual sasquatch vagueness. However, what sets their operations apart is the seriousness of their approach, the single mindedness of their goal and Brian's (former) willingness to provide a running commentary on the operations there and to discuss possibilities. Who else gave us that? No-one. The NAWAC situation is clearly so very different from the usual sasquatch bull and I lament the loss to the forum (no blame attributed).

[the parkie]

I was aware of that fact, but was sorely disappointed when he decided that he wouldn't address his claims regarding the "tree break" incident and took off down the road.

 

So, claiming that a slab monkey would be the only proof he'd provide substantiates the claims made along the way? Really? Somehow I doubt that Bipto and the credentialed members of the NAWAC would accept claims presented to them without proof based on a promise, or at least they shouldn't.

 

At any rate, he has and continues to slam the BFF for allowing questions from skeptics and proponents skeptical of his claims. Why is that? All we did is provide him with his own thread to post his observations in. If he can't handle questioning or those that don't believe his claims, that's not our problem. It's his problem.

 

See

 

I don't disagree with any of your response, I understand your disappointment.

 

My point was that lamenting a lack of evidence provided by NAWAC, when they clearly stated that they weren't bothering to because they only wanted to offer indisputable evidence, is missing the point.

 

I don't understand why Bipto couldn't just use the ignore function, but if he doesn't want to participate here any more it's up to him.

[See-Te-Cah NC]

We can agree on that last point.

[masterbarber]

Bipto pointed out on numerous occasions that the only evidence ever proffered would be a body or part thereof. Their ongoing strategy has meant no effort expended in garnering any other type of evidence for several years, and perhaps several more. They see it as pointless. A body or nothing.

 

Were you unaware of this?

 

Wait......What?  There must be some misunderstanding:

 

What does all of this mean then:

 

http://woodape.org/index.php/our-research/methodology

 

"The NAWAC’s approach toward wood ape, or sasquatch, documentation includes tried and true mainstream techniques employed by wildlife researchers."

 

"The NAWAC is engaged in activities designed to test and/or validate the hypothesis through a process involving the collection of observer reports, trace evidence, and clear, repeatable, indisputable photographic/videographic images."

 

"Field research results when volunteer NAWAC investigators and/or biologists determine that it may be possible to collect physical trace evidence of the target species, based on how recent and reliable a reported incident may be. Volunteers then conduct searches for trace evidence. Searches for the collection of trace evidence generally involve techniques akin to those employed by primatologists in pursuit of other rare species and/or known higher order primates such as orangutans, chimps, bonobos and gorillas. Trace evidence may consist of tracks, hair, scat, nests, and animal remains. In addition, sound recordings of vocalizations are sometimes attempted. This may involve field vocalization playback experiments, a technique used by some primate researchers."

 

http://woodape.org/index.php/our-research/projects/206-oe

 

""Teams and team members were free to be as active or passive as they preferred. Teams had access to several third-generation night vision units and eight or more Reconyx game cameras, as well as, on a more limited basis, high quality sound recording equipment and thermal imagers. Cameras were positioned and repositioned in response to suspected patterns of activity noted by team members. "

 

Looks to me like they are pulling out all the stops to try and collect some type of evidence. I'm sure a Body is the ultimate goal but they do appear to be expending efforts seeking more than that.