Bigfoot's Food 9' Up Missing ............ Sardine Can Opened?

[georgerm]

 

Some people will take everything you will give them, & then steal from you if you turn your back. Others are insulted if you offer them a handout. They don't want to feel obligated.

 

I think BFs are that way.

As a side note,   a common comment from those that are gifting food to BF is that the BF will eat most of something but rarely take it all.     That is an interesting trait not wanting to take the last of something in a group environment.    That sort of report is so common with BF I do not think it accidental.    That to me indicates some sense of fairness on the part of BF.     But I suppose with predators like lions that take a kill,   eat much of it themselves, then leave the rest for the young ones, that "leave some" behavior is fairly common in the animal world with predators.   With lions it may not be fairness just their way of perpetuation of their families.     Humans exhibit the same behavior in not wanting to take the last cookie on the plate.  Is that an age old behavior ingrained into our behavior or learned manners from our Mother?  

 

 

 

Well put SWWA. The sardine can incident at the old building site has really got my attention.

 

When speaking of only part of a food gift being taken it's called 'immense caring' commonly known as love.  It seems as only a few wild animals including humans learn or know this naturally. When we leave enough for others in our clan of other clans it says, "You need strength and I care about you."  Love others as we love ourselves is a good rule of thumb.

 

 

Some people will take everything you will give them, & then steal from you if you turn your back. Others are insulted if you offer them a handout. They don't want to feel obligated.

 

I think BFs are that way.

 

Humans can sink lower than the most brutal animals that kill for the sake of killing. One time on a lesser level, I took a poor man wood cutting with me. The next day my Stihl chain saw was missing. I asked around at his work place and sure enough, someone had bought if off him. He came to my house several days later, so I showed him my saw that I bought back! He gasped when he saw it. so I told him the story. ........................ yuck ................ what a lowlife ...........  the problem with lowlifes is they want to drag you down to where they are going and that is where souls are evaporated. 

 

Sasfooty, what have the BF been doing near your land?

 

 

Edited February 11, 2016 by georgerm

[georgerm]

Guess what the picture shows?

[Kiwakwe]

Guess what the picture shows?

I've lightened it up a bit but still can't figure beyond 2 oranges and the apple. Almost looks as if the pale faced hornets moved in and started sheathing it in stripped bark mache´. Do tell.

[Sasfooty]

Sasfooty, what have the BF been doing near your land?

 

That's a good question, but I don't have a clue. They come by & howl or knock on the house, or "whatever". Then they're gone for awhile. I wish I could be a flea on one of them for a night, & see where they go & what they do.

[gigantor]

geogerm,

 

We had a similar setup and were surprised by bear's common sense. Momma bear simply followed the branch to it's root, hung from the tree trunk and pulled it down, where her cubs where waiting to grab the goodies.

 

In another case, a black bear climbed the tree and pulled the branch down where an apple was hanging.

 

bear-climb-tree.mp4

 

 

Not saying bears were the culprit in your casse, just that animals are smarter than we give them credit for.

Edited February 11, 2016 by gigantor

[Sasfooty]

I wonder how a bear would pull the top off that sardine can without biting holes in it......

[georgerm]

 

Guess what the picture shows?

I've lightened it up a bit but still can't figure beyond 2 oranges and the apple. Almost looks as if the pale faced hornets moved in and started sheathing it in stripped bark mache´. Do tell.

 

 

It's a bass fish, tail down, and no head. I will go back later this week.

 

 

 

Sasfooty, what have the BF been doing near your land?

 

That's a good question, but I don't have a clue. They come by & howl or knock on the house, or "whatever". Then they're gone for awhile. I wish I could be a flea on one of them for a night, & see where they go & what they do.

 

 

Interesting. They must pick human friends according to their standards and faith no harm will come.

 

geogerm,

 

We had a similar setup and were surprised by bear's common sense. Momma bear simply followed the branch to it's root, hung from the tree trunk and pulled it down, where her cubs where waiting to grab the goodies.

 

In another case, a black bear climbed the tree and pulled the branch down where an apple was hanging.

 

 

 

 

Not saying bears were the culprit in your casse, just that animals are smarter than we give them credit for.

 

Good point Gigantor. I honestly want to know what did this with out kidding myself or jumping to conclusions. All angles need to be studied. The bear scenario could work.

 

The other possibility is a possum that are essentially a big rat. It might rapell or slide down the 14" long thing wire holding the food in place. When down and hanging on; it would pull the can off the thin wire with a thickness of about 20 guage. Then pulling the can off they drop to the soft ground. The question here is would it be able to pull the lid back with its teeth? The thin wire was left high in the bush and the end straightened out where it attached to the can. If something pulled hard on the wire ti would pull down too.

 

See picture: The wire takes one wrap around the branch in the center of the picture. It bends to the left. 

 

 

 

The black bear would need to bend the brittle Elderberry bush down 2' to 5' so the other bear could get the food. Elderberry bushes are brittle and 3 inches diameter at the base. The branch might break at the 5' level. I looked for prints with claws and there were none. I will look for bear prints at the bushes base with multiple stems.

 

On a 1 to 10 scale with 10 being the most likely here is the score so far but the case is not closed. The 7 bear can't be ruled out yet nor the  possum, nor bigfoot, or  human.

 

bear 7

possum 7

bigfoot 8

human 5

 

 

Will go back once it stops raining.

[Guest sacripper]

If the ground condition permits, could you take along a garden rake and prep the soil beneath so it shows prints?

One might fear driving away a wily BF, but would surely show any less intelligent animal sign.

[SWWASAS]

BF could always interpret raking under the gifting site as obscuring their footprints.    Some researchers, including myself, do that to found footprints, after we document them.    I have seen enough to think that BF goes to great lengths to avoid leaving footprints.    So nothing suits me better than hoping a BF sees me destroying footprints they accidently leave and somehow appreciate me helping them out.  Just a different way to look at it.  

[georgerm]

I wonder how a bear would pull the top off that sardine can without biting holes in it......

 

The lid was cracked open a 1/2" so it would probably hold it down with a paw and pull the lid open with its teeth. It didn't leave teeth marks.

 

If the ground condition permits, could you take along a garden rake and prep the soil beneath so it shows prints?

One might fear driving away a wily BF, but would surely show any less intelligent animal sign.

 

The BFs are probably too smart for print manipulation, so I will look at the natural ground better. I looked for finger prints on the can and didn't see any.

 

Maybe time will tell. Here is a picture of a trail leading to the site. Turn the picture sideways since it won't load up verticle.

Edited February 11, 2016 by georgerm

[BigTreeWalker]

I guess I don't understand. Are you wanting a habituation situation here or are you trying to figure out what could be doing this. As Norseman said, a camera would be most effective instead of guessing. If it isn't a bigfoot you'll be able to see what it is.

As to figuring out how it could be done. Something small enough to slide down the wire yet heavy enough to pull the lid off while hanging on it would leave few marks. The wire is tied in the ring. Hang on the can and it will come off the lid. Sardines, think mink or weasel. They could easily climb those limbs. The fruit is knocked on the ground and a deer or something else comes along and eats it.

I still have to ask what is the point of obliterating tracks when we call ourselves researchers? I'd like to hear a good reason.

I've also seen a lot of speculation about BF being a scavenger. Anything eating carrion wouldn't have to worry about eating spoiled food.

[georgerm]

Big Tree, I'm interested in a habituation site to learn about BFs.

 

Where do you get the idea tracks are being obliterated?  So far I've seen no tracks. 

 

Bigtree: I still have to ask what is the point of obliterating tracks when we call ourselves researchers? I'd like to hear a good reason.

 

Seems like a small mammal would pull the lid open just far enough to get the sardines to slide out. Bigfoot would probably pull the lid all the way off. At this point we don't know. I need to get out there and check soon.

[BigTreeWalker]

BF could always interpret raking under the gifting site as obscuring their footprints. Some researchers, including myself, do that to found footprints, after we document them. I have seen enough to think that BF goes to great lengths to avoid leaving footprints. So nothing suits me better than hoping a BF sees me destroying footprints they accidently leave and somehow appreciate me helping them out. Just a different way to look at it.

To answer your question George.

So if habituation is what you want then I guess we can keep guessing how it's done. Suggestion, set up two sites a little distance apart. Bait them both the same, but put a camera on one. I'm all about learning.

Sorry Randy, not picking on you. I have seen that here on the forums from others too. And you did give a reason after stating that you recorded it. Still with my training, it looks like a negligent way to do research.

Edited February 12, 2016 by BigTreeWalker

[MIB]

BTW -

 

This points at a puzzle I'm not sure how to address.  

 

Habituation settings don't really seem to lend themselves to normal avenues of study.    Any time the "research-ee" is aware of being studied and changes their behavior to account for it the results of the research are at least partially misleading.   This definitely seems to be the case with bigfoot.   To me that suggests a level of "people-ness", at least an ability to deliberately reflect on what they observe and adapt to it, rather than just another forest creature that will quickly get used to new things so long as that doesn't outright hurt them.  

 

I suspect approaches from cultural anthropology would be a better fit but most seem unwilling to approach it that way because of the implications that brings about the study subject's nature. 

 

The second issue with real habituation, not just repeated visits to the same location but not when the person is present, is a sort of relationship forms and the habituator becomes protective.    (I suspect that in some cases, this may be a twist on Stockholm Syndrome rather than real compassion.)    There are distinct limits on what sort of research / experimentation / etc habituators will participate in.  

 

Possibly the ideal would be a 'siege of Honobia' situation where there are repeat visits but no connection, where the people really truly want the bigfoots gone and are willing to go to some extremes to achieve that.

 

MIB

Edited February 12, 2016 by MIB

[SWWASAS]

 

BF could always interpret raking under the gifting site as obscuring their footprints. Some researchers, including myself, do that to found footprints, after we document them. I have seen enough to think that BF goes to great lengths to avoid leaving footprints. So nothing suits me better than hoping a BF sees me destroying footprints they accidently leave and somehow appreciate me helping them out. Just a different way to look at it.

To answer your question George.

So if habituation is what you want then I guess we can keep guessing how it's done. Suggestion, set up two sites a little distance apart. Bait them both the same, but put a camera on one. I'm all about learning.

Sorry Randy, not picking on you. I have seen that here on the forums from others too. And you did give a reason after stating that you recorded it. Still with my training, it looks like a negligent way to do research.

 

Not picking on me as that is a good question.      First of all in the PNW footprints have a limited life span anyway because of frequent rain etc.     My first footprint find only lasted 20 minutes.   I video taped it, thought I could find a better one in the muddy trail further up the mountain,  and a group of 4 people and two dogs passed me and destroyed the footprint down below me.  I did not even get a still picture or measure it.   Inexperience on my part was at play.   I should not have left the print.       Some I do,   in remote areas, leave alone.    I do not like to make a big deal of a footprint find in case I am being watched.     That can only encourage BF to be more determined not to leave footprints.  I think, given the situation of my footprint finds, they are trying very hard not to leave them.  That means they might have some understanding that footprints allow tracking.  I have no evidence but I would not be surprised at all it they tracked deer and elk from prints when they hunt.       My Merrill Lake print was the result of a tip from the BFRO and I left it intact so others could find it if they were looking.    If I am pretty sure I am being watched I scrub out the print after taking pictures and documenting it.      That has only happened once.    So I was probably misleading saying I scrubbed out footprints.  I just do that under certain conditions.     Certainly if I found a trackway you would probably get a call asking for help casting. 

 

Finally,  although it is Medrums thing,   the only thing a footprint does for me is to provide evidence that I am in an active BF area.     I have only found one print worthy of casting.   Most are not.     If Meldrum's hundreds of casts are of no interest to science,  and not persuasive,    why should I carry around casting materials on my back?    I do keep them in my truck.   The typical cast is so full of debris, that it is the equivalent of the blurry BF cell phone picture.            

Edited February 12, 2016 by SWWASASQUATCHPROJECT