San Benardino, Calif. Bigfoot Lawsuit

[Guest OntarioSquatch]

1 hour ago, hiflier said:

 

It is if abductions are to be believed and done without apparent government protection except to deny that no Humans have had an interaction with Alien Beings. 

 

My reply was addressing Norseman’s idea of sasquatch being released to conduct nefarious actions, which unlike abductions, isn’t well-founded in my opinion.

 

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If there isn't then Dr. Matthew Johnson and others of his ilk have done great damage to the BF subject and lead many astray down that rabbit hole with him.

 

I believe that Dr. Johnson and other hoaxers of his ilk have a negative net effect on people being able to take legitimate fringe components of this subject seriously, but with that being said, they can only do so much damage to a field of research that’s been pre-determined to be this limited in terms of the depth of understanding that researchers can obtain. In other words, with the sasquatch phenomenon being designed in the way I believe it is, hoaxes (past a certain point) can’t do damage to any non-existent potential, including that of obtaining a specimen, and this subject entering into mainstream.

 

1 hour ago, hiflier said:

Methinks it is you who underestimates government's interest in all things extraterrestrial- 

 

While I can agree that they would (and in actuality do) have a strong interest in the subject, I’d have to disagree when it comes certain specific subsets such as Bigfoot.

 

It’s a tricky issue and not easy to solve without actually having access to much of the information.

 

Edited April 5, 2018 by OntarioSquatch

[SWWASAS]

6 hours ago, hiflier said:

O.S. Aliens? Bigfoot? A connection? You have iterated that many times and yet you say the government isn't interested or covering anything up? I think you should seriously reconsider your assessment of that, my friend. How count an entity not be interested in one (Bigfoot) and still be interested in the other (UFO's) if your belief is that there is a connection? It would be inconsistent IMHO. Wouldn't hiding nd covering up Bigfoot therefore be in the best interests of such a government? I mean why release videos of fighter jet chases of UFO's and not army personnel encounters with chasing Bigfoots?

I have yet to see a aircraft gun camera / fire control system of a UFO intercept made by this country released to the public.   I have seen some released by foreign governments.    If a US fighter engages a target those images exist.  The number of intercepts that have happened have to be in the dozens.   Classification is the likely reason.    FIghter pilots love what they do and some sort of wiki leaks dump to inform the public about UFO's is simply not going to happen for idealism when loss of career and serious jail time is the reward.  

 

The pinning bigfoot cover up on economics interests alone rings too shallow to me.    The spotted owl did serious economical impact to the forest industries but it still happened.   That could have been buried too if enough money changed hands but that did not happen.   If economic factors and powers are that powerful,  the spotted owl thing would have been prevented.      So if there is an organized government BF cover up, the reason has to go beyond economic factors and power of money.      I have a short list of possible cover up reasons.      They include:  religious implications,   revelation of falsification of human history,   human/BF hybridization,   and extraterrestrial involvement.     Might be one or a couple of my reasons or one I have simply not thought of.  .     Not only do I not want to know the reason but I think it dangerous to get involved investigating it. 

[ShadowBorn]

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Not only do I not want to know the reason but I think it dangerous to get involved investigating it.

I am not sure how much one can even talk about it without there even being some type of a smack doodle by "them" on this one sentence. But I am agreeing since it is not worth loosing everything to prove some thing that "they" control. Loosing every thing that one has worked for is not worth the effort in trying. Staying silent is key to living out a perfectly normal social moral life.  Knowing nothing is even better. There are no controls.  

[SWWASAS]

That is the Sgt Shultz approach.     "I know nothing!"  Has worked for me so far.  

[norseman]

6 hours ago, OntarioSquatch said:

 

In this case, the connection was brought in by yourself as a distraction from a major and overlooked inconsistency that exists among researchers.

 

 

It’s not a well-founded fear if you don’t know how or why they’re meddling in human affairs. Based on what I’ve personally learned, the influences have mainly to do with altering our progression as an advanced species, but the reasons aren’t clear. One thing that is becoming clear (to me at least) is the extreme complexity of the entire subject and how badly people have misunderstood it.

 

 

There is conjecture and there is reality. The reality of the situation is that Bigfoot like creatures.....large higher primates.....exist in the fossil record. This is fact.

 

So then the question becomes do they exist today in North America? And if they do then why have they not been proven? A reasonable question.....

 

Many researchers presume that if this cryptid is a real entity and it still has not been proven to exist in this day and age? It must be a rare and shy animal residing in some of the last known wilderness areas of North America. Which is a reasonable assumption.

 

You on the other hand spit on that theory and instead subscribe to a larger mystery that has no basis in the fossil record or science. That the reason Bigfoot has never been found is because it’s a Alien clone!!! Where is your evidence? I can point to a Gigantopethicus jawbone or a Homo Heidelbergensis femur to support my theory that a large primate still roams the dark forests of North America......

 

Who is being illogical and inconsistent here?

 

Also, the very notion that Aliens far advanced of humans are meddling in the affairs of humans should be a grave concern to humans.....the how or why notwithstanding.

 

Logic on all counts seems to escape you. 

[Guest OntarioSquatch]

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Many researchers presume that if this cryptid is a real entity and it still has not been proven to exist in this day and age? It must be a rare and shy animal residing in some of the last known wilderness areas of North America. Which is a reasonable assumption.

 

It’s an assumption that’s frequently contradicted by the very people who make it (e.g. NAWAC, hiflier), but it’s not surprising given the amount of credible reports that are coming from such a wide geographical range. 

 

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You on the other hand spit on that theory and instead subscribe to a larger mystery that has no basis in the fossil record or science. Where is your evidence? I can point to a Gigantopethicus jawbone or a Homo Heidelbergensis femur to support my theory that a large primate still roams the dark forests of North America......

 

The supporting evidence is the genetics, physiology, and psychology of sasquatch themselves, which is founded on already widely-accepted scientific theories. Knowledge of closely-related primates and North American history is essential in those areas. Knowledge of the UFO connection can be of help as well, but isn’t necessary. 

 

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Also, the very notion that Aliens far advanced of humans are meddling in the affairs of humans should be a grave concern to humans.....the how or why notwithstanding.

 

That’s a jump from your idea of sasquatch being released to conduct nefarious actions, which was what I was addressing.

 

Edited April 6, 2018 by OntarioSquatch

[hiflier]

1 hour ago, OntarioSquatch said:

It’s an assumption that’s frequently contradicted by the very people who make it (e.g. NAWAC, hiflier

 

Witnesses to this day report seeing Sasquatch. Doesn't mean there are thousands out there. People also still report Big Black Triangles, too, by the thousands of reports. Doesn't men there are thousands of those either. As far as the Black Triangles go, if MUFON and NUFORC (connected) aren't lying and generating false reports in-house, or getting false reports from outside? Then I figure there are no more than six Black Triangles even WITH all of the reports. I'm not going to go into why I think that or how I arrived at six. Suffice it to say it took several years of research to arrive at that number.

 

Study like I did and one will readily see that it is rare indeed to have more than one or two at the same time. Although there was an occasion when there were three sighted within the same half hour time frame. I say that because there was a BT sighted in California, Maine, and the Mid West at nearly the same time on the same day. I know because I worked up my own database and converted individual U.S. time zones to the Universal Time Code (UTC) and that's when I saw that the three sighting all occurred at nearly the same time. You see, MUFON and NUFORC record, or used to record sightings in local time for each zone. It made it impossible for anyone to see any patterns at all so tracking was virtually out of the question for anyone who did not convert sighting times to UTC. Until a universal time reference was incorporated any pattern to the Black Triangles was impossible to know. At the time, and after a couple of emils, I think Peter Davenport of NUFORC was trying to include the UTC in the report but have not looked for a few years to see if it happened.  

 

Now Sasquatch may only number in the hundreds but, like Black Triangles, cover distances that make it look like there are more than there really are. There was one Patty at Bluff Creek- not twenty. So yes, there are thousands of reports, but the creatures can still be rare. So say I'm contradictory if you wish but the picture of Sasquatch that I see is anything but contradictory. In other words, 30 Sasquatch in a large area over ten years can look like 300. Six Black Triangles over 30 years can look like thousands. Only an accurate chronology can tell the real story of both. 

[Guest OntarioSquatch]

Even with hoaxes in the mix, such a large-scale migration would have stood out in the report data, and would have been discovered by researchers decades ago. Instead we get reports from across the entire continent every season of the year in a consistent manner. 

 

Another major but more complex issue with that large-scale migration theory is the elusiveness of single individuals mismatching reported behaviour.

e.g.

5000 reports of 3000 elusive individuals

vs 

5000 reports of 200 unelusive individuals  

 

One of these scenerios is more logical when it comes to the reported behaviour and the lack of evidence.

[hiflier]

Who said anything about large scale migrations? There are not herds of Sasquatch. It would seem that there are small pockets of territorial creatures in which only lack of food or a mating call would cause much in the way of transiting to other areas. Natural disasters like wildfires, floods, drought or other forcing factors would be causes for movement as well. Using formulas or algorithms for large animal  population distribution Dr. Meldrum estimated a population of around 60 individuals for the state of Idaho. That's not many at all. The Ouachitas National Forest? Could be a hundred there more or less. NorCal/Washington/Oregon/BC? Maybe a thousand total? Colorado Rockies? Perhaps 50.

 

These speculated numbers are not large migrating populations. And they are speculated along lines of large creatures with a relatively long life and low population replenishment, habitat type, and seasonal food sources coupled with the stresses of Human intrusion and land development along with resource extraction practices. It's why I say these creatures are not doing as well as some might think. I also thing that Sasquatch survived the large megafauna extinction event 11-13,000 years go but just barely. I also think their numbers are more like a bell curve where a small population got bigger and is now dwindling again and has been since the industrial revolution allowed more upheavals in western environments.

 

All speculation but based on other animals' reaction and experience with Human presence and its  mechanized advances. People speak today of the Sasquatch moving to the more remote and rugged areas of habitats and even though its physique would allow it to do so there is no doubt in my mind that there is a hardship involved in those kinds of terrains that require even more in the way of moving around to find food sources and even the risk of injury and death. I just do not think Sasquatch is in a good place right now and even if Human encroachment was to cease altogether it would be a long time before Sasquatch populations turned the corner to increasing their numbers. But Humans are not stopping doing anything anytime soon.     

Edited April 6, 2018 by hiflier

[SWWASAS]

Hiflier your concerns mirror my own.     A worst case scenario in my opinion would be a skeletal find and acceptance by science after the last BF dies and they go extinct.  That would be such a tragedy.  I can just see main stream science saying stuff like "Why didn't anyone tell us?"   

[hiflier]

Thank you, SWWASAS. As long as Bigfoot researchers and proponents are marginalized as weirdos there their voices will not be heard. In the beginning of this thread there were a few comments regarding the San Bernardino lawsuit being quickly dismissed. Those comments were focusing on the lawsuit and not the researcher herself bring in the Petition. This thread was started to speak to the PERSON, not the potential condition or outcome in the court. It is SHE, Claudia Ackley, who was bringing up the disrespect, disregard, and marginalizing of her as a researcher and how it was impacting her credibility. These are real concerns and are the same concerns that I have seen brought up on this Forum more times than I can ever hope to count. Concerns that have been voiced ever since I've been here.

 

But this woman is doing something about that. And Sasquatch existence is the name of the game in order to exonerate her from ridicule. So it IS an important case but the focus is and should be on the person. I mean would any of us ever do such a thing? If answered truthfully then one must admit that this is a courageous and gutsy move by a courageous and gutsy Human. Give credit where credit is due and know that it was she who dismissed her own case because she is adamantly out to WIN it and is smart enough to correct her Petition in the effort to make it more ironclad. A big step in the right direction. She will have her day in court and win or lose it will be a strong pitch for Sasquatch because even though she is making the case based on her rights it is ultimately about Sasquatch's existence just as Twist brought out a while back. It's a good thing.

[SWWASAS]

Well in my own defense I have written my state House of Representative member who introduced a bill seeking to name BF as the state cryptid.   I suggested she go further and provide protections similar to Skamania and a couple of other counties in Washington State with big fines and jail time to someone who shoots a BF.   Federal protection will only come when the species is recognized.  I suggested wording that the protection should be given until the species is recognized by science.    

[hiflier]

Excellent! And......

 

45 minutes ago, SWWASAS said:

Federal protection will only come when the species is recognized.  I suggested wording that the protection should be given until the species is recognized by science.

 

The article about that man in NY who said such a creature doesn't exist anywhere in the world iterated that there was reason to 'manage' mythical creatures. I agree but I would also forward that what is going to come up in court is going to counter his "such a creature doesn't exist anywhere in the world" statement. Unless he knows whether or not the creatures are all dead now. Interesting. 

[SWWASAS]

How can anyone with any scientific credibility state that such a creature does not exist anywhere in the world?       Most scientists are not stupid enough to pronounce such an absolute.  They always hedge and admit it is possible but not likely and demand to see evidence.    While it is highly unlikely it not be true,   I would not even state absolutely that all dinosaurs are extinct.   Especially when we hear about sighting reports from the Amazon basin from the natives that live there.   What are they seeing?  

Edited April 6, 2018 by SWWASAS

[hiflier]

On that note I've always been able to relate to the late Leon Russell's song title "Stranger In A Strange Land". What a world we live in......and on. We're on a tiny round rocky ball spinning out in the middle of nowhere. And many times what I think is important.........just isn't. But when it comes to Modern Man, Sasquatch's existence IS important and on so many levels. And there's one woman who going to press that point home when she gets the chance. It will shake a lot of foundations if she succeeds. She's going to bat for Sasquatch and I say GOOD! Go for it.

Edited April 6, 2018 by hiflier