Super-Human Sasquatch

[Guest jerrywayne]

 

The problem for me is the use of the term "superhuman" in the OP title. Superhuman refers to extraordinary powers in humans, fictional or real. Superman possesses superhuman powers by definition. The fellow that lifts a car off of someone trapped underneath in a panic is said to have displayed superhuman strength under stress.  To refer to the strength of animals like bears or gorillas or the cryptic Bigfoot as superhuman doesn't really apply. 

 

As to the alleged feats found in Bigfoot reports that the OP is most interested in, they are entertaining but obviously not conclusive (which I know is not news to anyone here). Perhaps the adjective "superhuman" is employed to suggest that human agency could not perform these alleged feats and therefore credence must be granted to the accounts? Or, am I just overthinking the issue?

[hiflier]

First Off, jerrywayne, I welcome you to the Forum  And yeah, 'superhuman' is a questionable adjective (noun?) and could even be considered arbitrary, or at least relative. In this case I would consider it to be relative. What witnesses seem to describe are actions that, relative to Humans, would be outside a Human's capabilities. At the same time credence should not be applied to an anecdotal account unless there is reason to trust the reliability of the source which, in some cases, would appear to be just that- a reliable source.

 

There are a lot of factors that make up having confidence in any report's source which cannot occur when I just list things like "bit the neck of a deer' without any other info. But then these aren't my reports either. I just organized the descriptions witnesses gave when relating these incidents. They are essentially thumbnails of a slightly larger descriptive. The thumbnails however are what are actually in the database under John Green's heading "Superhuman Actions" and not something I worded myself. 

 

What was interesting about the "deer neck bite" though was something that gets discussed here sometimes. It's a phenomenon that SWWASAS has described along with others. In this particular report (Aug. 1978) the witness, who was just at the edge of a clearing, saw a deer appear, and then there was a loud scream. The deer stopped, turned around to face where it had come from and the witness went on to say that the deer just let a Bigfoot walk up to it in six steps and didnot fight back or run when the Bigfoot reached it, it bit the deer in the neck, grabbed it by the muzzle, threw or over its shoulder and, after a growl, simply walked off with it.

 

I guess what was strange to me was that the witness ALSO just stood there, like the deer, and watched the whole thing and didn't run, yell from fright, or apparently anything else that a survival instinct would tell a Human to do. So the story is either telling us something very important about Sasquatch or its all fabrication. That decision for some is easy to make but for others it isn't. I thought this topic, which never receives much attention, would be interesting to delve into.

Edited April 19, 2018 by hiflier

[PBeaton]

Squatchy McSquatch said, "Roger Patterson once claimed..." when in fact it was actually Harvey Anderson who claimed Patterson told him that, as well as other questionable stuff in my opinion. It's whether you believe Long an Harvey Anderson, myself, not really. For all I know Anderson could be recallin' the image Patterson used in his book to go with the story of Ben Wilder told of bein' awakened from his sleep in his car. 

 

"According to Anderson, Patterson claimed he not only seen Bigfoot, but that it had had touched his car and had actually lifted up one end." http://www.bigfootencounters.com/articles/korff04.htm

 

Back in my younger days, we'd try a pick up vehicles so that you could slide a bill(money)under the tire, got quite a few up. Although these days, I kinda regret a lifetime of luggin' an liftin' for a livin' haha...kinda.  

[Guest OntarioSquatch]

The two forms of analysis that I personally rely on are 1) Analyzing a group of reports for recurring characteristics that hoaxers would not think of, and 2) Analyzing individual reports using a variety of psychoanalytical methods. The second tends to be more difficult, but the results from both forms of analysis can support each other and make it easier as one builds an understanding of sasquatch morphology and eyewitness psychology.

 

When assessing a single report, there are a wide variety of things that one should consider

 

e.g.

 

Is the witness well-read on the phenomenon? (making it more likely that they could be copying what they read from other reports)

 

Is the witness clever? (making it more likely that they employed their own advanced psychoanalysis while crafting a hoax)

 

Does the structure of their ideas in sentences indicate truthfulness? (this is a difficult one, but very useful). Does the witness’s alleged behaviour indicate a genuine emotional state?

 

Is their story self-consistent? Are there conflicting differences when they report it a second time?

 

Are there geographical or seasonal trends among a group of reports that could lend some credibility?

 

Once one gains a comprehensive understanding of the characteristics of sasquatch that hoaxers wouldn’t think of, analyzing reports becomes easier, and one can do it at a higher success rate. The downside of using psychoanalysis is that you won’t be able to convince others (this includes the people who do peer review for science journal publications).

 

 

 

Edited April 19, 2018 by OntarioSquatch

[hiflier]

All excellent points OntarioSquatch. In looking at those points I weighed them against the neck bite report. The one outstanding thing that a hoaxer in 1978 might not come up with is the image of a deer simply standing in it's place while a huge predator just walked up to it and killed it. That whole scenario IMHO is just too bizarre to even imagine. Deer jump at the crack of a twig and generally they will wait for ONE of their keen senses of either sight, hearing, or smell, to be verified by a second. They certainly don't need all three to bolt. But in the picture painted by the witness that deer had ALL THREE bells going off but was subdued anyway. It's a very strange account.

 

And like I said before we can either learn something very valuable or just call the witness a big fat liar. Either way the telling of that story requires something more than it being just a story. There is a facet to it that I've never read anywhere else: a deer completely incapacitated and waiting for its own demise without even being touched. If that story is anywhere near true then someone hunting Sasquatch to dispatch it needs to be very aware of such a 'weapon'. It has all the markings of infrasound.

 

And as I have said I usually have a point to bring up when I begin a thread. And this is it. I had read that report a long wile back but only recently revisited it. Ever since SWWASAS spoke about his experience with possibly being 'zapped' this report has been nagging at me. Is this why Sasquatch screams are heard? they are freezing prey? Is this why there are no reports that I am aware of that speak of a struggle between deer or elk with some kind of ruckus of battle? is it why bloody kills in winter are laying around? or large areas of disturbed snow? Can this creature take its quarry with only a scream and just walk up to it and make off with it to take somewhere to eat? or to its family to eat? It's a chilling thought to be sure. This is why this thread exists- on the basis of that report.

 

  

Edited April 19, 2018 by hiflier

[Squatchy McSquatch]

6 hours ago, norseman said:

 

I wont go that far.... proving it true means a dead body. In fact Roger being around so many live Bigfeet and not knocking one down? Is suspect for me. Especially being a cowboy. We are a murderous lot. I’ve killed cows, old horses, old dogs, cats, chickens, coyotes, hawks, owls, badgers, ground squirrels, deer, elk, bear, turkey, turkey vultures, grouse, tree squirrels, camp robbers, hogs.....not gonna count fish. A lot.

 

But Yer trying to prove to the world that Bigfoot exists......but now you decide to draw the line in the sand? I do like Bob Gimlin though. We got to talk abit about breaking mules.

 

But as far as strength....lifting the front of a Volkswagen is child’s play. A 800 lbs Sasquatch should be able to pick it up and throw it off the logging road!

 

Norse let's be fair here. We don't know what kind of Volkswagen it was. Was it a Beetle or a van? We don't know if Roger owned a Bug. We do know that he had a VW van. We have no way of determining the lifting capabilities of a Bigfeet. To show a video of a steroid-riddled  human lifting a truck is not a fair and decent comparison. 

 

At what point do you call a spade a spade?

 

Does any rational part of you believe that Roger Patterson had his vehicle hoisted by a Sasquatch?

 

 

 

 

Edited April 19, 2018 by Squatchy McSquatch

[norseman]

52 minutes ago, Squatchy McSquatch said:

 

Norse let's be fair here. We don't know what kind of Volkswagen it was. Was it a Beetle or a van? We don't know if Roger owned a Bug. We do know that he had a VW van. We have no way of determining the lifting capabilities of a Bigfeet. To show a video of a steroid-riddled  human lifting a truck is not a fair and decent comparison. 

 

At what point do you call a spade a spade?

 

Does any rational part of you believe that Roger Patterson had his vehicle hoisted by a Sasquatch?

 

 

 

 

 

Asking IF it could be done is a very different thing than askin DID it happen.

 

How is it not a fair comparison? A Gorilla is 10 Times stronger than a human. And a 1/2 ton Chevy pickup is twice as heavy than a VW Van.

 

http://www.bustopia.com/vw-weigh-size-dimensions.html

 

http://media.chevrolet.com/media/us/en/chevrolet/vehicles/silverado/2018.tab1.html

 

And as PB pointed out? Your story is crossed and it wasn’t Roger that it happened to. Is that right?

 

I know you do not believe in Bigfoot. So how strong do you think Gigantopithecus was? Could it have picked up half a VW bus.....2500 lbs?

 

I would have to say that the story is plausible but unproven, because the creature is unproven.

 

I meant Chevy PU.....half being 2500 lbs.

Edited April 19, 2018 by norseman

[hiflier]

 

[Guest OntarioSquatch]

Wild apes are generally a lot stronger than humans pound for pound. With sasquatch it could be an individual that’s over a 1000 pounds, which is far above the 250- pound weight that many powerlifters have.

 

Edited April 19, 2018 by OntarioSquatch

[norseman]

 

[cmknight]

1 hour ago, hiflier said:

All excellent points OntarioSquatch. In looking at those points I weighed them against the neck bite report. The one outstanding thing that a hoaxer in 1978 might not come up with is the image of a deer simply standing in it's place while a huge predator just walked up to it and killed it. That whole scenario IMHO is just too bizarre to even imagine. Deer jump at the crack of a twig and generally they will wait for ONE of their keen senses of either sight, hearing, or smell, to be verified by a second. They certainly don't need all three to bolt. But in the picture painted by the witness that deer had ALL THREE bells going off but was subdued anyway. It's a very strange account.

 

And like I said before we can either learn something very valuable or just call the witness a big fat liar. Either way the telling of that story requires something more than it being just a story. There is a facet to it that I've never read anywhere else: a deer completely incapacitated and waiting for its own demise without even being touched. If that story is anywhere near true then someone hunting Sasquatch to dispatch it needs to be very aware of such a 'weapon'. It has all the markings of infrasound.

 

And as I have said I usually have a point to bring up when I begin a thread. And this is it. I had read that report a long wile back but only recently revisited it. Ever since SWWASAS spoke about his experience with possibly being 'zapped' this report has been nagging at me. Is this why Sasquatch screams are heard? they are freezing prey? Is this why there are no reports that I am aware of that speak of a struggle between deer or elk with some kind of ruckus of battle? is it why bloody kills in winter are laying around? or large areas of disturbed snow? Can this creature take its quarry with only a scream and just walk up to it and make off with it to take somewhere to eat? or to its family to eat? It's a chilling thought to be sure. This is why this thread exists- on the basis of that report.

 

  

Infrasound ... Darn!  Ya beat me to it!  I can see infrasound as being totally plausible, but not during a scream. That would involve vocal chords vibrating at different frequencies at the same time. One vibration being way above 20 Hz, and the other between 0 and 20 Hz. Is that even possible?

[hiflier]

Hi cmknight, welcome to the BFF  I need to first correct a question in my post:

 

10 hours ago, hiflier said:

Is this why Sasquatch screams are heard? they are freezing prey? Is this why there are no reports that I am aware of that speak of a struggle between deer or elk with some kind of ruckus of battle? is it why bloody kills in winter are laying around? or large areas of disturbed snow?

 

The bold/underlined should have read: "is it why bloody kills in winter are NOT laying around? As far as dual frequency I know the Human voice print and other examples of sound displayed on a graph (outside of an oscilloscope) do not show up as a single linear line. To set the record straight, I have never seen a Sasquatch or heard a scream I do know that fire engine horns, Train engine horns, fog horns, air raid sirens, and other klaxons emit sound made up of several tones. A guitar string vibrates in at least three tones- low, medium, and high.

 

But to address your comment:

 

8 hours ago, cmknight said:

One vibration being way above 20 Hz, and the other between 0 and 20 Hz. Is that even possible?

 

I cannot pretend to know that. In the report the witness said he first heard the creature emit a scream. I have read where supposed Sasquatch screams sometimes start out low and then peak out in a scream. And sometimes followed by a growl. Here the witness's account or the incident. I bolded and underlined the point being brought up. As I said, this is a pretty bizarre account.........just on this basis:

 

Ernest Fritz said he was going fishing about 5:30 a.m. from his ranch in the Yaak River area and paused at the edge of a meadow hoping to see a moose. A deer burst out of the timber into the meadow and stopped about 100 feet from him. He heard a terrific scream in the woods the deer came from. The deer froze and a huge bipedal creature appeared, took about six strides, grabbed the deer by its antlers, picked it up and bit its neck, the deer offering no resistance. The creature then stood for a moment looking around and growling, then grabbed the deer by the muzzle with one hand, threw it over his shoulder and walked back into the woods. Creature was very large and heavy, but also quick and agile. Very dark, but not black. Hair covered hands and feet, but not much on face. Head appeared gorillalike.

[JustCurious]

I can tell that others can't tell when I'm being facetious here!   One of my pet peeves is that Randi is prone to proving something CAN be done and then leaping to the conclusion that it is proof something was hoaxed.  Hence the reversal of that method.

[ioyza]

9 hours ago, cmknight said:

That would involve vocal chords vibrating at different frequencies at the same time.

 

Not necessarily. 

 

 

I'm not saying this is literally what's going on, just that you can achieve multiple discreet tones by changing the resonance of the mouth and throat (in fact, this is how different vowel sounds are produced). I think it's pretty reasonable that if a sasquatch is stunning prey with infrasound in a "roar" type of vocal, that part of that vocal would land in the audible range because of the overtones (as opposed, perhaps, to when they "zap" a human, they might be careful to emit a consistent low growl or hum that is controlled and only just loud enough to achieve the desired effect - these might not produce audible frequencies [if "zapping" is achieved by infrasound] ).

 

Not to divert too much, but on the topic of two-tone vocal production, one of my all-time favorite recordings, the Colorado Howl by Stan Courtney, exhibits this property in a fascinating way. To quote DB Donlon's analysis: 

 

Quote

I’ll attach some pictures and if you look at the third window, with the frequency spikes, you’ll see that at the beginnings of the calls there’s an extra frequency in the call that is not related to the fundamental. 

 

To my ear, the first tone is made up of two tones with an interval of a major third, then the second tone jumps up to the octave above the lower tone. When Donlon says it's not related to the fundamental, he means it's not in the overtone series of the fundamental (the first overtone is an octave above the fundamental - this second frequency heard in the call is much closer in frequency to the fundamental). I don't really know how one could achieve that. It sounds like it's related to these concepts, that there's a "roughness" in the timbre of the roar that sort of forces some portion of the mouth or vocal cavity to vibrate at that pitch in relation to the fundamental, but... well let's just say it's not something a human could do.

[hiflier]

Putting everything together in context, which is the only way to look at any one thing BF, one has to include all reports of sounds alleged to be made by a creature that sounds like no other. The various types of audible sound and their styles of deployment need to be added up to maybe determine the most common sound or sounds one hears. I've read a lot as I've mentioned about a low sound escalating into a scream followed by a growl. The entire sequence being very loud and long with most witnesses commenting that Humans could not develop that kind of powerful projection, even across valleys, that would last as long as these calls are said to last. Some witnesses claimed they even felt chest vibrations.

 

So physically while projecting a combined high and low frequency may be physically impossible it would seem that there are examples of escalating tones and in the beginning the 'tones' maybe inaudible to Humans. Those tones may affect dogs though which may account for reports of dogs cowering and not wanting to go into woods or coming out of the woods on a dead run. In encounters with Humans I've read many times that cameras are not thought of, guns don't get raised, or if they do a feeling of fear of what might happen if someone were to pull the trigger, and a fear that has made some hunters quit hunting altogether.

 

There is infrasound emitted by large animals. Small animals? Who is to say. Small predators may be able to affect small prey in some way? Like a house cat that can stalk a bird at a feeder or creep up on it while it's on the ground, or confuse mice? IDK. Just tossing thoughts out here. But it does seem that the larger the predator the better the technique. Has a controlled infrasound frequency ever been detected coming from Humans even though we all know that Human vocal cords seem only to emit sound in the Human hearing frequency range? https://www.medicaldaily.com/man-worlds-deepest-voice-hits-notes-only-elephants-can-hear-242157 See? I need the science- GOTTA have the science!

 

Now. What about that Sasquatch? Suffice it to say that this deer-neck-bite report has raised a lot of questions LOL.

Edited April 19, 2018 by hiflier