Yeti real or myth

[hiflier]

So after turning things over a bit, the thought crept in about a hypothetical evolutionary relationship between the Yeti, Orangutan, and Gigantopithicus. Obviously the Orangutan line survived the various paleoclimatic changes where Giganto did not. And although the Shipton trackway looks more similar to Gorilla morphology it would seem that Orangutan, being more native to the area, would be more closely related to the Yeti since there are no Orangutans spread out between Africa and Asia. Could the Yeti be possibly be a left over remnant of an ancient Gorilla line that migrated East? Foot morphology might say yes, 

[norseman]

2 minutes ago, hiflier said:

So after turning things over a bit, the thought crept in about a hypothetical evolutionary relationship between the Yeti, Orangutan, and Gigantopithicus. Obviously the Orangutan line survived the various paleoclimatic changes where Giganto did not. And although the Shipton trackway looks more similar to Gorilla morphology it would seem that Orangutan, being more native to the area, would be more closely related to the Yeti since there are no Orangutans spread out between Africa and Asia. Could the Yeti be possibly be a left over remnant of an ancient Gorilla line that migrated East? Foot morphology might say yes, 

It’s probably more along the lines of convergent evolution. Orangs are canopy dwellers. Gorillas are not. So a Gorilla’s foot is somewhere between a Human and a Orang. If a Orang got down outta the trees and started walking a couple of million years ago? What would their foot look like?

 

And I agree that a Sasquatch is much closer to a human foot than the Yeti.

[Patterson-Gimlin]

36 minutes ago, norseman said:

Mt McKinley (highest point in North America) barely would make the base of Mt. Everest. And Mt Rainer would be a foot hill.

 

I dont think the average American fully appreciates just how high these mountains are.

 

Sherpa’s Yeti is linked to their religion, yes. But so is the Sasquatch linked to Native American religions. That’s to be expected.

 

And I think it should be way more likely that a Sasquatch body be retrieved relatively close to Seattle or Portland than Kathmandu. There are hardly any good roads in Nepal. 

Agreed, but neither place has produced one man ape body yet(i).

Hopefully that changes in the future. 

[norseman]

4 minutes ago, Patterson-Gimlin said:

Agreed, but neither place has produced one man ape body yet(i).

Hopefully that changes in the future. 

But by logic North America should easily win that race.

 

 

[hiflier]

It still brings up the point, though, that other than anecdotal evidence, with all of the supposed types reported globally for at least the last couple of centuries, that there isn't one specimen to be had, partial or otherwise, that science will accept as proof. Not one. IMHO, that borders on the absurd. We talk about our 12,000 or so plus reports in North America? What about globally? The Yeti, Orang Pendak, Yowie, Yeren, Meh-Teh, Sasquatch, Sedapa, and a myriad other creature types and locations. And all we are left with today, with science and all of its investigative powers,  is for some citizen scientist/researcher/hunter to either shoot one or collect DNA? The sheer gross imbalance of all of this is truly incredible to even ponder.

[Patterson-Gimlin]

Yes borders on  absurdity and in my opinion is the best case for non-existence. 

[norseman]

54 minutes ago, hiflier said:

It still brings up the point, though, that other than anecdotal evidence, with all of the supposed types reported globally for at least the last couple of centuries, that there isn't one specimen to be had, partial or otherwise, that science will accept as proof. Not one. IMHO, that borders on the absurd. We talk about our 12,000 or so plus reports in North America? What about globally? The Yeti, Orang Pendak, Yowie, Yeren, Meh-Teh, Sasquatch, Sedapa, and a myriad other creature types and locations. And all we are left with today, with science and all of its investigative powers,  is for some citizen scientist/researcher/hunter to either shoot one or collect DNA? The sheer gross imbalance of all of this is truly incredible to even ponder.

I think science took the Yeti a bit more seriously for awhile. They had Jimmy Stewart smuggle out a supposed Yeti finger. Hillary smuggled out a scalp. 
 

None of the samples turned up to be a novel primate. Human, Goat, Etc….

[Huntster]

1 hour ago, hiflier said:

.......What about globally? The Yeti, Orang Pendak, Yowie, Yeren, Meh-Teh, Sasquatch, Sedapa, and a myriad other creature types and locations. And all we are left with today, with science and all of its investigative powers,  is for some citizen scientist/researcher/hunter to either shoot one or collect DNA? The sheer gross imbalance of all of this is truly incredible to even ponder.

 

The Orang Pandek was given a big boost just 15 years ago with the discovery of Homo Floresiensis. Henry Gee of Nature Magazine even outright stated that cryptic hominids took a step out of the shadows and had to be given more credence, but since then? Almost nothing.......at least openly. 

 

And that, I believe, is the key. Whatever is happening is not in the open, and nor will it be. 

[hiflier]

Thought someone took a closer look at the Pangboche hand/finger bone fairly recently and said Black Bear.

 

[norseman]

8 minutes ago, hiflier said:

Thought someone took a closer look at the Pangboche hand/finger bone fairly recently and said Black Bear.

 

I read it was a human?

[hiflier]

35 minutes ago, Patterson-Gimlin said:

Yes borders on  absurdity and in my opinion is the best case for non-existence. 

 

It is the best case, yes, but even as a best case it has yet to close the door on the issue. All it takes is one countering fact, or set of countering facts, in a non-existence theory to turn it over. That's why we're here and doing what we do. And not just because of a butt crack either                                                                                                                                                 

[hiflier]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pangboche_Hand

 

"On 27 December 2011 it was announced that a finger belonging to the hand contained human DNA, following tests carried out in Edinburgh. Dr. Rob Ogden commented that "We have got a very, very strong match to a number of existing reference sequences on human DNA databases...(my bolding) Human was what we were expecting and human is what we got.""

 

 

https://www.cnn.com/2017/11/28/health/yeti-scientific-proof-study/index.html

 

"Charlotte Lindqvist and a team of scientists were first approached to examine the “Yeti” samples by Icon Films, which had been working on a 2016 documentary about the creature.

 

“We didn’t set out to debunk the myth. We were open-minded, and we did learn something,” said Lindqvist, a scientist in the department of biological sciences at the University at Buffalo. She is currently a visiting associate professor at Nanyang Technological University in Singapore.

“I’m not an expert in the Yeti legend, I’m not an anthropologist, but as someone who works with genetics, I thought this is the kind of the work that could tell an interesting story.”

 

Lindqvist used mitochondrial DNA sequencing to examine 24 “Yeti” samples including hair, bone, skin and feces.

 

Mitochondrial DNA has been used in archeology to solve a number of mysteries. For example, scientists used it to determine that fossilized human feces samples found in a cave in Oregon were at least 14,000 years old, suggesting that humans have lived in what is now the United States a lot longer than historians had thought.

 

Has the mystery of the Yeti finally been solved?

Using this technique on the “Yeti” samples, Lindqvist and the team discovered that the items came from a Himalayan brown bear and a black bear. One tooth was from an animal in the dog family. The paw of the “Yeti” kept in a monastery came from a black bear. Another bone kept as a monastic relic was from a Tibetan brown bear."

 

 

Edited January 10, 2022 by hiflier

[Catmandoo]

1 hour ago, hiflier said:

I thought this is the kind of the work that could tell an interesting story.”

 The comment is from the Lindqvist team.  The Pangboche hand is a funny story. As the story goes, the monks would not allow the hand to be analyzed so Peter Byrne stole finger elements and replaced the stolen items with human finger bones. Where did Byrne get the human bone pieces? Jimmy Stewart, Peter Byrne, Edmund Hillary and Tom Slick were  quite a cast of characters.

 

Countries in the Himalayans have burial practices called 'sky burials'. Corpses are placed outside for the scavenger birds to eat. The vulture and crow populations  take care of the bodies. Bodies are presented whole or chopped up. To me, finding a finger bone or hand  would not get me excited.  'Yeti' is still a tourist draw.

 

Time will tell about the high altitude tracks in snow.

[hiflier]

Yep, it's the old Loch Ness eel DNA dance. Just because we got bear DNA from the Himalayas snow tracks doesn't mean the Yeti doesn't exist.

[Twist]

5 hours ago, hiflier said:

It still brings up the point, though, that other than anecdotal evidence, with all of the supposed types reported globally for at least the last couple of centuries, that there isn't one specimen to be had, partial or otherwise, that science will accept as proof. Not one. IMHO, that borders on the absurd. We talk about our 12,000 or so plus reports in North America? What about globally? The Yeti, Orang Pendak, Yowie, Yeren, Meh-Teh, Sasquatch, Sedapa, and a myriad other creature types and locations. And all we are left with today, with science and all of its investigative powers,  is for some citizen scientist/researcher/hunter to either shoot one or collect DNA? The sheer gross imbalance of all of this is truly incredible to even ponder.

This (IMO) is the biggest reason believers become ex-believers.  Spend enough time following the subject and this becomes an insurmountable fact.    Granted, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence…..but after XX years……..  

 

All we have to go on is subjective at best evidence and unverifiable accounts.    

Edited January 11, 2022 by Twist