Guest sacripper Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 I have a gopro hero 3 black edition. High resolution, but it is wide angle. Great for first person sports and such, but it isn't going to be very likely to catch useful video more than about 50 feet away, which is closer than most get to our subject. It has an f2.8-6 aspherical lens, if that helps describe its image tendencies to any photographer types. Where it may have use, is its time lapse function. It can take up to 12Mp images at intervals ranging from .5 to 60 seconds apart, and output it as a movie using their software. With 64GB capacity, the limit is battery life. There are auxiliary batteries available that can allow the unit to run until it's memory is filled (up to 20,000 hi-resolution frames by my math). It can be connected to an external usb battery to ensure adequate power. If it were configured for one image every ten seconds, it would make a 55 hour time lapse file. It's small, waterproof case would allow a myriad of hiding options, too. There are many variables such as Megapixel settings, compression, etc settings to consider when setting up a rig for a given task, but this gives you some idea. For what it is worth.
SWWASAS Posted February 17, 2016 BFF Patron Posted February 17, 2016 (edited) I have to defend the GoPro type camera even though it is wide angle. It is nearly instant on, unlike conventional cameras. One of my field cameras is a Contour Roam, similar to GoPro but not boxy. I have it mounted on my hiking pole and keep it covered with a sock. The sock serves two purposes, hiding the camera if BF is indeed camera shy, and some level of protection from scratches when I am forging through the bush. Mounting on the pole provides a tripod like base to stabilize the camera and reduce camera movement. Additionally I can start the camera, point it even behind me, and look another direction. A BF might not even be aware that I am running it since I am not holding it up to my eyes. A conventional camera cannot be removed from a case, powered up, and start taking pictures in the time you have for most BF encounters. Then there is the autofocus issue. Intervening brush or trees and the camera will be focusing on the vegetation rather than the subject BF you want to get. We see that in most BF videos. The fixed focus, nearly instant on, GoPro, or knockoff camera has the best chance to get video. The P/G film should be used as the technical challenge standard. You will likely have less time to get video than they had. You don't want to waste that time, getting the camera out, running, and focused. Most of the sports cameras allow rapid stills. As far as I am concerned that just wastes opportunity for video frames. Nearly every frame of the P/G film has been argued in detail. If someone gets the same opportunity they had, you want every frame you can get. That way muscle groups, gait, face expressions, all can be studied in detail. Of course a commercial grade video camera would be ideal. But do you want to carry 10 lbs of camera, then have the challenge of getting it on and focused, on the unlikely chance that you encounter a BF? I don't. On the unlikely chance that I see a BF from some distance that is not aware I am present, and that does happen, I carry another small conventional high res camera that has a 30X optical zoom then 10X more digital zoom on top of that. Either way I feel like if I get the chance, I can get good video. Whatever distortion the wide angle GoPro type camera introduces can be compensated for if you get the golden ring video. The important thing is getting it somehow. Just my two cents for what it is worth. Edited February 17, 2016 by SWWASASQUATCHPROJECT 1
TritonTr196 Posted February 17, 2016 Posted February 17, 2016 The gopro 3 black is the best one to use. Best pov shots period... If you don't like the widescreen you can easily change that in the settings. I use three gopros and sometimes all at once. Full beautiful HD videos.. I can see very clearly a long ways off on it in the right mode.... Sure if you use the wide panoramic view you won't see far... You should have gotten a instruction manual with it to show how to change these settings... Put it on the 1080 30fps setting and you will have a nice regular view on it instead of the panoramic view. Only time I use the panoramic view is sometimes when I'm bass fishing.. The gopro mic is also good if you use the right case for it... Picks up really good... I got a nice tree being snapped followed by a quick knock couple hundreds yards away couple weeks ago on the gopro. Made a 40 minute long video of it... Most is the actual drive into my spot... Put the entire drive on there since there's not enough people around me to go in there themselves... I also use the gopro headstrap. It's the best way to use the gopro if you're out Bigfooting.. It turns when your head does.. Instead of being on your chest which only sees whats in front of you.... Of course even though it's beautiful HD quality once you upload it youtube they encode long it's being uploaded and it pretty much destroys the HD quality even if you choose the highest HD setting on the youtube player.
MagniAesir Posted February 18, 2016 Posted February 18, 2016 (edited) yes...the scope was inexpensive and the camera was cheap. The tripod? also cheap but it will suit my needs I hope. That cheap camera works great as a dash cam, which is mostly what I use it for. What I like about it (the camera) is that in car mode it takes 3 minute movies, making them easy to search and edit. I want to find a better camera with a similar feature.my daughters bought me a vivitar action camera for father's day 2014it came out of the box broken, returned it to Walmart the second one lasted 3 outings as a dash camera then stopped working never again will I get a vivitar product I now use a gopro knockoff sjcam sj4000 it works pretty good as a dash camera and I will buy a head or chest strap for it this spring Edited February 18, 2016 by MagniAesir
MIB Posted February 18, 2016 Moderator Posted February 18, 2016 Thermal imaging gear is not going to provide acceptable evidence. Look at the responses to the Gray's Harbor thermal footage or Stacy Brown's thermal footage from Florida. People who believe accept and people who scoff reject. I can't think of anyone who has truly changed their mind about existence based on either. The value of thermal imagery is indirect: if you get what seem to be "hits" for bigfoot on a thermal imager you know where to deploy other techniques / technologies that might produce results of a more accepted sort. I can think of several backroad systems I would cruise with a vehicle equipped with high end thermal imagers if I had one available to identify places to set up trail cameras, look for tracks, and knock or call if I were so-inclined. I don't think buying thermal gear is the best choice for an entry level person on a limited budget. Good thermal gear is expensive. the lowest end unit I see much value in is over $7000. (C'mon, lottery ticket!) At the same time, I'm not sold on GoPro. Unless you're in a real hot spot, activity of ANY sort more than 1 time in 20 is probably delusion. Particularly during daylight hours. Despite seeming lack of results so far, the best bet we have for photographic evidence is still trail cameras. The best "bait" is yourself. Go camping. Set them up to watch camp. Then forget you ever heard about bigfoot and just have a good camping trip with family. Play games, cook, fish, bring instruments, play some music into the evening around a fire. Be human. Forget stealth, just have fun and be interesting to watch. It will work or it wont, either way, you win. MIB 1
BeansBaxter78 Posted February 19, 2016 Posted February 19, 2016 Thanks for your input guys. I'm pretty sure I'm going to go with the gopro and maybe if I have some extra shekels I'll get the therm too. But the gopro will be the primary purchase. I'm not really looking for the next PGF but this is more of an outing to prove the big guy exists to myself. I'm not trying to prove anything to anyone but I'd still like to have some A/V capabilities....just in case.
BigTreeWalker Posted February 20, 2016 Posted February 20, 2016 I'm with MIB. But if you plan to get a thermal anyway, you could look at the Seek Thermal. They make them to plug into an android or iPhone. I have one for my android. If nothing else you can tell you have something giving off a thermal image close to your camp. And you can tell a deer from a coyote (or hopefully a bigfoot).
Lake County Bigfooot Posted July 8, 2016 Posted July 8, 2016 On 2/18/2016 at 9:03 AM, MIB said: Thermal imaging gear is not going to provide acceptable evidence. Look at the responses to the Gray's Harbor thermal footage or Stacy Brown's thermal footage from Florida. People who believe accept and people who scoff reject. I can't think of anyone who has truly changed their mind about existence based on either. The value of thermal imagery is indirect: if you get what seem to be "hits" for bigfoot on a thermal imager you know where to deploy other techniques / technologies that might produce results of a more accepted sort. I can think of several backroad systems I would cruise with a vehicle equipped with high end thermal imagers if I had one available to identify places to set up trail cameras, look for tracks, and knock or call if I were so-inclined. I don't think buying thermal gear is the best choice for an entry level person on a limited budget. Good thermal gear is expensive. the lowest end unit I see much value in is over $7000. (C'mon, lottery ticket!) At the same time, I'm not sold on GoPro. Unless you're in a real hot spot, activity of ANY sort more than 1 time in 20 is probably delusion. Particularly during daylight hours. Despite seeming lack of results so far, the best bet we have for photographic evidence is still trail cameras. The best "bait" is yourself. Go camping. Set them up to watch camp. Then forget you ever heard about bigfoot and just have a good camping trip with family. Play games, cook, fish, bring instruments, play some music into the evening around a fire. Be human. Forget stealth, just have fun and be interesting to watch. It will work or it wont, either way, you win. MIB So buy a FLIR ONE and attach it to your IPhone, while not being state of the art for thermal, it does the job, I like the straight up gray scale for lack of confusion, if you already have a IPhone or Android phone you can get this for $250, and I have to say it is a game changer for night investigations. If you want to stake out an area of known activity you certainly have a better chance of proving to yourself what is using the area at night. I too know that the evidence it provides will not convince many people of anything, but as you say it provides the researcher the evidence he or she needs to proceed with further measures. Frankly my experience is that if you set up too many cameras, or sometimes any cameras they will avoid the area. It has happened to me with setting up a game camera, they simply avoided that area under detection. Even the deer I see in the game camera seem to shy away from it. The light it emits is to invasive.
Explorer Posted July 16, 2016 Posted July 16, 2016 Posted Sunday at 09:34 AM · Report post On 9/10/2015 at 8:50 PM, Explorer said: This summer I tested using a thermal imager (FLIR Scout TS-32 PRO, borrowed from a colleague during a BFRO trip to WA) inside a tent. I took the rain fly off my tent, and the remaining shell is 90% mesh. The experiment was to test if the FLIR could see through the mesh. We tested it and it worked great. I could clearly see my colleague standing 30 ft away thru the tent mesh via the FLIR unit. When we pointed thru the plastic non-mesh part of the tent, then the thermal image went blank/dark (no thermal image). Thus, you can't see thru the non-mesh plastic part of the tent but you can see thru the plastic mesh. Thus, I concluded that if and when I buy my Thermal Imager, then I will bring it inside the tent at night and if I hear something, then I will not turn on any lights and quietly turn on the FLIR unit and scan the 360 surroundings from inside my tent. We also tested seeing thru a black Glad trash plastic back (per idea used by NAWAC) and it worked. The TS-32 could see human shapes and clothing details thru the plastic bag. Thus, the next step is to buy a canopy tent, and surrounded it with black plastic bags and sit inside with thermal imager and recorder (just like NAWAC does it but without the guns). This will only work in areas of active presence. The first option of just sleeping in a regular mesh tent with FLIR is the easier to implement and probably the route I will take first. This is an update on the above idea, that was originally posted on another thread ("Searching: What is Required?"), but I think it belongs here since it is about equipment, technical gear and methods. I finally bought a FLIR thermal imager and attempted the idea above in the area that I am exploring in CA. In summary, it did not work well because while it is true that you can see thru the mesh with a thermal imager, the quality of the image is degraded. I set up inside the tent with only mesh (no rainfly), and used the thermal imager (positioned in a tripod) just to see the surrounding trees. I then opened and closed the mesh tent door to see the difference in image quality and it was vast. With door open I can see details of trees but with door close I could only tell they were trees. Thus, I rejected pursuing this idea. What is the point in buying an expensive FLIR with good image granularity and then degrade it? Instead, I chose to simply open the mesh door and step out whenever I hear something of interest. For this strategy to be less noisy and cumbersome, I needed some quick entry shoes (not boots), no zippered sleeping bag, and thermal imager in standby-mode but not in tripod. BTW, the only wildlife that showed up was a deer. The link below is a Youtube video from Randy Harrington on his approach to using a FLIR thermal imager from inside his tent. His idea is certainly more complex and sophisticated than mine. 1
gigantor Posted July 16, 2016 Admin Posted July 16, 2016 That's great, thanks for sharing it. You have no idea how glad I am to know that there are people like you investing time and money into this research. I'm sure you know what I mean when I say it can feel like you're the only ones doing it and feel foolish for it... Questions: 1) Is your FLIR setup able to be detached from the monitor like Randy explains? 2) Does it have a microphone for sound and if so, is it any good? 3) Confirmation bias is a real problem when you put so much effort into it, it's just human nature. Do you have a plan to corroborate any sightings with footprints, etc and gather supporting evidence? I know it's a pain, but it must be done. 4) How do you choose the location? Thanks!
Explorer Posted July 18, 2016 Posted July 18, 2016 Gigantor, Below are my answers to your questions. I bought the FLIR BHS-XR Command unit that has a built-in video and camera. The built-in video capability is one of the reasons I bought this unit, since I wanted to avoid using an external DVR with dangling cables (as I had previously done with a 2G NV unit attached to a DVR with cables). The new unit has just one button to start video recording and is pretty easy to use. The unit looks like a binocular and is handled similarly. While I have used it hiking at night, I rather use it in a tripod either outside or inside the tent. While I like Randy’s setup a lot, I chose my option to be more portable and flexible. The unit does not have audio recording capability. That is one of its disadvantages. When I use it at night at camp, I always turn on my Tascam DR5 audio recorder to provide the audio. Last time I heard the footfalls, I looked for the potential animal tracks but found none. When I arrive at a new location, I always look for animal tracks in the creeks, ponds, meadows, and also around camp (although soil is not the best for tracks on my site). Right now, my focus is on audio and video, but if I find tracks then I will photograph/video them (I will not cast them). Location was brought to my attention by more experienced and seasoned researchers in the state as a place of interest and supposedly past experiences. I visited with doubt, and only on my 2nd and 3rd solo trip, did I begin to believe that there is a signal there. Not sure yet on how many visits it takes with no measureable results, before I move on to a new location. BTW, I agree with others (who posted above) with the statement that a thermal imager video is not going to provide good evidence for the existence of an unrecognized creature to the scientific community. For me, it is about a tool/instrument that helps me see at night and allows me to capture in photo/video what is present around me. The captured images would be mainly for my own corroboration and confirmation of an objective reality, rather than to provide evidence to anybody. 3
7.62 Posted March 10, 2017 Posted March 10, 2017 Nathenfooter this was a good read and I'm going to be putting together a kit with the suggestions and links you provided . thanks.. I'm actually going to setting up game cams also near a property a coworker of mine owned but has since sold . His property borders a State forest . I've never been a researcher of Bigfoot but the things he told me that happened to him convinced him they were using his property as a route while migrating . He said only during certain times of the year there was activity . He showed me pictures he took of some pretty strange stuff . Funny thing is it was just an off the cuff question during a conversation one night at work. I asked him if he believes in Bigfoot during a conversation about hunting and fishing. His tone and faced changed and then he started talking about what happened to him. He told me he wants to get back into this and I told him I'm game , lets do it.
SWWASAS Posted May 17, 2018 BFF Patron Posted May 17, 2018 (edited) I like the remote monitor setup in Randy's FLIR. Think industrial cameras rather than hand held stuff. https://www.infraredcamerasinc.com/applications/scientific/ Many companies make IR cameras to monitor industrial processes. That lends itself to a campground situation. Hole up for the night and just rotate the camera and look around. My often stated theory is that when you raise a hand held FLIR to your eye to look into the viewfinder you are doing exactly what a hunter with a rifle scope is doing before the hunter takes a shot. Can BF know the difference? The only way it can is to understand the technology of both. I think that very unlikely. Even if BF has some understanding of cameras, put out enough stuff that looks like a camera so BF does not know what is really camera and what is not. Hide it in the clutter. A good test would be to get a buddy to approach your camp, and task him to avoid all cameras. If a human cannot avoid your active camera, it is very unlikely that a BF could. Edited May 17, 2018 by SWWASAS
gigantor Posted May 17, 2018 Admin Posted May 17, 2018 There is a new generation of "Sport " sunglasses with a built-in HD camera. The technology has advanced enough to make it practical and inexpensive. It's the next logical step from a GoPro. Below are two models I'm looking at, leaning towards the Gogloo E7 available at Amazon for $150 because you can tilt the camera. Gogloo E7 This is a sample video from the camera, pretty good... The cheaper model, Powpro ($56) doesn't have Wi-Fi, but I don't really care about that feature. Powpro PP-SG110 Sample video 1
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