Guest Silver Fox Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Thank you for your quick response Fox. I’m so glad I asked this question because it seems that plenty has happened since the days of National Geographic’s cheap shots and the late night garlic borrowing. So if what your saying is that Janice was delusional or had some type of mental illness then how should we view those who validate her claims? I can remember hearing a radio show with a researcher named Joe Fex a few years back. He claimed that these creatures came within a few feet of him while he was on the farm with Mary Green. Close enough that he was able to greet them. Close enough that he feared for his life. This is only one claim that I’m mentioning. I do know of a few others and I’m pretty sure that there’s more then a few. Cryptozoology.com use to have wars over this topic. It was those who staked out the Carter farm and had experienced certain activity vs. those who spent time at the same location and came up with nothing. It was a bad scene. Personally I’m torn. Sometimes I feel that the book Mary penned with Janice should be placed in the fiction section. However, there’s another side of me that wants to know what all of her loyal supporters are seeing. I actually feel the same way as you do. So many things about the farm don't make any sense at all for a habituation site. It's mostly open country. The person who visited the site went around to all of the neighbors and none of them had seen any BF's. She sold the farm and moved 80 miles away and the BF's packed up and moved with her? LOL, please. It doesn't seem possible that they had been around. Then Bayanov and Fahrenbach support her. Bayanov goes there and experiences weird things. A lot of her story makes sense in some way. The same guy who checked out her site found a dog skeleton hanging in a tree. And people say she has knowledge that only a habituator could have. I'm sorry, but none of this story makes any sense to me. I don't see how it could have happened her way, but then again, some things about make me wonder. So much of this stuff about BF, not just the Carter farm, seems to make no sense. Even BF itself makes no sense. No way should this thing exist. But it does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 127 Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Apparently Ketchum had quite a bit of so called BF biological material - hair, scat, along with blood, tissue and even bones and teeth. She tested all of this and some of it came back known species - not BF. But a lot of it was testing something different. Something with both the signs of human and animal DNA. Eventually she gathered together a lot of the material that was creating a similar DNA profile and then began a full sequencing of the DNA code for that material. That is where they decided that it was in the Homo line but not human. OTOH, you are right, there is no BF to test it against, but they have a lot of material from all over North America that is yielding the same DNA profile, and it's not a profile of any known critter. You don't need a base to test against anyway. Denisova DNA was sequenced out in toto and they had no Denisova to test it against. Does anyone know if Ketchum is going to get these findings peer reviewed in a journal such as Nature? Wouldn't it be absolutely HUGE news if something like this was discovered? I haven't heard anything about it. That makes me skeptical of anything substantial. I suspect this could be as much of a let down as the monster quest series was for finding viable DNA samples. Does she have a financial motive to try and muster support for this or is it a true scientific discovery? If so we should be hearing about it soon in an important journal and all of the science publications right? I just don't see that happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Silver Fox Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Does anyone know if Ketchum is going to get these findings peer reviewed in a journal such as Nature? Wouldn't it be absolutely HUGE news if something like this was discovered? I haven't heard anything about it. That makes me skeptical of anything substantial. I suspect this could be as much of a let down as the monster quest series was for finding viable DNA samples. Does she have a financial motive to try and muster support for this or is it a true scientific discovery? If so we should be hearing about it soon in an important journal and all of the science publications right? I just don't see that happening. The DNA sequencing is done, but most have signed NDA's about it. The paper has been written up. This was a 2-3 year project, mind you. The paper is right now out for peer review. No telling how long that will take. Maybe some time. Ketchum got paid for her work for sure. She was a skeptic at first, but now she is sure that BF exists. If she flakes out on this, she looks really bad as a scientist, as if Meldrum were leading us along. Scientist types don't flake out that much. Ketchum has been published in peer review journals before. She is confident certain it will be accepted, but you never now with journals. It's possible that the article may be turned down in peer review and they won't be able to publish in a good journal. Anything is possible. Monsterquest is just a flaky TV show. It's not science or anything like that. The guy who did the DNA is not really good at doing stuff like that - he's not a geneticist. His findings were irresponsibly misinterpreted by the TV show. The Erickson people are not flakes at all, though some that associated with them are. They threw most of the flakes out of the project (Fraud Standing). Erickson is a not a flake or a hoaxer. He's just a bit naive is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southernyahoo Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 I hope people can get to the understanding that if something can be placed as being more closely related to a human, chimp or Neanderthal that it is not a Zebra!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 I can't help thinking of all the mind blowing, world shaking discoveries, pics, videos, or what-have-you, BF deals that were going to be released at the right time, when the public is ready, when the moon was properly aligned, or again what-have-you, since I was a child back in the 60s. All have been busts, hoaxes, or at best not nearly as billed. Won't even go into the BS of "research groups" and forums I've experienced in the last 11 yrears or so... This is why even though I am convinced monkees are a very real species of animal, I look at each new claim of a can't miss BF deal with great levels of reserve. It keeps coming back to the same thing, it's all equivocal at the very best, unless there is a body that is shared openly with the public and science. No mattter how good this video is (if it even exists) it will be eviscerated when it comes out (if it ever actually does) as a hoax. Bank on it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Silver Fox Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 I can't help thinking of all the mind blowing, world shaking discoveries, pics, videos, or what-have-you, BF deals that were going to be released at the right time, when the public is ready, when the moon was properly aligned, or again what-have-you, since I was a child back in the 60s. All have been busts, hoaxes, or at best not nearly as billed. Won't even go into the BS of "research groups" and forums I've experienced in the last 11 yrears or so... This is why even though I am convinced monkees are a very real species of animal, I look at each new claim of a can't miss BF deal with great levels of reserve. It keeps coming back to the same thing, it's all equivocal at the very best, unless there is a body that is shared openly with the public and science. No mattter how good this video is (if it even exists) it will be eviscerated when it comes out (if it ever actually does) as a hoax. Bank on it... The videos seem to exist. The two that I described have been seen by Mary Green, Meldrum, and Bindernagel. The latter two are scientists. They would not lie and say something is real when it's not. Although I agree with the tone of this piece. The Earth shattering news is always coming real soon. I also agree that the videos will be totally destroyed as hoaxes. The skeptics always say that there no good videos of photos of BF. I figured out a while ago that they will never be satisfied by any BF video or photo. They don't believe in any of them. No matter how good it is, they will always say it's a hoax. We really do need a body. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 It puts the story of Esau in a new light. No, it's in the same light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 The paper is right now out for peer review. Are you free to share the name of the journal to which it's been submitted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyO Posted May 9, 2011 SSR Team Share Posted May 9, 2011 Are you free to share the name of the journal to which it's been submitted? Does it really matter ?? Whatever it is, you'll only criticize it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Silver Fox Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Are you free to share the name of the journal to which it's been submitted? I don't know the name. I only know that Ketchum said the paper is done, and right now it's out for peer review. She didn't mention the name of the paper. Most associated had to sign NDA's so the whole thing has been pretty hush hush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Whatever it is, you'll only criticize it.. Why would I criticize a journal for reviewing a submitted manuscript? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 It will be released to time right in with the publication of the DNA evidence, assuming that it is accepted for publication that is. That is Ketchum's work and it is out for peer review right now, which could take some time. What's weird is that the DNA supposedly shows BF between Homo sapiens and Neanderthal, which to me doesn't seem to make sense that they would be so human. They seem so ape-like. Close to Neaderthal, but huge size, no tools, no fire? What gives? Doesn't make sense. Are we positive that BF is *not* a Neanderthal? We only have bones of that race, have they been tested to see if they could be from the Neanderthal species, or closely related? What does *between* the 2 species mean? Does the DNA lean more or closer towards either species? I fear that *peer* review will become a joke because I fear no one will be willing to possibly throw their career away by being the first to do a peer review validating the BF species. I believe that it will take a brave person to be the first to admit that the long ridiculed BF species really does *exist*, IMOVHO... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Much of this becoming off topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyO Posted May 9, 2011 SSR Team Share Posted May 9, 2011 Why would I criticize a journal for reviewing a submitted manuscript? Because of it's subject, which is soemthing that you have strongly denied the existence of, for Years now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 JDL said: I'm not inclined to throw out everything here. Several things Mary reports from the farm ring true to me. Several other things just seem too natural and yet off-beat to have been contrived. Things like coleslaw, cat poop, and goats. The story about how her younger sister had been beaten one night by their mother, then the panic as they tried to get her to come back to the house before the young male got her. The flow of several of Mary's interviews seems too natural for broad deception. But there's too much controversy regarding the language issue for me to accept it at this point. Bottom line is that I think there's some truth, some embellishment, and some fabrication. susi asks: Is there somewhere on line where I can read or watch the interviews? I would truly appreciate being able to see this for myself, BTW, I'm a believer, so I wish to watch for further verification about the BF species.Thank you for any and all help that you can offer...Hugs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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