Why Has No Hunter Ever Shot A Bigfoot?

[norseman]

Norseman, sasquatch is not an animal. There is a big difference in butchering a steer and shooting a human creature in cold blood. If you've never seen the species, you don't know what it is.

Yes, yes it is.

What you saw through your binos at 150 YARDS was an ape that LOOKS LIKE US. Unless you can prove to us that it uses fire, makes tools, and has language? It's not of the recent Homo line........it's not us, it's not human.

If it was a Cro Magnon, you would have seen a spear, some skins for clothing, some jewelry, and maybe even a campfire with something roasting on it.

[Guest]

In one case, in Estacada, Oregon in the summer of 1992, a philosophy professor saw 4 BF's burying another BF under rocks by a stream. He went back a year later to try to find it, but there had been heavy flooding in the spring, and the area was washed out. He could not find the site again.

So then you were wrong. There was no empathy at all on the part of the professor ( professor in itself being an appeal to authority - who could question a professor after all! ). So he did supposedly go back with none of the sentiments you claimed a few posts ago.

Now the problem becomes, what university did this professor teach at? How smart does one have to be to realize the enormous discovery he'd just witnessed? Something so profound that it would rewrite untold text-books - something so big his name would forever be mentioned as the man who disovered an astounding new species?

So what does our learned professor do?

He waits a year to return!

Can you see how this just doesn't add up? Do you see why I asked you how many stories of sightings it would take to get you to believe in Unicorns?

[Guest Silver Fox]

Well there ya go. Let's base our belief system on a sighting. That's good enough for me!

I have no problem with that in general, but the truth is that I base my belief in BF on science. I am a very science-minded person, and to me, the science is quite convincing.

One sighting report is not very good, but we have over 40,000 sighting reports. We have tens of thousands of tracks, some extending for miles in the middle of nowhere where no one could have hoaxed them. We have unhoaxable tracks, unhoaxable video and unhoaxable audio of BF.

Furthermore, reading through those 40,000 reports, there is a strange consistency in the sightings. It's like you're reading the same sighting over and over. To me that suggests a real creature.

Not to mention Native American accounts and early sightings from the 1800's.

That's why I believe it exists. Now, since I believe it exists already, I'm sympathetic to sighting reports, as someone might be to a sighting report of a wolverine's behavior.

In fact, much of our knowledge of say wolverines and whatnot is based on sighting reports, often from Indians and early trappers. Wildlife biology does use sighting reports in its behavioral descriptions of animals.

[Guest BuzzardEater]

Yes, yes it is.

What you saw through your binos at 150 YARDS was an ape that LOOKS LIKE US. Unless you can prove to us that it uses fire, makes tools, and has language? It's not of the recent Homo line........it's not us, it's not human.

If it was a Cro Magnon, you would have seen a spear, some skins for clothing, some jewelry, and maybe even a campfire with something roasting on it.

What if it was a modern human dedicated to living a sequestered lifestyle? Do you suppose a cult could not exist that eschews contact on a cultural level? I commend to you the study of the Beotuk. Start with the Norse description in the Saga of Vineland.

[norseman]

With exception of their numbers, the latter I very much agree with you on. And its rare that a rancher recognizes these utilitarian human improvements as being ******* sensitive species. Kudos to you Norse. But many would cut the trees to allow more grazing land. Many would shoot a wolf and bury it without a thought, so I see many in conflict too in their viewing clearcuts as being bad.

Sadly we've decimated most of our forests. Most don't realize how important native forests were to our environment. Most don't realize that the original forests of the PNW served a purpose when they stood. They filtered the air. They provided a year-round sponge for water that would last through most of the Summer. When there were stands of native forests, we didn't have the giant forest fires of today, mainly because fire could not reach the canopies. Sure it happened on occasion, but nothing like with today's uniform tree farms where canopies are within easy reach of the ground and once a fire hits, it just follows onward like a giant wick.

And then there is the life that old forests once sustained. Mushrooms and lichens, the staples of ungulates and many other species through the Winter. And the canopies above protected the ground from heavy snow. The shrooms and lichen just don't grow in clearcuts or even thinned units! We have cut off much of the food supply for wild animals in the Winter. In our need for wood, we've undercut what the wild animals need to survive, but sadly we're too stupid and greedy to see it as we line our pockets with green. Bigfoot isn't going to bring back the forests that were so important to everything. They may however help us understand the importance of what is gone. Only our realizing their significance will prevent further loss, but that will provide little benefit anymore.

Before some jump on me as some tree hugger, I've marked timber boundaries, I've fought forest fires, I've lived in one of the most beautiful natural places on earth, and I've seen these sasquatch more then once. I've come to understand things from experience and that's why I speak with the conviction I do.

So even with your understanding, you do not see the danger of Sasquatch remaining akin to pixies, gnomes and fairies? And that it would be far, far better for the species if it was officially recognized by science? Sure, Bigfoot the real animal isn't going to bring back the forests that are gone, but he may protect what is left, and that's a start. That's hope.

So we must steel ourselves for the job that must be done.........PROVING it's existence, conclusively. No remorse, no regrets, it's something that must happen for the benefit of the species.

Everyone can say what they want but there isn't ONE environmental impact study sitting on ANY USFS or BLM desk ANYWHERE in the US that considers or protects Sasquatch habitat. Zip, zilch, nada.

[Guest]

We don't know why the state is covering them up. The only quotes we have from two MIB's who contacted a woman in Oregon and told her to be quiet is that the state says "people will panic" if they find out about BF. So the state doesn't want to deal with mass freakout.

Where are the quotes from the MIBS? I would really like to read up on them.

And you don't actually know that any state is covering anything up. That's your opinion.

[norseman]

What if it was a modern human dedicated to living a sequestered lifestyle? Do you suppose a cult could not exist that eschews contact on a cultural level? I commend to you the study of the Beotuk. Start with the Norse description in the Saga of Vineland.

Hell.

If I took my shirt off during a wilderness outing, I would fit that description.........

Just a fore warning though........I shoot back.

[Guest]

Sorry Silver Fox, but I have not read anything in your posts to suggest you are scientifically minded.

[Guest]

Nobody considers the Woolly Mammoth a dinosaur.

Well I wasn't referring to scientists BD, but laypersons. I did clarify that they were more recent too didn't I?

WTB said: Sorry, that's all very weak. So every person who saw BF burying their dead didn't reveal the location out of empathy? You assign the empathy you would feel to the witnesses? How do you know what they feel? Not only arrogant but clairvoyant too. If you can flat out explain it that way then i can flat out say they were all lying. Fair's fair.

I'm guessing from accounts of this there are less then what you can count on one hand. So yeah empathy is very easy to imagine, especially with the stories they have shared with the incidents. Is empathy that difficult for you to understand? Does it really take clarivoyance? lol

As for the frozen ground, sorry, your numbers are a little off. They might be closer if BF's were known to employ steel shovels, but short of that you'll have to try harder.

Okay, so you tell me just what the earth's temperature is? 55° to 57°

I like how you avoided responding to the rest of my post though. Nice!

I avoided arguing with a rock.

I'm guessing its all weak to you because you really don't have much first hand outdoor knowledge do you?

Edited May 26, 2011 by PragmaticTheorist

[Guest]

I avoided arguing with a rock.

I'm guessing its all weak to you because you really don't have much first hand outdoor knowledge do you?

No, you avoided the rest of my post because you have no good rebuttals. And that's okay. Just let's not pretend you're avoiding arguing with a "rock". It's terribly transparent avoidance on your part.

And no, your argument is weak because you avoided half my post and then jibber-jabbered through what you did respond to.

[Guest Silver Fox]

So then you were wrong. There was no empathy at all on the part of the professor ( professor in itself being an appeal to authority - who could question a professor after all! ). So he did supposedly go back with none of the sentiments you claimed a few posts ago.

So what does our learned professor do?

He waits a year to return!

Can you see how this just doesn't add up? Do you see why I asked you how many stories of sightings it would take to get you to believe in Unicorns?

I never said people don't go back due to feelings of empathy. We have a number of sighting reports of BF's burying their dead in various ways. I believe in the totality of those reports. It also explains quite nicely the lack of bodies. Further, the Indians say that BF's bury their dead. And that's based on thousands of years of observation.

There are hardly any sightings of unicorns. When do you ever hear of one? I never do. If something doesn't exist, you don't get many good sighting reports.

[Guest]

I never said people don't go back due to feelings of empathy.

You're right. It was PragmaticTheorist that said people seeing BF's being buried wouldn't go back because of empathy. My bad. Then I guess you tried to get his back by posting an example of someone who did go back. The problem is that it contradicted PragmaticTheorist' empathy theory. The professor had no problem with empathetic feelings going back.

But alas, the story isn't at all believable because of the reasons I already listed.

Another dead end. Is this what you scientifically minded guys call evidence?

[Guest]

Back on topic.

No one has ever shot a Bigfoot because in all likely hood, in all probability, Bigfoot just ain't real - so there's nothing to shoot.

[norseman]

You're right. It was PragmaticTheorist that said people seeing BF's being buried wouldn't go back because of empathy. My bad. Then I guess you tried to get his back by posting an example of someone who did go back. The problem is that it contradicted PragmaticTheorist' empathy theory. The professor had no problem with empathetic feelings going back.

But alas, the story isn't at all believable because of the reasons I already listed.

Another dead end. Is this what you scientifically minded guys call evidence?

Your obviously a skeptic, so let me ask you.......what would it take for you to be convinced if you were the grand pooba of the scientific community?

And if you were convinced what do you think we as humans should do with our discovery?

[Guest]

No, you avoided the rest of my post because you have no good rebuttals. And that's okay. Just let's not pretend you're avoiding arguing with a "rock". It's terribly transparent avoidance on your part.

And no, your argument is weak because you avoided half my post and then jibber-jabbered through what you did respond to.

I had nothing to offer re MIB WTB. Why would I add something where I have never had personal experience nor do I or have I ever claimed to witness MIB (except for the movie of course). As for the Death Certificate, hey I'd like to see them too.

But if you think I jibber-jabbed my response, well then its you who is avoiding facts. I'm waiting on your answer to the earth's temp near the surface. To say someone is jibber-jabbing when I provided actual temp and field conditions is merely a means of trying to avoid the facts himself.

WTB, I never said they don't go back due to empathy either. I implied they don't dig up bones and share with the world.

Edited May 26, 2011 by PragmaticTheorist