Where Are The Sasquatches In The OP??

[Twist]

what % of NA Grizzly experts are located in AK?  Where else are they if not AK ?  

[NatFoot]

Yellowstone?

[norseman]

20 minutes ago, Twist said:

what % of NA Grizzly experts are located in AK?  Where else are they if not AK ?  

 

Western Canada, Washington, Idaho, Montana, Wyoming

[Huntster]

46 minutes ago, Twist said:

what % of NA Grizzly experts are located in AK?  Where else are they if not AK ?  

 

Stephen Herrero is Canadian. Russia has lots of bear experts, primarily because most of the worlds brown bears are there.

[norseman]

[Twist]

That seems to make sense then, given the range of brown/grizzly bear.  

[BobbyO]

On 12/18/2018 at 1:20 AM, bipedalist said:

That area West of Capital Forest and Oakville does look like prime habitat with farmlands and rivers, lots of cove areas and nooks and crannies for the amorous Squatch.

 

Especially in Spring..;)

[SWWASAS]

15 hours ago, norseman said:

 

Western Canada, Washington, Idaho, Montana, Wyoming

I have emailed a grizzly expert at Washington State.    Cannot remember his name right now.   So they are spread around at the various universities.   

[hiflier]

44 minutes ago, SWWASAS said:

I have emailed a grizzly expert at Washington State.    Cannot remember his name right now.   So they are spread around at the various universities.   

 

Sounds like you received  response to your email then. How long did it take? Just curious  

[SWWASAS]

It was only two or three days.   It was not limited to one email.    I found him by looking at the University departments and noticed his area of expertise was grizzly.     I mentioned recording infra sound from some unknown animal and asked him if bears were known to produce infra sound.   When he said no we discussed other animals.     I was hoping it would interest him or some graduate student and get them looking into it.  Hoping that it might lead them to suspecting bigfoot especially since I found a BF footprint about 1/4 mile from the infra sound location.    I never mentioned BF and they did not take the bait.    I keep looking for someone associated with a Washington University that is interested in BF.   

Edited February 12, 2019 by SWWASAS

[hiflier]

I do find that academia does respond quite readily.....depending on the subject. And keeping things along scientific lines does help.

[ShadowBorn]

On ‎2‎/‎9‎/‎2019 at 9:14 PM, NathanFooter said:

 

 To be honest, many have suffered from a lack of success and as result gone Woo ( a free ticket out for the brain when you have done everything and still come out with nothing ), they no longer not see the need to chase reports or data.  They think they can have a habituation site in the side yard next to the bird feeder.  

 

 If they have not gone Woo then they simply drop the subject out of frustration, doing anything for 8 to 10 years with no direct success can eat at a person.  They come in with preconceived notions about how things are going to happen and become disappointed.  Failure is the biggest blow in this subject and eventually wipes away almost every name under the title of researcher.

 

 The truth is these are not creatures you can just go find and film.  They are likely very rare, fear human contact and just plain don't hold a position in any given place long enough to be advanced upon. People have a hard time grasping that something is better at the game then they are.  The fear of failure or being wrong is the only thing that keeps money and time from this subject. 

Thank you Nathan

I just wish that I could help with the investigation of some of these reports in my area which is the State of Michigan. I am not sure about the woo part and I do understand it since I have experience this my self. But how does one prove this side of them? when there is no possible way.  I have sat in tree stands hoping to get glimpse 's of them and yet with no luck  nothing. They seem to know the boundary's of my tree stand and will stay well beyond my bow range and my crossbow. The same goes with shotgun as well as with rifle . But yet are more then willing to wait for a free meal by any hunter hunting game.

 

The Bfro has lost some thing that was really working for them.Not saying that they are going down hill but to loose members due to fees in order to investigate well that Is different. If money is more important then learning the truth  and trying to recruit good investigators. Then we will never know the truth about these creatures . Then the Bfro is on a down fall on it own . I have always been very negative about their outings and how they have promoted  as a guide to help others on finding Bigfoot. Sure that they may use them as recruitment but it comes with a price. Now it is no longer is it being used for research but for tourism . Sure you may say that you are teaching them. But still it is like a glorified tour guide service that are helping people who are unable to find these creatures un their own. I do not want to be like mean about it and am trying to be nice as I can. I can see how there are people out there who might not be able to go out into the woods on there own. This is perfect for them since it makes them feel safer and offers them to experience what some might not.

 

What lacks is the evidence that some might expect what they pay for the experience .We all know that these creature do not behave on cue and when do they? Never. But most in experience do not understand this and expect what they pay for. I think that it is best that I just shut up and keep my mouth shut and not say a word. I should not judge since I have not been on one of these trips. My problem is that I might not be welcome since I am to aggressive. That I am more then willing to move toward the rock throwing or the tree movement or whatever  other thing that these creatures might be doing. That I am more inclined to in danger myself to gain the proof that is needed then to back away. That I am more willing to carry my pistol on my side for self defense knowing that on that other side I am not being hoaxed.

[NathanFooter]

16 hours ago, ShadowBorn said:

Thank you Nathan

I just wish that I could help with the investigation of some of these reports in my area which is the State of Michigan. I am not sure about the woo part and I do understand it since I have experience this my self. But how does one prove this side of them? when there is no possible way.  I have sat in tree stands hoping to get glimpse 's of them and yet with no luck  nothing. They seem to know the boundary's of my tree stand and will stay well beyond my bow range and my crossbow. The same goes with shotgun as well as with rifle . But yet are more then willing to wait for a free meal by any hunter hunting game.

 

The Bfro has lost some thing that was really working for them.Not saying that they are going down hill but to loose members due to fees in order to investigate well that Is different. If money is more important then learning the truth  and trying to recruit good investigators. Then we will never know the truth about these creatures . Then the Bfro is on a down fall on it own . I have always been very negative about their outings and how they have promoted  as a guide to help others on finding Bigfoot. Sure that they may use them as recruitment but it comes with a price. Now it is no longer is it being used for research but for tourism . Sure you may say that you are teaching them. But still it is like a glorified tour guide service that are helping people who are unable to find these creatures un their own. I do not want to be like mean about it and am trying to be nice as I can. I can see how there are people out there who might not be able to go out into the woods on there own. This is perfect for them since it makes them feel safer and offers them to experience what some might not.

 

What lacks is the evidence that some might expect what they pay for the experience .We all know that these creature do not behave on cue and when do they? Never. But most in experience do not understand this and expect what they pay for. I think that it is best that I just shut up and keep my mouth shut and not say a word. I should not judge since I have not been on one of these trips. My problem is that I might not be welcome since I am to aggressive. That I am more then willing to move toward the rock throwing or the tree movement or whatever  other thing that these creatures might be doing. That I am more inclined to in danger myself to gain the proof that is needed then to back away. That I am more willing to carry my pistol on my side for self defense knowing that on that other side I am not being hoaxed.

 

  I have no issue with what you believe, your perspective is born of your experience and I simply think that it may not be accurate. I can respect honesty and humility and I do believe that you have expressed both,  to my knowledge you have not claimed a great secret or expertise from your experience.  I respect that you can't explain your position and that you do not try to wave it around as a fact.

 

  I do have issue with the majority of folks who endlessly claim that Sasquatch in fact have supernatural or advanced capabilities, these people can't produce a single piece of evidence that has weight.   Not a single one can lay clear casts on the table, show an unknown hair example or play an audio clip of anything other than an owl, coyote or neighbors arguing in the distance. They instead claim that they have all this knowledge, info and top shelf evidence but they will not share it out of respect or special interests. You will also note that any topic always comes around into self importance or what they know and what you don't. It never seems to be about expanding the truth or explaining how.  But why would they, they after all are the 13th member of the council of 12. 

 

  The strange thing about this is that for some reason there are people out there who who can produce this information and they are not having Woo experiences. These people actually focus on the details you can see, touch and breakdown.  Why does this methodology pan out far better than anything  else suggested or plastered on an internet forum of facebook ?  It also just happens that these people can actually explain things in detail, they have a natural ability to lead by example, they can consider other perspectives and the different ways people arrive at conclusions and most of all they don't consider themselves to be the most important aspect of the situation. For some reason they can track a set of prints, predict report generation,  gather unknown audio recordings, and record thermal footage. This really should not sit well with anyone who genuinely examines all the information, why do the guys with less information on the " reality " of Sasquatch end up with a weighted table ?

 

  I have sat down and talked with many people who claim Woo experiences ( dozens ) and strangely the majority of them are either self important and deceptive or unstable and delusional.  This is not just my perception and conclusion, the majority of friends and family that interact with these individuals often have further evidence that this is true or at the very least agree that they are mentally unwell in some way. This is yet another win on the side of science, this test is repeatable and consistent just as much so as the flesh and blood search results. The only argument left to try and suggest is that this group has not come up with a body and that argument has been put to bed long before this hour and so we still end up right here in the conversation.

 

  I have also watched people switch sides and it was more than easy to predict, these people simply lack mental discipline and need to believe something to feel significant or to cope with something.  Dealing with failure is simply harder than saying that the subject is just bigger than what anyone can handle or prove, it is huge release to be able to believe you are in the midst of these creatures and that you are special or chosen.  You then don't have to feel like you lost or gave up, you just get to sit back and experience.  It is easy to believe in magic, all you have to do is not pursue the physical truth long enough.  This is entirely a human problem. The individual mind finds ways to explain what it can't grasp and most often this conclusion is not the measurable truth. 

 

 To address the BFRO comments I am going to quote myself from another topic.

 

" 

 The BFRO does not guide you out to gander at Sasquatch the way people do at animals in Yellowstone and nor do we put you on a pack-horse into the most remote locations where a tire may not have met the road in a decade to prepare for a 6 month grant program to be the next Jane G.  This is a common misconception of what we are about as an organization ( I am not speaking for ever single expedition or organizer, some members have their own code of ethics and conduct ). The BFRO as a whole provides a form of education on the entire subject and  how it relates to area ecology and history.  Folks have the opportunity to learn and connect with BFRO members for guidance on some of the points below.   

 

 We provide  attendees to accessible locations that repeatedly generate reports at particular times of the year, we put people in the best position possible to have an experience but we do not promise anything except research methodology and environmental education.  We give directed presentations on witness evaluation, reported behavior, field operations, implementation of thermal/audio technology and basic ecology.       We also offer classes on habitat evaluation, report documentation,  data mapping,  track casting, DNA collection and nighttime observation.  We offer perspective, knowledge, methods, tools and hands on experience so you can go out on your own and maximize your odds of encountering these animals.

 

 It is not impossible that hoaxing does take place on a small percentage of expeditions, both attendees and X-members have been caught in the past doing so. I can speak for the majority of the western US expeds as being honest and professional in nature, no monkey business.   Honestly it is getting more and more difficult to hoax in events like this because of thermal cameras and drones ( the BFRO has a number of units ).

 

 On the expeditions I have been a part of we did allow folks to have handguns as long as they abide by the laws of the region and do not make presence of it in group settings. That being said some organizers are exception as they personally feel the risk of something going wrong is high, having a bunch of folk running around in the dark all jazzed up over something popping in the bush could end badly.   On another note,  if an attendee was inclined to try and hoax something then there is a possibility they themselves could be hurt or worse if another person carrying reacts incorrectly. 

 

 I had never heard that attendees had to stay in their tents, that is new to me.  On the expeditions I have been a part of we actually encourage folks to stay out as late as 3 am to try and provoke interaction or possibly get something to follow groups back toward base-camp . We do setup folks in groups to be moved with a member or repeater, this is a safety policy so nobody is hurt or lost.

[SWWASAS]

I wonder if the BFRO has thought about changing their business model?    Most similar organizations have open membership where members pay an annual fee to be part of the organization.   I am a member of three of these associated with aviation.   The Aircraft Owners and Pilot Association is a large organization that promotes aviation, has regional and national conferences, and provides a lot of classes, information and services to its membership.    It has existed for decades.        The expedition thing for the BFRO could continue and be open to non members but members probably should be discounted.    More people are interested in the BFRO and its products that can take the time to go on expeditions which are limited in number,  regionally limited, and expensive.   Members should receive the benefit of expedition results, have access to the whole data base.     One would think a steady income stream would be of more benefit to the organization than what is raised solely from expeditions.   I suspect that this would never be considered.     Moneymaker wants to stay in control.   He also envisioned a by invitation only membership.    Good old boys club,   secret society,   fraternity comes to mind, where he can boot anyone he does not like or agree with.     None of this promotes science.    If the BFRO was run like other similar organizations Moneymaker would have been removed from the leadership for failure to provide good leadership and causing the downward slide.  

 

If a competing organization used my business model,   which works for many other special interest organizations, it would quickly replace the failing BFRO.  

[Huntster]

While I wish the BFRO had a different policy on admitting potential researchers, and that they worked harder at investigating and following up on reports, it isn't my organization. And whike they've gotten lots of negative reaction to their association with big media and TV shows and their expeditions, these things have universally expanded their brand, which results in being the premier report location. It appears that even government agencies refer people who notify them of encounters to the BFRO.

 

If there was one thing I would hope for and to suggest to the organization is to be more inclusive of people with fieldcraft, investigation, and interview experience and who have time and freedom to become investigators in order to better capture potential ongoing sasquatch activity.