Guest HairyGreek Posted August 30, 2011 Posted August 30, 2011 (edited) Maybe you could volunteer HG !! ??? NO! Not going out there and getting killed so he can say "Bigfoot got him!!" Edited August 30, 2011 by Jodie edited for the allusion to profanity
Guest Posted August 30, 2011 Posted August 30, 2011 Biggie- i must have heard my Grandfather say that 1000+ times before he passed away...(Macy's reference)... It's definitely a NYC saying, and goes way back (30's/40's etc)... As far as MM goes- yea I acknowledged in a later post (above) that I wasnt aware of things he might have posted or said over on Beefro.. (not a slur- that's how i pronounce it lol). So ill retract that part since i guess according to him, he does have final say.... Art
Guest Posted August 30, 2011 Posted August 30, 2011 (edited) NO! Not going out there and getting killed so he can say "Bigfoot got him!!" Yea i love the part i put in italics.... "I will show them what happened to the last people that did not heed my warnings." Huh? pictures ??? shallow graves in the woods near "sylvanic".. ??? Maybe this is the real reason no one has gone with him ?? (alone with creepy guy in woods? no thanks !) Art Edited August 30, 2011 by Jodie edited original quote
Guest HairyGreek Posted August 30, 2011 Posted August 30, 2011 (edited) Seriously, I would want a GPS and 24 hour helicopter surveillance before agreeing to this. He pretty much guarantees you are gonna die. Unless I would be allowed my AR-15 in hand and 1911 on my side, zippy chance this is happening. Edited August 30, 2011 by HairyGreek
Guest vilnoori Posted August 30, 2011 Posted August 30, 2011 (edited) Hmm just noticed that under the youtube video about the time Todd was overdue for three days but finally turned up, there is a thank you to the Radium Search and Rescue. Radium Hot Springs, BC, is not in Alberta, just FYI to all you non-BCer's out there. So presumably one of his research areas, and possibly the famous (or infamous) "Sylvanic" valley is actually in BC and is probably close to Radium Hot Springs! Edited August 30, 2011 by vilnoori
Guest Posted August 30, 2011 Posted August 30, 2011 (edited) I just thought of something horrible, if the Finding Bigfoot team ventures to this land of Sylvanic, and given the complete risk to ones life they would face there, we may never see another episode ever again. "Anyone taking you on an expedition like this that would guarantee your safety would be a liar. Therefore I will tell you outright: If you come on this expedition you are MOST CERTAINLY risking you life. Before I take any new team members on expedition, I will show them what happened to the last people that did not heed my warnings." Oooooo, but they get to see what happened to the last group before them that did not listen. Vilnoori, Actually in one of his discrete change of directions, he stated that he had to abandon Sylvanic because it had been compromised. Edited August 30, 2011 by PragmaticTheorist
steenburg Posted August 30, 2011 Posted August 30, 2011 (edited) Which side do you consider Matt Moneymaker on? Legit researcher or huckster? You backed yourself in this corner. I would like to hear you get out of it. No corner here. I will be glad to tell you what I feel about Matt and his research. Though what this has to do with Standing I don't know. Never had a problem with MM. or the BFRO. but sometimes his conclusions make me scratch my head. But so far I think it is mostly excited over enthusiasm at times that may cloud the judgment rather than any thought of hoaxing. No I can say I have never so far seen anything to suggest MM has ever tried to hoax. There is a difference between hoaxing and simply being mistaken. I know that a number of fine researchers have chosen to leave the BFRO due to personal differences with MM. Well if you ever find yourself running an organization with hundreds of members all of which have their own ideas on how things need to be done, it won't be to long before the resignations start. Matt can be quite stubborn. So what? So can I. As for his new show. I have already said that I do not like the way it is done, but I do understand the reason for it. That is what the viewing public likes. The general public whom only give the Sasquatch 10 minutes of thought a year if that. They love that (Blair witch) like stuff of people running through the dark with a camera stuck in their face. If they did the program the way I and I think most all researchers would like it wouldn't last more than one season because the general public would find it boring. I have never been a member of the BFRO but I have never had a problem with them ether or its founder. There was one time during the Willow Creek summit in 2003 when Matt asked me to listen to a audio recording of a possible Sasquatch cry. I told him it sounded like a peacock. He disagreed and after a short time he got a little tempered and said, "Thomas it's not a Peacock"! It was At least as far as I could tell. But no I at this time could not accuse MM of hoaxing anything. I have not been made aware of anything like that on his part. I do have some questions I would like to have clarified concerning the Skookum Cast. But that's for another thread. Thomas Steenburg Edited August 30, 2011 by steenburg edited for profanity
Guest HairyGreek Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 Well, I appreciate your answer but it did little to address my question. You implied Standing was not only a hoaxer, but a huckster as well. There is a difference in definition and it is this word I wish to address. Sorry if I was not more clear. You stated that "True legitimate active researchers do not hide info from other legitimate researchers" as your reason for calling Standing these names. I am asking if you believe MM to be a huckster as well as this is exactly what he has had people accuse him of for a very long time. Since you have worked for/with him and this thread is not only about Standing, but also about MM's show, do you also believe MM to be a huckster; as part of the very insane asylum you claim is happening in the field? Isn't this show, if MM is doing it to attack Standing, an example of the pot calling the kettle black based on your statements?
Guest vilnoori Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 ... Vilnoori, Actually in one of his discrete change of directions, he stated that he had to abandon Sylvanic because it had been compromised. Aw...too bad...but then, it is very easy to say that if you happen to slip up and mention your location. Easy to do. And the landscape, trees, and so forth in that area match that from the photos and film very nicely. There are even a number of "keyhole" valleys, such as the one on the side of Mt. Berland, which would fit the description. The sides of the mountain are exceedingly steep, and the mountain valley entered through a very narrow canyon created by the lone creek that drains the snow off the mountain area. I would say that most real researchers who are into habituation and running experiments without interference, Thom, are very guarded about their locations. I know I am.
Guest HairyGreek Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 (edited) Vil, I would be for keeping secrets too if I chose to do field study. I wouldn't want a bunch of other people trudging through my little spot of research unless it was by invitation and/or for the explicit purpose of revealing something when the time was right. That, or to invite someone to help me. I see no difference in this way of thinking then LEAs and crime scene investigations. EDIT: BUT, I don't do real research like you or Steenburg, so it is all JMO! Edited August 31, 2011 by HairyGreek
Guest Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 (edited) Yeah Vilnoori, but how could a place such as this ever be duplicated? Underlining mine. From Unexplained Mysteries: By Toddster: Posted 10 June 2005 - 01:56 AM Insert witty name here. All those qwotes of yours are absolutely accurate. The Map that Jon drew up was very accurate and the guide that took us there found the entrance way without missing a step. But it just blew all of us away, including the guide that the entrance was where the map said it was because you cannnot see the openning under the mountain until you are 2 feet from it. Especially in the winter. I guess in my manner of thinking, it was just miraculus that we could travel all that way into the depths of the woods and mountains, North then west, then south, then east.... up and down and across and over all the while knowing if we make one wrong turn out of the hundred turns, we will never find what we where looking for. And when we found it so well because of the accurate map and the guides ability to use it to find a 4 foot by 2 foot entranceway in, after all that crap seemed to me like a miraculus thing. Perhaps to be more specific i should say it blew me away that we where even able to find the entranceway at all, the miricle part was it seemed so easy to find the needle in the hay stack. And the map well it is mine. I have it right here infront of me right now. Some of his early words we should remember: So many thousands of followers. Hair samples. No media circus. One more missing person there (not the teens?) Posted 07 May 2005 - 03:35 PM Hey, i have finally made it to the forums sections of this website. Literally thousands of people from this website have been asking me quistions about my articles on sylvanic and my website www.sylvanic.com. So instead of answering the 6 thousand email quistions i have received i thought i would just get out here to the source of all this attention i have been getting and talk one on one. My name is Todd Standing and i am the documentor of the colum here on unexplained-mysteries entilted The Mysteries Of Sylvanic. I also documented the majority of chronicles on the website as well as led the expidition that shot the video that is currently getting so much attention, and collected the hair sample that foresic experts identified as an unknown species. What is new as of just this week is a botanist that visited sylvanic last year seems to have found a new species of plant life. And the video from the website has been profesionnally enhanced to show an set of eyes lurking behind the trees and a enormous bipedal dark figure running in the background. The company that did the profesional video enhancement is affiliated with severl large network tevelvision brodcasters that have offered to purchase my video and website information, but i will do no such thing. Sylvanic is a utopia on life only because it is virtually untouched by civilized man. I promised the people that showed me Sylvanic that i would not turn this into a media circus. The truth is the video is very unconclusive and the hair samples where destroyed to test them. But i am going back to Sylvanic this summer and i will get more hair samples from the same cave i took the first ones from( It was full of hair)to have a DNA analisis done and get video footage on a HD camera of any and everthing we come across. Today however the main reason i am here is one of my readers said there was a person they met here on this website that recognized the missing person composite drawing on my website. That person was trying to email me but my mail box is constanly overfilling. That police composite drawing on the website is real. I know it looks like a 14 year old artist drew it but that is what police composite drawings looked like in the 1930's. If you think you might now that person please keep trying to send me an email through the website and mark it Missing Person. I have the fingerprints of that person and if you know someone that fits that description that went missing around that same time then perhaps i can help you find out what really happen to them. The native elders that told me the story of how that man went missing(Which is documented on my website) is very certain those three men went into sylvanic and never came out again. Of course i would love to hear from everyone with your quistions, comments, thoughts, and concerns reguarding Sylvanic. I just found something that I overlooked. Here he admits that his little sister is with him during that first visit. This applies to the missing video of the girl with the white hat. His little sister who traveled days to reach there through treacherous terrain. What a ploy. This is the same video connected to where they are looking at tracks across a small stream. He later grew the story by calling her the woman on the team. That's what he does. Posted 07 May 2005 - 08:29 PM(Conspiracy @ May 7 2005, 12:31 PM) Answer to your ?s. To know more about sylvanic just keep reading my chronicles on this website cause you are not going to beleive the stuff i am hearing about sylvanic. As far as the dog he was just acting terrified. That dog would have died before it went another step into sylvanci, so we just left him behind with our cameraman. I guess i am the dude so what did i see? To be honest i was more cocerned with my little sister. She recorded the video footage and she was just standing there while this thing was growling at her. My first instink was to grap her and run. People have asked me why didnt we continuing recording. The answer is about 1 second after the video 1 footage stops i grabbed my sister to pull her back away and she dropped the camera. We ran about 200meters before we stopped. After about 10minutes we went back to pick up the camera and that is when we explored behind the trees where we found the cave full of hair. And here's a subsequent excerpt from the Sylvanic Website where little sis grew up to be a Woman while on that initial expedition. This would also be that 16mm camera whose film was destroyed by the magnetic forces of Sylvanic: Armed with nothing other then camera and film a small group of three people and myself went off in search of this hidden entrance to sylvanic. Our group consisted of my self taking photographs with a 35 mm still camera, a camera man with a 16mm motion picture camera, a experience woodsman with his guide dog, and our woman of the group capturing digital photographs on a 3.2 mega pixel digital camera. We had a map a friend of mine had drawn up to guide us to the small entrance way. Everyone in the group was in top physical condition because we knew we could not spend the night and I had hoped to at least get a few shots of the valley before we had to turn back. The map was very accurate and our guide had no trouble finding the entranceway into the canyon pass. Below is the picture of the entranceway. (Picture I PT previously posted here) It is a small space under a huge mountain. Just to go under it one had to take a deep breath and hope at that moment the mountain above would not decide to crush you. Juicy stuff! The fact is, he leapfrogs from one melodramatic story to the next and never validates the previous as he monopolizes the next with creative zeal. Edited August 31, 2011 by PragmaticTheorist
Guest Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 Aw...too bad...but then, it is very easy to say that if you happen to slip up and mention your location. Easy to do. And the landscape, trees, and so forth in that area match that from the photos and film very nicely. There are even a number of "keyhole" valleys, such as the one on the side of Mt. Berland, which would fit the description. The sides of the mountain are exceedingly steep, and the mountain valley entered through a very narrow canyon created by the lone creek that drains the snow off the mountain area. I would say that most real researchers who are into habituation and running experiments without interference, Thom, are very guarded about their locations. I know I am. Vilnoori, just so we can be clear... There was a time, actually for a couple of years that I watched the youtube videos, and read stuff off the Sylvanic site- in hopes that they were doing legitimate research and were close to solving the mystery. It was at some point in the last year or so that I came across, or someone told me about the expose/hall of shame piece that Squatchdetective.com had done. Steve Kulls (Admin here) and same that runs Squatchdetective.com, is someone I've come to respect. He is obviously not a skeptic, and from the radio shows ive listened too, and much of what he's written - he's made that respect easy to earn. As I've mentioned previously- he took an obviously lengthy amount of time compiling simple facts about the Sylvanic project- from when it debuted in 2005, up until very recent times. It wasnt done in an unprofessional way, in fact I believe Steve gave him/the project just about every benefit of the doubt he could. I tried to initially factor in or access whether Steve had any reason or goal to sabotage the Sylvanic project, but found that (like many others-including myself now) he got sick of all the inconsistencies and info that was there- but that not many knew about. It just paints an unsavory picture of what the guy is doing.... In reference to the bolded part of your quote above- the following is the description given by Mr Standing when the original Sylvanic site went live.... "This website explores the mysteries and folklore that surround this enigmatic rivers pass that leads to an ancient valley. A large unbroken chain of mountains encircles this valley, and it is said that the sacred pass is guarded by the shadows of the mountain." end quote. I bolded "unbroken" for a reason. As I said in one of my posts, from day one there have been little inconsistencies and "problems" with the description. This was his initial description- implying as you suggest that its a box canyon of sorts, with access through a river's passage. Very shortly thereafter the story/description was changed by none other than the guy promoting his research + his site. It now became a secret hole or passage that you cannot see from the trail- but that goes through the mountain, and comes out into this "secret canyon"- which can only be accessed from said "hole". I'm sorry- as much as I want to believe, its been one shaky detail after another, including the photographic evidence that was put forth, taken down, manipulated, put back up- and after a while a reasonable person, even a passionate BF believer like me starts to wonder what the heck is going on... As far as Pragmatic Theorist's comment on him abandoning "sylvanic"- I dont think he was being sympathetic, but suggesting it's another ploy... ( PT Tell me if im wrong...) But even that comes into question, since now on his website (which is back up and running)- he touts "new and exciting footage" caught this year (2011), in "Sylvanic".... I for one, have long since given up finding any significance or importance to what he is supposedly doing.... which also now includes "new" face pictures that of course look completely different than the ones offered up in the past..... I agree with what you said in an earlier post about not throwing away anything at this point, or ruling out anyone's research- but in this case (Sylvanic), I just dont see how it can be taken seriously.... Art
Guest HairyGreek Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 LOL...all I can picture when reading this thread is MM choking Standing out with Bobo trying to pull them apart while Matt screams "tell them your a hoaxer! tell them!"
bipedalist Posted August 31, 2011 BFF Patron Posted August 31, 2011 Also, remember, it is not just Standing giving his version of the story....take it or leave it, he sold the extended version of those videos online (as I remember) to would be "believers" ..... if they were not authentic then that is what I would call hucksterism.
steenburg Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 Well, I appreciate your answer but it did little to address my question. You implied Standing was not only a hoaxer, but a huckster as well. There is a difference in definition and it is this word I wish to address. Sorry if I was not more clear. You stated that "True legitimate active researchers do not hide info from other legitimate researchers" as your reason for calling Standing these names. I am asking if you believe MM to be a huckster as well as this is exactly what he has had people accuse him of for a very long time. Since you have worked for/with him and this thread is not only about Standing, but also about MM's show, do you also believe MM to be a huckster; as part of the very insane asylum you claim is happening in the field? Isn't this show, if MM is doing it to attack Standing, an example of the pot calling the kettle black based on your statements? [/quote/] No as of right now I do not consider MM a huckster. But I will admit some of the things he has stated and done did have me shaking my head. But I also have to point out that I have personally have had little to do with him. He did a couple of years ago ask me to talk with some people on a Vancouver Island expediton which I declined because I have a problem with the idea of charging people money for what amounts to a camping trip. But thats just me. I know other people have accused him of being a huckster. Other people have said far worse than that. But from my limited experience with the man I have not personally seen evidence of this. I have seen gullibility, shortsighted,bad judgement, in my opinon. But I have also seen determination, drive, and a true desire to solve a mystery. His methods at times I don't agree with but at the same time Im sure he would think the samething about me and others. I don't know if his show plans to expose Standing or back him up. So how can one use the term "Pot calling the Kettle black", before we have seen it. If you are asking an opinon asuming that this going to be an exposer of Standing than in my opinon right now no. As I have said I have not seen evidence myself that MM is a Huckster. Thomas Steenburg P.S. My spell check is not working for some reason so I apologize in advance.
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