Sasquatch "Nest" Question

[hiflier]

1 hour ago, Will said:

With Bigfoot in general. My opinion is there are so many hoaxers. 
 

Meldrum and his friends probably knew what went on with this latest saga, they should have just admitted it.

 

Goes right to my point and I 100% agree. Pretty soon I'll be presenting that "game" I spoke of elsewhere

 

23 minutes ago, Huntster said:

Seems to me to be under the complete control of the private landowners and the agreements that the Olympic Project have with them. I doubt any of them paid anybody to collect samples or run the dna testing. I think it was done by the scientists interested in the find. Thus “we” have no bearing whatsoever.

 

How nice that we were never considered to be worthy of the truth. How did THAT happen?

 

Edited June 24, 2023 by hiflier

[hvhart]

2 hours ago, hiflier said:

The point I am trying to introduce is that nest samples taken in 2016 and water samples taken in 2020 shouldn't have been the only attempts mad at determining whether or not some species of Human beyond us modern Humans were the builders. Why haven't there been more samples taken? Or if the have been why haven't we heard. And if the have been then who's sitting on the results? Or is everyone content to close the book on any more discussions on this topic? And if everyone is then is it because they are satisfied with the DNA outcomes, as ambiguous as the seem to be?

 

These are supposed to be "our" scientists conducting any DNA testing, right? And why did Dr. Mayor send HER Kentucky DNA soil samples that showed Chimps to UC Santa Cruz instead of Dr. Todd Disotell, our very own built-in Sasquatch DNA expert? Why does something always sem to be OFF with this Bigfoot DNA picture  

UC Santa Cruz has excellent facilities, faculty, and reputation for DNA analyses.  It is good to get more scientists interested.  Sometimes it's just a matter of connections and cost.

[hiflier]

Agreed. Just seemed a bit incongruent at the time and kind of still does. Also, Dr. Disotell may have no longer had a facility in which to do that kind of testing after his move from NYU where he ran the nest samples to UMass?

 

[Huntster]

1 hour ago, hiflier said:

........How nice that we were never considered to be worthy of the truth. How did THAT happen?

 

I think we got the truth. We just didn't get all of the truth. The nest builder(s) were "human". Of the genus Homo. That's enough for me to strengthen what I already believed.

[hiflier]

5 minutes ago, Huntster said:

The nest builder(s) were "human". Of the genus Homo.

 

Which is pretty much what any other Sasquatch DNA effort has shown which s why I'm driving this point home. Oh....wait a sec....EXCEPT for what Jim Lansdale of the GCBRO said about the results of HIS sample after claiming the group shot one back in 2004. Would have been nice to have had access to the raw data from those tests.

[Huntster]

3 minutes ago, hiflier said:

Which is pretty much what any other Sasquatch DNA effort has shown which s why I'm driving this point home........

 

Pretty much. "Repeatable".

 

Quote

.......Oh....wait a sec....EXCEPT for what Jim Lansdale of the GCBRO said about the results of HIS sample after claiming the group shot one back in 2004. Would have been nice to have had access to the raw data from those tests.

 

I'm not familiar with that. 

[hiflier]

22 minutes ago, Huntster said:

Pretty much. "Repeatable".

 

BINGO! And that's about all that needs to be said. Now what's the community-at-large going to do about it? They shouldn't play the game follow the leader because the "leader" no matter who it is isn't talking. The community should play a different game. One I've come up with that just may have some positive outcome but it will take commitment and patience to win it. And you know me, Huntster, the game will be a fairly serious one. But the prize would be nothing short of historic if everyone joins in.

 

22 minutes ago, Huntster said:

I'm not familiar with that.

 

I'm very surprised to hear that knowing your longevity in this Bigfoot subject. Now you know me very well by now, Huntster. I don't lie and I ALWAYS back up what I say. But since no one who SHOULD know about this particular incident ever brings it up I guess I shouldn't be all THAT surprised. See? People play those kinds of games with the community all the time, and have done so for YEARS. They make things disappear. That's what they do. Unless someone knows how t find anything about it it just won't be mentioned. But you're a good guy so I'll drop a couple of hints just for you from nine years ago and then ask you, does anyone but me ever have this stuff?  

 

https://www.ktre.com/story/26852451/east-texan-takes-hunt-for-bigfoot-to-television/

https://www.cnet.com/culture/these-guys-are-out-to-kill-bigfoot/

 

So. Is it time? Anyone up for playing MY game?

 

Edited June 24, 2023 by hiflier

[Huntster]

1 hour ago, hiflier said:

https://www.ktre.com/story/26852451/east-texan-takes-hunt-for-bigfoot-to-television/

https://www.cnet.com/culture/these-guys-are-out-to-kill-bigfoot/

 

So their claim is that they shot a bigfoot in 2004, got some blood to test, and it came back as some sort of great ape. Great. But if he doesn't produce his test results like Ketchum did, it didn't happen. There's nothing but an unsupported claim.

[hiflier]

Not true, there is support for the claim but I'm not at liberty to divulge the backstory or who was involved. Suffice it to say, it did happen and samples were gathered and tested. The point of bringing it up and posting it, though, is to demonstrate how played the community really is by these people and others. Those two articles as you noticed came out about a week before the Killing Bigfoot TV show was to air. Now neither Bobby Hamilton NOR Jim Lansdale needed to say anything about the supposed shooting and alleged supposed DNA test results but they both did and did separately in two different interviews promoting the show.

 

What was the follow up? What did anyone do or say about it. I think there's an old thread on the incident here somewhere if someone would care to link it. But by and large the event has all but disappeared from the BF community's psyche and memory. Games, games, and more games perpetrated on believers nine years ago and then hidden away. It happens a lot. There will be newbies come onto this Forum and unless one of us says something they may never hear of the Ketchum or Sykes study OR about the Washington nests. As an example, there haven't been nest photos on the Olympic Project's website for at least a couple of years or more now. And on and on and on. John Green's FREE and SEARCHABLE database is nowhere on the web. People think it's here, but it really isn't. Not in the way it was intended or designed to function which is kind of a shame really.

 

This is NOT a good situation where important Sasquatch history and information just disappears. It reduces critical thinking and dummies down the community like so much else is already doing. Is the community powerless to stand up and make anything happen? It's a fair question. The answer is NO !! Not by a long shot. Like anything else, all anyone has to do is affect the money flow. It's time to stop fooling around here now and play the game. New game thread coming, and it's designed as only I would dare to design it

 

Edited June 25, 2023 by hiflier

[Will]

14 minutes ago, hiflier said:

The point of bringing it up and posting it, though, is to demonstrate how played the community really is by these people and others.

 

For all we know the government is paying them as confidential human sources. 😀

 

Seriously though they are and have made a lot of money.

[Huntster]

12 hours ago, hiflier said:

Not true, there is support for the claim but I'm not at liberty to divulge the backstory or who was involved. Suffice it to say, it did happen and samples were gathered and tested.........

 

Well, that is exactly what these people and groups do. The government does it, too. 

 

Can you say that the dna test results were genus Homo? A novel "great ape"?

 

Quote

........The point of bringing it up and posting it, though, is to demonstrate how played the community really is by these people and others. Those two articles as you noticed came out about a week before the Killing Bigfoot TV show was to air. Now neither Bobby Hamilton NOR Jim Lansdale needed to say anything about the supposed shooting and alleged supposed DNA test results but they both did and did separately in two different interviews promoting the show........

 

Okay, so it was all a pre-series publicity stunt? Or producers paid the shooters to remain quiet?

[hiflier]

21 minutes ago, Huntster said:

Well, that is exactly what these people and groups do. The government does it, too.

 

Ergo, the Game, which is meant to completely stop the money flow that supports every aspect of the Bigfoot BIZ. A BIZ that is completely reliant on sucking money from the hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of believers in exchange for.....nothing. Nothing that ever proves the Sasquatch to even being real. An fine example might be the BFRO charging $300-$500 a pop for people to go out to "hot spots" and never see a Bigfoot.

 

32 minutes ago, Huntster said:

Can you say that the dna test results were genus Homo? A novel "great ape"?

 

I cannot but....

 

https://www.cnet.com/culture/these-guys-are-out-to-kill-bigfoot/

"Ten years ago, Lansdale says he believes the GCBRO did land a shot that wounded a Bigfoot. He claims resulting blood samples from the scene indicated that the animal belonged to the great ape family."

https://www.ktre.com/story/26852451/east-texan-takes-hunt-for-bigfoot-to-television/

"Hamilton said his group has shot one before and the blood sample could not be matched to a human or animal."

 

43 minutes ago, Huntster said:

Okay, so it was all a pre-series publicity stunt?

 

The incident was not a publicity stunt. It happened. I know someone personally who was on the team the night that it happened.

 

46 minutes ago, Huntster said:

Or producers paid the shooters to remain quiet?

 

Doubt that very much since the incident occurred ten years before Killing Bigfoot was to initially air back in late October of 2014. My guess is something else happened there to make the incident, as well as the story, go away.

 

It's stuff likethisthat should encourage everyone to play the Game and stop propping up the "stars" where money is a one way street with no product return on anyone's investment.....EVER. It's time to choke off the money handed over to ANYTHING Bigfoot or Bigfoot related- no matter what it is. Dry up the revenue and shut down the Bigfoot industry for breach of trust on an extremely large scale. Billions could disappear in a few short months. The Game is not a trifle matter.

 

What happens if no one buys one single Bigfoot book from here on out? Or walks into a museum? Or buys a ticket to attend a Bigfoot conference to listen to speakers or visit a vendor's table? What happens to websites? What happens to movies? Documentaries? Expeditions? No viewers for Bigfoot TV shows? And it's ALL built upon a big tease? Something that the public never gets to see proof of? It makes playing the Game a pretty serious exercise.

   

[Catmandoo]

On 6/25/2023 at 8:39 AM, hiflier said:

Ergo, the Game, which is meant to completely stop the money flow that supports every aspect of the Bigfoot BIZ. A BIZ that is completely reliant on sucking money from the hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of believers in exchange for.....nothing. Nothing that ever proves the Sasquatch to even being real. An fine example might be the BFRO charging $300-$500 a pop for people to go out to "hot spots" and never see a Bigfoot

 And no one has pointed out that the king has no clothes.

 

My favorite cartoonist, Gahan Wilson made  cartoons that covers this. I posted this on June 11th:

"Gahan Wilson (RIP) was my favorite cartoonist. His cartoons can be viewed online.  Several pieces of his work would work well with this forum.

This one is good:     "Get Doctor Kichner     and hurry"    One has to search a Gahan Wilson collection. Individual Google search did not work.

This one is really good:     "Whatever it is, it seems to be coming closer"

"And every day it's costing more and more"

"Is nothing sacred?"    the cartoon, not the book.

 

'Nothing' is sacred

 

A good sense of humor is required for the activities that we carry out".

[bipedalist]

On 6/18/2023 at 10:26 AM, bipedalist said:

 

@hvhart  Along these procedural lines of dna sequencing and analysis do you know of any proprietary programs or software that looks promising other than your use of BASIC and Excel?  Maybe Chat GPT can be manipulated to help with the hunt, lol! 

 

**Crickets** ?  Really?  @hvhart

Quote

 

Science has now claimed to have identified the dna of four human species thus far:

Homo Sapien

Homo Neanderthalensis

Homo Denisovan

Homo Heidelbergensis

 

Too bad they haven't got homo erectus and homo floresiensis yet

 

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/new-genetic-study-suggests-modern-flores-island-pygmies-and-ancient-hobbits-are-unrelated-180969858/

Quote

“It is the most extreme hominin ever discovered,” wrote paleoanthropologists Marta Mirazon Lahr and Robert Foley in 2004. “An archaic hominin at that date changes our understanding of late human evolutionary geography, biology and culture.”

 

Huge feet, a complete brow-ridge and not consistent with modern pygmies, still trying to sequence the complete picture.  

 

Quote

A separate group of researchers found more remains on a different part of the island, similar to the Homo floresiensis skeleton in the Liang Bua cave, only these remains were dated to 700,000 years ago. Along with thousands of stone tools dated to nearly 1 million years ago, the growing body of evidence seemed to move solidly in favor of an ancient and strange species of hominin making the island of Flores their home for tens of thousands of years.

 

Interesting dating expansion occurring for something not fully dna sequenced.  Possibly a descendant of Homo erectus?  Maybe time will tell.  And that

human mystery ancestor keeps on truckin'

 

Along the lines of Sasquatch DNA rockstars, I say anybody but Disotell just like  I have changed my mind about Meldrum in many respects!

Edited July 4, 2023 by bipedalist

[Michael]

On 4/3/2023 at 8:52 PM, hiflier said:

Continuing....

Metabarcoding inthe lab picks up the genus of everything that visits or is currently living is an environment. Everything. Dr. Mayor's did. But she also got genus Pan troglodyte (Chimp) DNA, and, more than likely Human DNA as well. What did Dr. Melderum get. Everything also. With one exception: Human DNA that was apparently too degraded to show maybe Pan troglodyte or some other primate? Both of which are different of a different genus. But nope, same kind of environment with regards to rainfall. And again samples from soil. In Dr. Meldrums case the soils was even more protected from UV rays because the soil was under the nest structures but perfectly capable of showing an organisms genus. How do I know? Because the genus of all the animals that had visited or lived close by turned up in the results. But only ONE was apparently too degraded to show anything other than Human. But t did show genus Homo (Human), right? And the genus of everything else showed up as well. DNA sequencing at that time was very precise and since the announcements by Dr. Meldrum and Dr. Disotell came at about the same time in the Fall of 2018, only about for years ago, those announcements came soon after the lab sequencing and results were known.

Science had already been using environmental DNA sequencing for a couple of decades before those announcements were made to identify an animal's genus in the wild. It was not a new science by any means by the time those soil samples were collected and tested. Dr. Mayor's in 2020 and Drs. Meldrum and Disotell's in 2017 or 2018. So, all being equal where environment, rainfall, professional collection and sequencing protocols, are in line, what gives with one getting a non-Human genus in it sample and the other not? The Human genome is the gold standard, the reference that is used in which all other DNA sequences are compared to. It is the base line and is constantly being refined as more and more Human genomes get factored in to improve it as a reference genome.

The smallest DNA molecule is the mitochondrial but it can have hundreds of copies of itself inside a single cell. And though small, it STILL contains over 16,500 (16,569 to be exact) amino acid pairs. How many, out of those 16,569 amino acid pairs, are needed to determine genus match? Less than 50. Sometimes even only 20. Ideally an unbroken sequence of 150 pairs is ideal and considered a good quality sample. For determining genus that's all it would take. Good enough for Dr. Mayor Kentucky samples submitted to the lab at the University of California. But somehow Dr. Meldrum's from Mason County was too degraded for Dr. Disotell's state-of-the-art lab at the time at NYU? He was, and still is after all, an expert in evolutionary primate genetics, though he has since relocated to UMass Anherst in the fall of 2019. Now I'm no DNA expert but I AM a logician and this one loose end has never made any sense to me whatsoever.

 

Why doesn't it make sense? Because no one knows how long Dr. Mayor's large wood structure was there in eastern Kentucky. And no one knows how long that Chimp DNA was there either. But one thing is certain, the nest structures in Mason county were fresh constructs. Vertical stems were pushed into the ground. All the material for the nests were harvested close by and woven into those nests. So regardless of the soil under the centers of them, there should have been DNA left all over the place there: Under and around these structures on the ground, on the ground in the huckleberry patches and on the stems. DNA should have been just about anywhere that could have been sampled. So what happened? No one thought of that? DNA is pretty tough stuff. It's not going to go away or completely degrade after only a few weeks or months.

Everything I've said so far in these first three posts is all scientific FACT, along other information as it was reported by the parties involved in these discoveries. Fact, Sasquatch DNA won't be Homo Sapien DNA that is closer than Neanderthal or Denisovan or any other recent Human cousin. It's DNA MAY be Homo but it would be so far removed genetically that there would be no chance of mistaking it. In other words, it would have so many mutations as to be unrecognizable as Modern Human no matter how degraded. No one can tell me that out of 16,569 amino acids that none of it would show non-Human mutations. It borders on the ridiculous to think otherwise. The ONLY conclusion that one can arrive at that makes any sense is that Sasquatches did NOT build those structures. But all the manually broken stems of the huckleberry bushes suggests that it wasn't Humans. But if it wasn't Humans then someone is covering up the fact that there must have been Non-Human primate DNA at that Mason county site.

 

The point is, there is no way, when all other animal genera were there, that only Human DNA was found to be degraded, at a site with every chance possible to have DNA fresh enough to show a non-Human primate was present. There. Done. Does anyone agree or disagree with this assessment?  

 

Most people don't realize that a black bear and a human have DNA that is 95% similar.   Most people did poorly in science classes, and just enough to pass.