Guest mitchw Posted August 17, 2012 Posted August 17, 2012 I was intetrested in getting the book until I read this review on Amazon; pretty damning. http://www.amazon.co...#R17M0AXEMAG3HT If you follow the link, you'll see that there's been a ferocious fight between the initial reviewer, called 'Robert,' and Paulides himself. The combat goes on for pages. I confess that one of my interests in Bigfootery is watching the humans deal with it; something mean is going on over at Amazon. I've read most of the western Missing 411, and it is chilling and nauseating. One of the most interesting books I've read in this field. HS
Guest porky1981 Posted August 17, 2012 Posted August 17, 2012 (edited) very interesting recent missing persons case from this past week (august 16, 2012) in Alberta Woman lost in bush faced bear, broke into cabin to survive: http://www.theglobea...article4485229/ It shows that people can and truly do go missing, but what I find even more interesting is the fact that the woman said she doesn't know what made her leave her cabin to go out into the bush initially, it was as if she 'blacked out'.....read the article. Edited August 17, 2012 by porky1981
Guest thermalman Posted August 17, 2012 Posted August 17, 2012 I would encourage anyone with time and knowledge of the outdoors to volunteer some time with SAR. Most SAR organizations will have training for new members. I'm not sure how it is handled in other states, but in Washington it is usually the county sheriff that is in charge of any SAR operation and they would be the ones to call SAR. Then you get a phone call through the SAR command if there is a search. It's been decades since I was involved. Depending on the county the operation can be highly organized and professional, or it can be a fiasco (like the time a buddy of mine broke his leg in a rock climbing fall and we were privately set up to lower him down when the local SAR boys showed up and told us to stop so they could take over.... he finally got lowered down after 5 hours of pain and us climbers having to rescue some of the SAR boys...). IME only a fraction of SAR operations seem to get reported in the local news. In any given county in the USA there are likely lots of missing persons that SAR never found. Where I live, we had two young women go missing within 3 months of each other, 4 years ago. I took my staff ( with pay) and participated in the search effort for a whole day. Although we never found a thing, it was the right thing todo in my mind. The women remain missing to this day.
Guest Cervelo Posted August 17, 2012 Posted August 17, 2012 I find nothing unusually about the NP system not wanting to "advertise" missing persons or keeping track of it in any way. All of these cases were investigated, searches made bodies found or not. Not sure why keeping track of it is that big a deal unless of course you've connected a bunch of random dots and reached a conclusion that something mysterious is going on when there's really not. Dogs stop tracking all the time, kids are capable of covering alot more ground than one would think, people, animals, get snatched up by other people and animals all the time given the opportunity. Odd stuff happens for sure but to suggest, wormholes, time shifts, Bigfoot kidnappings, fun to talk about for sure and a great way to sell books ^^^^ I'm sticking with this!
Guest BFSleuth Posted August 17, 2012 Posted August 17, 2012 While it does make sense on one hand for the park service to not advertise missing persons, it does seem a little off to me that they don't seem to have a system in place for keeping track of these cases or have any type of "cold case" file system like they do in police departments elsewhere. The lack of systematic record keeping IMO is behind the difficulty Paulides experienced getting the information rather than any grand conspiracy. Perhaps this is an oversight of the park system, since their primary function is not police work. One thing that Paulides's books may do is perhaps shed some light on this situation and hopefully improve their record keeping. If I were the loved one of a missing person I would hope that would be the case.
Guest mitchw Posted August 18, 2012 Posted August 18, 2012 (edited) I've been listening to some of D. Paulides interviews for Missing411, and it seems he indeed does think the Park Service has the records(he's got another interview up on his site). They don't want to provide the information because they don't want to scare people out of the parks, costing $. Reading his book, I also came across a section where he argues that missing persons get officially pronounced as dead, thus lowering the tally of missing persons in the statistics. I know that for myself, the accounts in this book made me anxious when my sister's family recently vacationed in the Adirondeck mountains of NY. She has two blond boys but thinks BF is BS, so I keep quiet. Edited August 18, 2012 by mitchw
bipedalist Posted August 18, 2012 BFF Patron Posted August 18, 2012 If missing persons get officially pronounced as dead, then I wonder how many death certificates Paulides researched and uncovered in his perusal of records?
Guest mitchw Posted August 18, 2012 Posted August 18, 2012 He wrote that only a fraction of the cases he came across made it into the book. Also, Texas and Florida were excluded by him due to the volume of cases in those states. I think one of his goals with Missing411 was to show hotspots of similar disappearances. My own inference in some clusters is that there was for a time an individual or group of BFs hunting humans. For someone versed in BF lore, Missing411 is monumental, but Paulides' reticence to name the cause of the disappearances is still respectful to families who have lost their kin. For example, in one story from CA, a child that was recovered said that, 'he didn't eat the berries.' Huh?! It's an important book.
Guest Posted August 28, 2012 Posted August 28, 2012 (edited) Man, Robert really hates Paulides! After reading his tirade about the facts, I'm not so sure I will get the books either. Edited August 28, 2012 by King Kaiju
Guest OntarioSquatch Posted September 3, 2012 Posted September 3, 2012 I actually agree with some of what that particular reviewer wrote about David Paulides and his Missing 411 books and how David Paulides is leaning towards Bigfoot being responsible for some of the missing people even though he never once mentions it. For anyone who has actually seen a bigfoot or knows they exist, the book is definitely gold! They are real flesh and blood animals and they do on some occasions kidnap people!
BobbyO Posted September 4, 2012 SSR Team Posted September 4, 2012 Amen Ontario, i ordered the Book this week, looking forward to reading it.
Guest BastetsCat Posted September 26, 2012 Posted September 26, 2012 I have not read either book. All I can say is WOW. I watched some stuff on youtube and listened to a Coast to Coast radio broadcast interview with the author. I was disapointed that there is no real clear map of the 'cluster' areas on either of the websites. Two fold there is the man hours envolved in establishing public evidence on a website. Then there is the thought that if it was on a public website that it would hinder book sales. I don't want to make accusations against anyone. I know that when you stop at a trailhead you are required to sign in at the board...those papers are then filed....Helloooooo! If a grocery store is required to keep a log of how often they clean a bathroom what on earth would make anyone think that the Parks would not keep a record of missing PERSONS. We are talking about PEOPLE most of which are kids! That makes little sense in a world where we are living. The whole thing reminds me of the movie/book timertraveler or something like that. Subteranean beasts feeding on people. Not that I believe that but it draws a parralel. Odd how things churn up in the brain. I have heard stories and lived in the Colorado Rockies most of my life. I refuse to believe that BF is just all sunbeams and flowers. There are lots of stories in the Eagle county Holy cross wilderness area of missing hikers... when they are found they are miles off course... though little in the way of details is ever released on condition of the body or what was presumed other than that they were deceased. In the eighties I spoke to a search and rescue guy that talked about a strange disappearance that spooked him. Does any of that track to BF? No one knows. The feeling that I take away from the interviews that I listened to was to think about where you are. Always go in at least a pair and stay in visual sight of each other. Doesn't that make good sense in the wild places anyway? Always have a buddy. The other thing that chilled me was the insinuation that a great deal if not all of the missing were wearing Brightly Colored Clothing!!!!! Okay. That is easy to remedy too. The reports of people being found naked churned up something in my mind that has had me wondering for a long time. In the early 2000's I had a two year experience in a very public area. It had several sightings by me and others of a whole group of BF two of which were in the 11-12 foot range and a large group of average sized ones. In that area it was normal to find clothes on the banks of the Eagle River. No one around to have shed those clothes. Full sets some folded neatly and others looking like they just fell off of people. I always expected to find naked women in the bushes because there would be a pair of shorts with undies in them on top of shoes some with socks in the shoes.....shirts sometimes on top of them or off to the side. It wasn't like they went swimming and were hidding because the clothes would be there for days or weeks. No one in the water and no cars around. Then they would just be gone; or neatly moved to a different spot on the trail. Always though they would be in the same general area of this spot. Mostly womens clothes too; some mens. Living in a resort area. Colorado ski country. Things that make people not want to vacation here are hushed up. Missing persons reports are not publicized. You do hear about things word of mouth though. It makes me wonder how many (if any) of the sets of clothes I and others ran across in the one area could be related to missing from other areas. I guess I will have to read the books and see if there is any relevance.
Explorer Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 I read the Western US and Canada version of the book and did not find any reference to BF. Moreover, I did not find any particular case that needed to invoke a BF (or any other anomalous hypothesis) to explain it. The book is a collection of missing person stories whose only common thread is that the person was missing in an outdoor wilderness setting or National Park and not in cities/towns. What I got out of the book is a better understanding of all the various ways and circumstances whereas people go missing in the woods. When I bought this book, I had no idea who Paulides was or any of his Bigfoot research (I still don’t). I bought the book because I was curious about the missing person situation in the US wilderness areas and wanted to better understand who, why, and where do people go missing in the western US National Forests and Parks. Many people die in National Parks every year. When their bodies are found, there is no mystery. If they go missing, suddenly there is a mystery. In Yosemite NP last year, if I recall, almost 11 people fell into waterfalls and got killed. Some bodies where recovered others were never found. However, had these people fallen into the waterfalls without any eyewitnesses and their bodies not found, then they would end up in the Missing 411 book. The link below gives a flavor of all deaths thru August of last year in Yosemite. http://articles.cnn.com/2011-08-24/us/california.yosemite.fatal.falls_1_kari-cobb-mist-trail-yosemite-national-park?_s=PM:US Despite everything I said above, the idea of a BF creature abducting, attacking and killing a human walking alone in the woods is still within the realm of possibility.
BobbyO Posted October 12, 2012 SSR Team Posted October 12, 2012 In Yosemite NP last year, if I recall, almost 11 people fell into waterfalls and got killed. Some bodies where recovered others were never found. However, had these people fallen into the waterfalls without any eyewitnesses and their bodies not found, then they would end up in the Missing 411 book. No they wouldn't. The stories in the book are not juts plucked out of thin air, they are in that book as they are " possible's " make no mistake. There is no way someone who fell into a waterfall and who's body was never found would end up in that book, and it's no coincidence that there are no stories in there that are along those kind of lines.
Explorer Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 There is no way someone who fell into a waterfall and who's body was never found would end up in that book, and it's no coincidence that there are no stories in there that are along those kind of lines. How would you know that they fell into a waterfall if nobody saw them fall in? Without eyewitness or body, nobody knows. To the public, the person just disappeared into thin air.
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