The Existance Of Bigfoot: Is The Magical/paranormal/spiritual/supernatural Really Necessary?

[Guest]

Are you sure you want to stick with that?

Yes, I do as a matter of fact.

Hint: "Faster than the speed of light".

Good grief. People are still going on about that being impossible and breaking the laws of physics?

There's nothing in the laws of physics which prohibit it from happening.

This is no longer "woo".

Using quantum mechanics to support paranormal claims is woo. Sorry.

Are you sure I'm the one who needs to brush up on their physics?

[BobbyO]

But one thing I will say having travelled our planet, got out of the bubble of my own comfortable and civilised home, is that people are far from good, in general, on the whole.

And if you want proof of that, go and spend 9 or so years travelling and seeing it with your own eyes.

It's the sole reason I am really, really disheartened with human beings and need to regain some faith in them again, some how.

But I bet I won't as I'm adamant that in general, on the whole, human beings are bad animals.

[Guest LarryP]

there's nothing within the laws of physics which suggest that psychic abilities, or anything of that nature, are even remotely possible

- Leftfoot

.

You never answered the question.

Specifically, which laws of physics are you referring to?

[Guest]

there's nothing within the laws of physics which suggest that psychic abilities, or anything of that nature, are even remotely possible

- Leftfoot

.

You never answered the question.

Specifically, which laws of physics are you referring to?

You're still hard at work reversing the burden of proof, I see.

Let me make this simple for you. You are making the positive claim that something within the laws of physics allows for the paranormal or supernatural to be possible. It's up to you to prove it. So, what in the laws of physics would allow it? Pro-tip: The uncertainty principle means that using quantum mechanics to support your stance automatically makes you wrong.

[norseman]

How is it in your hypothesis that Sasquatch has some how evolved past that? The strong dominate the weak, because of a strong survival instinct in allocating resources for it's offspring.

You miss a possibility. I don't know how seriously I take it, but for "completeness", for the purpose of covering all the angles, I have to consider the unsettling possibility they're so far beyond us we are not competition, at best we're a form of wild animal they are managing and we're not sophisticated enough to realize it.

MIB

So an animal living in the forest that craps in one hand and picks berries with the other is somehow managing us?

Interesting.

That is a dang good disguise I'll grant you that........

So what are we being managed for? Swinging beef? Bodily fluids? Experiments?

When do they unleash the tripods and attack?

there's nothing within the laws of physics which suggest that psychic abilities, or anything of that nature, are even remotely possible

- Leftfoot

.

You never answered the question.

Specifically, which laws of physics are you referring to?

Does it matter?

What are we really talking about here? Are you saying that a wild ape man in the forest has figured out how to harness "teleportation" before we have?

Here again, Einstein Bigfoot supporters need to explain rationally why a species of higher intelligence would choose a subordinate role on their own planet. Because that is not how nature works on our own planet............and it's not how it worked with the evolution of our own species.

Talk.

[Drew]

Forget the 'harnessing teleportation' part, I want to know how a 600 lb beast evades detection and classification in our world.

[norseman]

Forget the 'harnessing teleportation' part, I want to know how a 600 lb beast evades detection and classification in our world.

Ummm..........I think your missing THEIR point (not mine).

It's pretty easy to evade detection and capture when you just whisper "beam me up scotty" into your transport communicator.

[Guest]

Forget the 'harnessing teleportation' part, I want to know how a 600 lb beast evades detection and classification in our world.

It can happen.

[Guest LarryP]

there's nothing within the laws of physics which suggest that psychic abilities, or anything of that nature, are even remotely possible

- Leftfoot

.

You never answered the question.

Specifically, which laws of physics are you referring to?

You're still hard at work reversing the burden of proof, I see.

Let me make this simple for you. You are making the positive claim that something within the laws of physics allows for the paranormal or supernatural to be possible. It's up to you to prove it. So, what in the laws of physics would allow it? Pro-tip: The uncertainty principle means that using quantum mechanics to support your stance automatically makes you wrong.

You made this positive claim:

"there's nothing within the laws of physics which suggest that psychic abilities, or anything of that nature, are even remotely possible."

Therefore I am asking you to specify exactly which "laws of physics" prove that Psi "or anything of that nature" is not "even remotely possible" ?

[Guest LarryP]

Does it matter?

What are we really talking about here? Are you saying that a wild ape man in the forest has figured out how to harness "teleportation" before we have?

Here again, Einstein Bigfoot supporters need to explain rationally why a species of higher intelligence would choose a subordinate role on their own planet. Because that is not how nature works on our own planet............and it's not how it worked with the evolution of our own species.

Talk.

Of course it matters. You cannot make broad sweeping generalized statements like the "laws of physics" without even specifying what type of physics, much less the specific laws within.

If their role truly is "subordinate", then why haven't you been able to bag one? Or for that matter, even find one?

[norseman]

Of course it matters. You cannot make broad sweeping generalized statements like the "laws of physics" without even specifying what type of physics, much less the specific laws within.

No it doesn't matter and here is why............it's pertaining to the mystery of BIGFOOT. What we should be debating isn't theories in physics, but what we know about biology. If Bigfoot has beaten us in a technology race as two competing species on this planet? Then you have your work cut out for you to describe how this has taken place. Where is the proof of this technology? No evidence of tool manufacture, fire use, complex shelter construction........ but they somehow have the ability to manipulate and harness molecules?

What your attempting to do is rewrite our understanding of biological evolution. And we cannot debate Bigfoot's understanding in physics until you can demonstrate that they have mastered rock flaking or fire making first.

If their role truly is "subordinate", then why haven't you been able to bag one? Or for that matter, even find one?

Well the two obvious choices we have?

A) It never existed in the first place and is the result of some mass delusion. Or it existed at some point and lives on through oral tradition.

B ) It is a shy, elusive nocturnal ape that lives in the remote places of the earth, in small numbers, that man hasn't fully conquered yet.

Your choice is that it's a sentient being with immense scientific understanding that is beyond human comprehension. And yet it chooses to live in the wild like an animal with no outward manifestation of said scientific accomplishments.

Edited April 16, 2013 by norseman

[Guest]

You made this positive claim:

Ho boy, do I really need to start here? The claim that there's nothing within the laws of physics which suggest that psychic abilities or anything similar is possible is a negative claim, and is the default position until evidence suggests otherwise. Evidence you have to supply if you're making a positive claim like that paranormal abilities are possible.

That's the burden of proof. It rests on you.

"there's nothing within the laws of physics which suggest that psychic abilities, or anything of that nature, are even remotely possible."

Therefore I am asking you to specify exactly which "laws of physics" prove that Psi "or anything of that nature" is not "even remotely possible" ?

And how, prey tell, do you expect me to prove a negative? If psi or anything of the nature doesn't exist than there would be no evidence that it exists, thus there is no evidence to put forward. It is the burden of proof for the person making a positive claim like psi does exist to provide the evidence.

Where is your evidence?

[Guest LarryP]

Thom Powell does an excellent job of explaining the difference between Humans and Sasquatch. While also pointing out why it is folly to assume that all you can or must do is focus on the scientific and biological aspects of the BF phenomenon.

http://www.thomsquat...0&max-results=7

Excerpt: (emphasis mine)

"But wait a minute. Isn't there a contradiction here? How can the sasquatch be both a primitive human ancestor and somehow interacting with the extraterrestrial phenomena? Wouldn't that latter idea imply that the sasquatch were not a primitive human relative, but rather a super-advanced one, even with respect to our own technological capabilities? Yes, indeed. And to resolve this apparent conflict, we must remind ourselves that the million-year old bones of our supposedly-extinct human ancestral lineages do not speak to the sasquatch phenomenon as we know it today. Indeed, the Neandertal or Homo Erectus hybrids, or whatever they are, have benefited from the same million years of ensuing evolution and intelligence-acquisition that we have. Are we the same primitive being we were a million years ago? Obviously not. Why would Neanderthals, or Homo Erectus (Java Man) remain as the unsophisticated cave men that they were back then. We made good use of a million years of evolution and education to become something much more sophisticated than we once were. Why wouldn't they?

So, what have our ancestors or our anthropological cousins become after benefiting from this same evolution and knowledge acquisition of their species. I would say, they've become not just the nocturnal equivalent of us, but also the zen-masters of the planet. The sasquatch are nothing less than the super-sentient, super-sophisticated beings that we could have become if we had not taken the other fork in the road toward technology, materialism, resource extraction, and industrialization. In short, we humans have changed our environment to suit our needs and desires. The sasquatch, on the other hand, have done the opposite. They have changed themselves, their needs and their desires, to suit the earth's environment as it was given to them. They are the very definition of zen masters. They have developed much more sophisticated and sentient mental capabilities. They have acquired the ability to satisfy their needs without altering their environment, to control their population, to communicate with each other over very long distances without technology, and even to communicate and interact with beings that appear to come from elsewhere. Mind you, we also have some capability to interact with the ET's, you're just not being told about it. In any case, the sasquatch can probably do it better, because they have used their evolution and knowledge acquisition to develop their mental capacities in the same way we have used our time and knowledge acquisition to develop out technological capabilities.

I realize this is pretty radical stuff, but it makes perfect sense to me. And, my problem is, I think I'm pretty good at predicting where this whole bigfoot subject is going, since my last batch of predictions, as published in The Locals turned out pretty well."

[Guest]

More woo. Figures.

[norseman]

It's not radical........it's pure fantasy.

So, what have our ancestors or our anthropological cousins become after benefiting from this same evolution and knowledge acquisition of theirspecies. I would say, they've become not just the nocturnal equivalent of us, but also the zen-masters of the planet.

A couple of points:

A) Us is us........the ones that mine, log, build dams and bend our environment to our will. So no they are NOT the nocturnal equivalent of us........they are nothing like us.

B ) More damning is the fact that they are as he claims apart of the Homo lineage...........and yet show no characteristics of such lineage.

Again...........if you are going to argue from a evolutionary standpoint that they are the most technologically advanced species on the planet Earth? Then you have to explain how they got there............. no A to Z explanation but instead A THRU Z.

How does a Neanderthal go from being human in which they do human things, such as organized hunts, tool manufacture, fire manipulation, etc Then give all that up to live like an animal in the wild..............all the while evolving past us to become technologically superior?

Because the argument that, "We have no observations or proof that they use technology, but they are technologically superior to us........trust us" is pure FOLLY.

This is pure fantasy.........plain and simple, somebody has watched Avatar too many times.

We made good use of a million years of evolution and education to become something much more sophisticated than we once were. Why wouldn't they?

This is a dang good question........why wouldn't they? I mean.........a Chimp has had the same amount of time to evolve and invent as Humans have since our species diverged on different evolutionary paths.

So why don't Quantum physics theorists sit down with a Chimp and let the Chimp explain to them Quantum mechanics? Well because unfortunately the Chimp missed out on the stone age, the bronze age, the iron age and the industrialized revolution! Nor have we found any evidence of Chimpanzee sub atomic particle colliders hidden deep in the Congo jungle! Just in case yanno they had their own path to this sophisticated technology without our knowing............

Preposterous.