WSA Posted March 5, 2014 Author Posted March 5, 2014 Thanks WesT to you and your friend for letting us see this. My thoughts so far..... Obviously, something ripped this little guy a new one. My first thought was "exit wound", but I would imagine that was quickly and easily ruled out. I'd like to know more about how far away the carcass was found from the tree structures we're looking at as well. I also thought about whether this could be just evidence of a scavenger snacking on an already killed carcass, but the fact that the eyes and mouth area seem untouched would seem to argue against that. A buzzard, coyote or other opportunist would most likely go for the tender bits first. I'd want to know more about blood trails, pooling under carcass, etc. Otherwise, I don't we can rule out just some kid with a stick jabbing an already dead deer, don't you agree? And look at that targeting (if targeting it was)....bulls-eye on the kill zone. If that didn't pierce a ventricle or the aorta, it weren't by much. But then, I think, why was it left otherwise untouched? THAT is the most puzzling aspect of it.
Guest WesT Posted March 6, 2014 Posted March 6, 2014 Hmmm, where is the blood? Odd indeed. To confirm beyond a shadow of a doubt the cause of death, an autopsy by a veteranarian would have been needed to be performed. WSA, I owe you one, thank you so much for your help. Gotta go right now but I'll be back......
Bigtex Posted March 6, 2014 Posted March 6, 2014 This was a very strange Deer kill that I ran across in a remote area, and was skewered with a dried out Juniper limb. It had been killed some place else, and carried to the location in the picture.......I just can't think of too many natural ways this could have happened.
salubrious Posted March 6, 2014 Moderator Posted March 6, 2014 Dang. Only 2 things could have done that... This is a pic of footprint? I don't know footprints. I'm not a hunter and someone could say it's a raccoon and I wouldn't know any better. In the future though, I'm going to use a dollar bill for scale. From what I remember it wasn't very big. Within normal human or bear range. Definitely a track- looks like a bear on first, uh, 'impression'... in the future if you find a track, try to take a photo from an angle too, not just straight above. Also, avoid overhead sun if possible. The more perspective the better. If it looks human, check and see if there is any evidence of claws ahead of the digits. You may have to remove debris to see that if the track is in forest detritus. The big toe is telling- see if you can spot that and the heel as well. Where, in this photo, do you think the heel is?
Guest Cervelo Posted March 6, 2014 Posted March 6, 2014 (edited) I'd suggest the deer was shot with an arrow..the deer ran...the arrow was pulled from its body going thru the woods...keeps running drops dead. There are some states that allow hunting with crossbows with scopes that "hunters" are using and few realize or care to track a deer after its been shot. I was asked to look at this by a customer... Edited March 6, 2014 by Cervelo
Hammer102492 Posted March 7, 2014 Posted March 7, 2014 (edited) I never paid attention to this sort of thing until after May 2013 when all this BF stuff became real to us. This picture was taken not too long ago on the road where I saw one jump in front of my vehicle, (see BFRO report for Holmes County, Ohio). Sorry for the edit. It posted before I was ready. I'll have to take another picture of something I've been looking at for months. I'll try to do that tomorrow. I have one from several months back that I noticed on day at sunrise from our back yard. I just happened to look that way and think, that ain't right. If I can get into the depths of my phone pictures, I'll send it along with another edit. I don't know what it is, but it's out of the ordinary, that's for sure. And it's on a very rural road. Nobody hangs out there. >>standby, trying to post the picture<< Edited March 7, 2014 by Hammer102492
Hammer102492 Posted March 7, 2014 Posted March 7, 2014 (edited) Pictures from our back yard. "Once in awhile you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right." Hunter/Garcia from "Scarlet Begonias" BTW, these pictures are at the base of the hill from where I saw the eye shine / glow / flash thing a couple of weeks ago. The pics were taken early winter from our back yard. Sorry for the edits, just trying to clean it up a bit. Thanks for the this good thread. Hammer Edited March 7, 2014 by Hammer102492
Hammer102492 Posted March 7, 2014 Posted March 7, 2014 There's more to the picture than meets the eye. Hey hey, my my.
WSA Posted March 7, 2014 Author Posted March 7, 2014 Good point about an arrow wound Cervelo, but I'm just not seeing it. One, is the size of that puncture. It just doesn't look like a bolt or broadhead wound,which would more likely have a sliced, oblong shape. Second, as you might know, a modern arrow is a tenacious thing. I suppose somebody could have found the kill and removed the arrow, tearing and enlarging the hole, but it is not likely an arrow with that degree of penetration would fall out. The location of the wound tells me the animal did not go far at all before expiring, so it would seem unlikely it would have run far enough for an arrow to bounce, catch and be pulled from it. I have no idea what could have caused a wound like that, I must say. I'd like to hear more about what the finder of the carcass can tell us. But an arrow wound? I'm not putting that high on my list.
MIB Posted March 7, 2014 Moderator Posted March 7, 2014 Didn't the original mention of the deer's wound say there were wood splinters sticking out of it? Or am I imagining that, missed a change of discussion, or ... something? MIB
WSA Posted March 7, 2014 Author Posted March 7, 2014 It did MIB, yes. The photo I have does not show any, at least to the extent I'm able to see them. I would like to have a confirmation of that too, even if it is just a confirmation of the description. Obviously, if we assume or confirm such being present, it rules out a whole bunch of other possiblities.
Guest WesT Posted March 8, 2014 Posted March 8, 2014 (edited) Dang. Only 2 things could have done that... Definitely a track- looks like a bear on first, uh, 'impression'... in the future if you find a track, try to take a photo from an angle too, not just straight above. Also, avoid overhead sun if possible. The more perspective the better. If it looks human, check and see if there is any evidence of claws ahead of the digits. You may have to remove debris to see that if the track is in forest detritus. The big toe is telling- see if you can spot that and the heel as well. Where, in this photo, do you think the heel is? Well I'm admittedly NOT footprint savvy. But it was fun going out there when snow was on ground and looking at all the tracks. Thanks for the advice though because you just never know when I might come across something interesting. But to answer your question, I wouldn't expect to see a heel even it was a human track because it's going uphill. the original mention of the deer's wound say there were wood splinters sticking out of it? Or am I imagining that, missed a change of discussion, or ... something? MIB He said you could see it in the pic, but my close-in eyesight isn't what it used to be. I'm going to DL the pic and zoom way in and see if I spot any wood debris in the wound. I have no idea what could have caused a wound like that, I must say. I'd like to hear more about what the finder of the carcass can tell us. He and his gf are on the way over right now. You can call him, or he can call you? Text him and see. Edited March 8, 2014 by WesT
Guest WesT Posted March 8, 2014 Posted March 8, 2014 I agree, WesT. You have some interesting finds, thanks for sharing. Your welcome JKH. I hesitated to share this because it's all so hard to fathom. I mean primative novel tool use? I know I hadn't ever heard of such a thing as this. There's more to come, this canary isn't done singing yet. WSA, with your permission I'd like to invite an eyewitness to the discussion. This person had what researchers call a classA daytime encounter. He's a good friend and a fine individual. I want him to tell what he saw before he got ran out of the woods. It is on topic and relevent to the thread.
Guest WesT Posted March 10, 2014 Posted March 10, 2014 I downloaded the pic and zoomed in. I couldn't see any signs of splinters or wood in or around the wound. The resolution isn't good enough. Even if it was, someone could have still done that with a stick as it layed there.
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