Yuchi1 Posted May 12, 2014 Share Posted May 12, 2014 @Yuchi - It's funny I read your posts and agree with about 1/2 and disagree with the other. Oh well....se la vi. If I may ask (please do not answer if you do not want to)......are by chance of Native American descent? http://www.ifthelegendsfade.com/ About grandmother, in the 6th printing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 12, 2014 Share Posted May 12, 2014 Please start another thread.... This is really to Much class room stuff IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norseman Posted May 12, 2014 Share Posted May 12, 2014 I have no idea how you prove habitat without proving the species first.....the notion is preposterous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yuchi1 Posted May 12, 2014 Share Posted May 12, 2014 (edited) Stan, Cannot speak for your locale however, here in Oklahoma as well as much of the southeastern USA, the whitetail deer populations have dramatically increased over the past century. I hunt, fish with and have as clients several department biologists and we've had numerous conversations whilst sitting in the duck blind or in the boat, about wildlife. Their opinion is these increases are due to a variety of factors with two (2) being at the top of the list. First, is clear-cutting as it continually provides a huge base of forage (years 1-4) after the timbering is done. Mature forests and their canopy simply do not allow for such a bonanza of edible habitat. As are whitetail deer (forest dwellers) yet they have successfully adapted to clear cutting and even thrived by virtue of such. To postulate UHS/BF/WA hasn't done the same seems a tad myopic, wouldn't you say? No. Whitetails are primarily EDGE animals; they're increasing because deforestation is giving them more of what they prefer. ..."White-tailed deer, the smallest members of the North American deer family, are found from southern Canada to South America. In the heat of summer they typically inhabit fields and meadows using clumps of broad-leaved and coniferous forests for shade. During the winter they generally keep to forests, preferring coniferous stands that provide shelter from the harsh elements"... source: http://animals.nationalgeographic.com/animals/mammals/white-tailed-deer/ Seems like they prefer the trees pretty much year 'round. You say science and others have said, an agenda driven by greed and ego. That (like the they're-human! take) is a subjective judgment. I would prefer an observation, based upon many years of dealing with people. Is there anywhere in NAWAC's documents (Mission Statement, etc.) where it states that all proceeds derived from the killing of a UHS/BF will go into a trust/foundation designated solely for the benefit of the UHS/BF? That's angels and pinheads. I don't care. They're doing what needs to be done to confirm. Period. It's beyond funny to think anyone in this is in it for money (the ones like Dyer and Biscardi - who actually are - are WAY beyond funny. There is no money in this). I would argue the above statement is subjective for there are those who will pay such as the trust fund baby mentioned earlier. rather than rely on SWAG logic to foster a mandate that may be based more upon conjecture than reality? IMO, you're a bit off on a tangent as my contention is not the protocol of modern scientific method rather, the subject targeted may well be something more than a mere ape. Which is the actual tangent, as no evidence supports it, and apes aren't "mere" anything; and this separation of humans (which we kill indiscriminately and primarily for no good reason) and "mere" apes is more angels and pins silliness. Neither of us know (forensically) whether UHS/BF is simply gorilla-class or so close to homo sapien, it will create a riot. The fact many people carry Neanderthal genes clearly indicate a bit of "cross-pollenation" was going on, back in the day. Be careful what you wish for..."well, I'll be a monkey's uncle". The many years NAWAC's own field work and frustrations are IMO, the "evidence" of such. If this entity was a mere great ape, what are the odds they would have tagged & bagged one by now? NAWAC people are not obtuse individuals, they are intelligent persons and IMO, know they're chasing something that possesses a higher level of intelligence than Cheetah. Nope. Too many people who understand little if anything about science fail to understand that NAWAC is pretty much on schedule, for people whose involvement couldn't be charitably called 'part-time.' Who's written the book on hunting this species yet, and honed that book for thousands of years, the way we have for everything else? Nobody. Apparently UHS/BF has written the book, "How to evade humans and make them look silly, 101" I have no idea how you prove habitat without proving the species first.....the notion is preposterous From what I understand, a long time ago there was this little object ('bout the size of a marble) that produced a loud bang. Next thing you know some things came together and water was formed with little critters a wiggling about in it. Some of them decided to make a field trip to the shore, found the groceries were plentiful and next thing, a Walmart sprang up. Tried to keep it in 25 words or less. Edited May 12, 2014 by Yuchi1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 Bipto- There are Barred Owls in Michigan as well, they thrive in the 2nd and 3rd growth heavily mature/old growth forests that exist here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 The rise in deer numbers is also due to farming, lots to eat. I've heard the average deer will eat twelve hundred lbs. of corn per year. About the spotted owl, when they nest in a K mart sign, it doesn't look like they need old growth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 There are Barred Owls in Michigan as well, they thrive in the 2nd and 3rd growth heavily mature/old growth forests that exist here. Barred owls have made the second weirdest noises I've ever heard in the field. Anyone looking for bigfoot in a halfway serious manner should familiarize themselves with owl calls. Freaky things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DWA Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 (edited) ^^^It should be noted however that "lung power" indicating a very large animal is in no way present in the craziest barred-owl concertos. ..."White-tailed deer, the smallest members of the North American deer family, are found from southern Canada to South America. In the heat of summer they typically inhabit fields and meadows using clumps of broad-leaved and coniferous forests for shade. During the winter they generally keep to forests, preferring coniferous stands that provide shelter from the harsh elements"... source: http://animals.nationalgeographic.com/animals/mammals/white-tailed-deer/ Seems like they prefer the trees pretty much year 'round. Sure they do: as escape, cover and winter shelter. They do much if not all of their feeding near the edge of forest, as anyone knows who's seen lots of them, frequently in the wide open. Forest dwellers don't do that. Native Americans cleared land for deer, not hoping the deer would "adapt," but to give them more of what they prefer. We're taking care of that now with Wal-Marts and subdivisions. Sasquatch: forest animals. Deer: not so much. If sasquatch spent most of their time in the open the way deer do, I'm kinda thinking they'd be confirmed by now. Forest loss isn't good for them (and past a point, which we have not reached yet, not good for deer either). One doesn't need to make the case for habitat loss. One only needs to look around. Think of it this way. If we planted your food on the former site of your house...would that present a problem...? Edited May 13, 2014 by DWA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 ^^^It should be noted however that "lung power" indicating a very large animal is in no way present in the craziest barred-owl concertos. What is this in reference too? A Barred Owl in the same tree as my treestand nearly knocked me out of the tree with the volume of it's call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DWA Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 Being startled and lung power aren't nearly the same thing. You can tell pretty easily it's a middling-size bird. Although getting there might take a few seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WSA Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 Spirometer measurement is pretty much your standard of measurement for lung volume. Doubt anyone has ever got a deer to comply with testing though. I couldn't find a value for deer, but here is one for elk, using an accepted standard. Lungs. There are no published data concerning the lungs of elk. Using the general physiological formula (Schmidt-Nielsen 1975) that lung volume (in liters) = 0.063 x body weight' 02, elk should have a lung volume of 20-23 liters (5.3-6.1 gallons). My official determination is that a 900 lb. mammal would have a "boat load" of lung volume. (+/- a smidge). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunflower Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 What I heard a few years would be like a 600 lb barred owl. I said "Whooooooo!" and it said "Whoooooo about 4 octaves lower" which is not typical of a barred owl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yuchi1 Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 Speaking of vocalisations, what are everyone's thoughts on infrasound and UHS possible ability to produce them? Have done some reading on this item and it appears to have offensive/defensive applications by the producer of this type of sound wave. Do some people's encounters w/UHS leave them disoriented and/or at a loss to account for time periods? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1980squatch Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 ^^^ Seen you use that term a number of times, not sure what it means: UHS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cotter Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 I'm guessing 'undiscovered homo sapien'. Just a guess though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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