My Perspective and questions for you all

[Rockape]

1 hour ago, Incorrigible1 said:

One ape waving to all the other apes, out there.

 

Hello, fellow ape.

 

 

7 hours ago, norseman said:

 

Booooo! Hiissssss! 

 

 

 

You want me to throw a rock at him?

Edited November 1, 2018 by Rockape

[norseman]

Of course! Where ya been? 

[Rockape]

I got things to do ya' know, trees to climb, bananas to eat, all that.

[norseman]

This is exactly why the Soviets s**tcanned you guys!!! All you guys are good at is chasin skirts and stuffing your face!

[Twist]

9 hours ago, FarArcher said:

Haven't been here in ages, but this thread has been entertaining to say the least.

 

Due entirely to my contrarian nature - to the OP - I'll make a few observations.

 

First, I don't think they're migratory or perpetually wandering.  Any canny man living in wild country that gets cold knows to set aside food supplies gathered in Summer and Fall.  They also know to range and hunt far from their winter quarters - leaving the nearby game alone - as it's hard to hunt in the winter, and the closer game is to your winter quarters - the easier your life will be.

 

Meaning - I think they're largely territorial - they may make a three or four day loop hunting - hitting some areas only once every three to four days - however large that territory would be - it would depend on terrain.

 

Their Summer hunting areas will probably be just a bit different than their Winter quarters - maybe they'll hunt in the next valley over - even at higher elevations - and leave the game alone in the next valley over where they have Winter quarters.  

 

Normally, I'd never postulate one way or the other on whether these things are some kind of apes or something else - but I know they're not apes.  No guessing, I know.  Which would be why they're so adept at avoiding those whom they wish to avoid.  They're smart.  They have tactical excellence.  They're finely attuned to their environment.  They also have the ability to hide in plain sight.  And have the patience of Job.  They don't panic.

 

The ape-believing crowd will go ape-**** at that concept - but none of them ever got a really close-up look at their faces.  And it's not just me.  Native Americans often refer to them as forest people, or forest men, or wild men - and through the ages in multiple cultures - they're often called variations of a wild man.

 

The popular belief in these things being apes - is pushed by scientists - who by their own fabricated "science" and faulty history of man - they cannot allow for any type of cave man to still exist.  They dug their hole, deep, and now they're stuck in it.

 

I'd further suggest that if a person sees one, or if that one is making a racket - you're already flanked by others you don't see and aren't aware of - and you should really keep checking your six o'clock position.

 

And while they may be spotted singly most often - I am firmly convinced that they live in family groups, or clans - and they can and do work with others from neighboring families or clans.  Which also assists in maintaining a healthy breeding population - which must be really significant.

 

We humans 'own' the day - they've apparently adapted and certainly 'own' the night.

 

 

 

So as reports show, BF is darn near nation wide.   Are there multiple family groups/clans in each state?   Hunting patterns as you describe in relation to climate or elevation generally only work in select habitat.   What do you suggest other  clans do in other habitats?  

 

Just curious.  

[FarArcher]

14 hours ago, Twist said:

 

So as reports show, BF is darn near nation wide.   Are there multiple family groups/clans in each state?   Hunting patterns as you describe in relation to climate or elevation generally only work in select habitat.   What do you suggest other  clans do in other habitats?  

 

Just curious.  

 

 

Yes, I'd think that the family group/clan is a characteristic of these things.  As you said, reports of BF are almost nation-wide - meaning - they too come from a significant breeding population.   The size of the clan that we shared that mountain with numbered at least seven - as that's how many pairs of eyes we lit up the night they came for the deer they'd badly hurt, and we'd shot to put it out of its misery.  But we'd only spot one at a time during light hours, on four occasions.

 

I'd suggest that in areas in the east, for example - they may not have the more defined valleys, but a lot of eastern areas have something else.  Game AND agriculture.  Lots of game, and lots of agriculture.  They have dense hollows, lots of areas defined by creeks, lakes, and rivers. I have no idea as to the size of a group's territory - but I'd assume it would match the population/game/agriculture available.  They're not stupid - rather - pretty clever.

 

My point is this - these things if not dumb animals - and what I believe to be some primitive relict species of some kind of caveman - are highly adaptable to their environment.  They don't need what we would consider necessities.  And I'd venture to suggest that whitetail deer are everywhere!  Hogs are heavy in many areas of the Eastern US, low and high.

 

Plentiful food in southern and eastern swamps - plenty of corn and soybeans in the midwest - plenty of wildlife and seafood in the salt marshes of the eastern US.

 

You can take any Cajun - show him a ditch - and  he'll come up with lunch.  And as good as Cajuns are - these things are Master Scroungers.

 

Oh.  And they DO use rocks as tools of a sort.  They can throw double-fist sized rocks with great accuracy.  Small ones too.  

[Twist]

1 hour ago, FarArcher said:

 

 

Yes, I'd think that the family group/clan is a characteristic of these things.  As you said, reports of BF are almost nation-wide - meaning - they too come from a significant breeding population.   The size of the clan that we shared that mountain with numbered at least seven - as that's how many pairs of eyes we lit up the night they came for the deer they'd badly hurt, and we'd shot to put it out of its misery.  But we'd only spot one at a time during light hours, on four occasions.

 

I'd suggest that in areas in the east, for example - they may not have the more defined valleys, but a lot of eastern areas have something else.  Game AND agriculture.  Lots of game, and lots of agriculture.  They have dense hollows, lots of areas defined by creeks, lakes, and rivers. I have no idea as to the size of a group's territory - but I'd assume it would match the population/game/agriculture available.  They're not stupid - rather - pretty clever.

 

My point is this - these things if not dumb animals - and what I believe to be some primitive relict species of some kind of caveman - are highly adaptable to their environment.  They don't need what we would consider necessities.  And I'd venture to suggest that whitetail deer are everywhere!  Hogs are heavy in many areas of the Eastern US, low and high.

 

Plentiful food in southern and eastern swamps - plenty of corn and soybeans in the midwest - plenty of wildlife and seafood in the salt marshes of the eastern US.

 

You can take any Cajun - show him a ditch - and  he'll come up with lunch.  And as good as Cajuns are - these things are Master Scroungers.

 

Oh.  And they DO use rocks as tools of a sort.  They can throw double-fist sized rocks with great accuracy.  Small ones too.  

 

Thanks for the well thought out response.  I tend to think they are of lower population but in regards to their adaptability and survival skills we have similar views.   I tend to believe they may be more nomadic however and cover a greater range.  Again, thanks.  

[James33]

18 hours ago, NatFoot said:

 

Does this not push you/us towards a more paranormal explanation then?

 

Masters of the night who are almost human, but then either have no need, or have not figured out how to make stone tools after watching us do that and much more for thousands of years?

 

Something doesn't add up. It's like we want to have our cake and eat it too.

 

Agreed - I don't think they can be uber-intelligent and still not have learned to use any tools (rocks, sticks, etc).  Even chimps use sticks to get termites out of a nest. Maybe they are just really good at hiding their tools too. And hiding where they sleep.  And hiding where they bury their dead. And hiding in plain sight from us.  And smart enough to know where to hunt and where not to.  And smart enough to never steal chickens or goats from farmers, or eat their crops.  Or maybe there just aren't any bigfoot?

Edited November 1, 2018 by James33
correct spelling....

[ShadowBorn]

Think about this . We have to teach chimps and apes to do things but who have taught these  creatures what they are doing to out smart us as humans. We have to use technology to get a way to confirm what we are seeing them. We are so advanced in the things that we are using in order to just get a small glimpse of them. So what taught them to out smart us? I am still sticking with our military getting the chance of a snatch and grab of one of these creatures . What I am not sure is of them actually having one in their possession and this to me is just speculation on my part. I agree what Faracher is talking about them except for the fact that they might be caveman. I can not go along with the idea of them being caveman and with what I have experienced . There is more to them but no one wants to wonder down that rabbit hole and I agree to stay away from the paranormal side until we can understand it better. I want to explain more on what I know but want to gain the proof. This is what this form is about. To bring the truth with the proof in hand to prove what is being said.  So far no one has done this and I am sure that in the future it will not be done by no one.

[Twist]

If there were enough resources to teach them to evade humans by the military, we would have leaks from the military of said teachings.   The simple solution to why they are so elusive, to me, is they their low population numbers.   Hell, they may be extinct for all I know.  Maybe the PGF did capture the last real BF.  IDK.   But I don't believe they are living in this day and age, seen widespread like reports would believe, just to evade capture or proof this whole time.     

[Huntster]

11 minutes ago, Twist said:

........The simple solution to why they are so elusive, to me, is they their low population numbers........

 

^^This.^^

[norseman]

5 hours ago, James33 said:

 

Agreed - I don't think they can be uber-intelligent and still not have learned to use any tools (rocks, sticks, etc).  Even chimps use sticks to get termites out of a nest. Maybe they are just really good at hiding their tools too. And hiding where they sleep.  And hiding where they bury their dead. And hiding in plain sight from us.  And smart enough to know where to hunt and where not to.  And smart enough to never steal chickens or goats from farmers, or eat their crops.  Or maybe there just aren't any bigfoot?

 

Or there are very few.

 

One argument Ive never understood is that intelligence will hide you......even in places like the suburbs of Chicago. Even if a creature adopts a completely nocturnal lifestyle? What does it do about street lamps? Security cameras? Traffic? An 800 lbs appetite? The explanations to explain away why we do not observe these things readily get more and more and more complex.....and quite frankly..... out there. 

 

I think in many cases Bigfoot is not there and some Bigfootmania with researchers hooting and banging on trees is to explain for much of the evidence. With some hoaxing thrown in.

 

You have to stand in your local forest and ask yourself IF a breeding population of 800 lbs Apes, Apemen, Cavemen, Omnivore mammals, Humans, COULD sustain themselves within it without being seen often 12 months out of the year, year after year after year. Another question is if other key large species still reside there or have they been snuffed out?

 

I dont think a 300 acre park surrounded by corn fields cuts the mustard. You would know pronto if a troupe of Bigfeet moved into your corn field. Stealth and intelligence only go so far.

 

 

 

 

[Huntster]

The Bluff Creek area was a wilderness prior to 1950. There was very little infiltration before the logging roads were built into the area. Gold prospectors, perhaps, a century before, bu5 clearly no roads. 

 

Immediately upon roads were built into the area, contact was made. The contact was regular for over ten years before the PG film, and it waned slowly until reports petered out a few years later.

 

So what happened? I think that the family/group that habituated the area both died out a bit and the leftovers moved on to another area that was quieter. They clearly prefer areas with few humans.

[James33]

11 hours ago, norseman said:

 

Or there are very few.

 

One argument Ive never understood is that intelligence will hide you......even in places like the suburbs of Chicago. Even if a creature adopts a completely nocturnal lifestyle? What does it do about street lamps? Security cameras? Traffic? An 800 lbs appetite? The explanations to explain away why we do not observe these things readily get more and more and more complex.....and quite frankly..... out there. 

 

I think in many cases Bigfoot is not there and some Bigfootmania with researchers hooting and banging on trees is to explain for much of the evidence. With some hoaxing thrown in.

 

You have to stand in your local forest and ask yourself IF a breeding population of 800 lbs Apes, Apemen, Cavemen, Omnivore mammals, Humans, COULD sustain themselves within it without being seen often 12 months out of the year, year after year after year. Another question is if other key large species still reside there or have they been snuffed out?

 

I dont think a 300 acre park surrounded by corn fields cuts the mustard. You would know pronto if a troupe of Bigfeet moved into your corn field. Stealth and intelligence only go so far.

 

 

 

 

 

This.  According to the vast majority of sightings, they never "run" away when they are seen by humans.  If anything it seems like they are disinterested and just walk away.  They don't seem to be afraid of humans at all, and you'd think that if they had access to a farmer's field of readily available food, they'd take advantage of it to the point of the farmer noticing. To those who suggest it's smart enough to leave it alone or to only take a little so as to remain unnoticed, I think that is making them WAY too intelligent. If they are smart enough to do that, they are approaching human levels of intelligence and that simply doesn't fit their profile at all.  i.e. living in the woods, sleeping on the ground, foraging berries and killing a wild hog or deer, hollering in the middle of the night, and banging on trees. 

 

[norseman]

It doesnt matter if you have a IQ of 1000? If your starving your starving! And a 800 lbs frame is not going to be easy to keep feed. It takes a large grocery bill to feed a body that large. And when your starving your not appealing to the higher functioning portions of your brain. Your appealing to the primal lizard part of your brain that doesn't care how you get it done.... just get it done.

 

A Bear going through the side of a camper to get to a pizza box comes to mind here.