How Far Up The Ladder Does Knowledge Of Sasquatch Go?

[norseman]

4 minutes ago, SWWASAS said:

Evidence seems to point that way however differentiation is subtle.   What I detailed above are but a few examples.    I spend a lot of time at a footprint find trying to figure out what the BF was doing and why.       Much of what they do seems to be learned behavior.   Some of my few interactions seem to be with juveniles.      My theory is that juveniles may be encouraged to interact with selected humans who do not present a threat because of past benign behavior of a human.   .   A favorite game seems to be approach, interact by tossing a rock,  and withdraw without being seen.   Twice I had my pack hit by a rock in the same area but on widely separated days.   One of those times I heard the padding footsteps just before I was hit.   I twirled around and could not see the rock tosser.   That is very disconcerting.    If a juvenile can pull that off,  avoiding a human with a gun intent on harm is a lot easier.   

 

Why juveniles? Why not adults simply trying to drive you away? 

 

 

1 minute ago, Old Time Lifter said:

 

What would a BF fear out in the wild?  Why would it hide its tracks when hunting, as far as I know, deer (or any other animal) don't look for tracks but rely on sight, sound, and smell.  The BF trying to hide its tracks would seem like something only done when it knows it's encountered something inclined to look for tracks.  

 

Do chimps look for tracks of other animals in the wild?  Do BF look for tracks when hunting?

 

Only man that Im aware of hunts by tracking. And its old. Supposedly sweat glands and bipedalism allowed us to track game to exhaustion.

[Catmandoo]

2 hours ago, SWWASAS said:

  The cougar glared at me for 10 or 15 seconds then walked off down the logging road I had been using on a mountain bike.

 

Predators study what they meet and cycle through the '5 F'' scenario:  Flee,  Fight,  Friend,  Food,  F....................the last one will hurt.

52 minutes ago, SWWASAS said:

   I doubt Patty expected a human encounter that day.

 

Maybe yes, maybe no.  The question of whether or not young offspring were close by will always exist. Patty may have done the 'lead away maneuver' to show human behavior to the young one(s). 'School' requires close proximity.

Birds ( Nighthawks ) have done 'lead away maneuvers' to me. Female does the 'fly away'  from her egg. Male buzzes your face at high speed.

Edited February 1, 2019 by Catmandoo
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[Huntster]

1 hour ago, SWWASAS said:

........BF behavior in remote areas need not be the same.      I doubt Patty expected a human encounter that day.    In areas where humans are common,  it is likely that BF only move around at night.........

 

Those statements deserve a huge thread of its own, particularly the personalized affect of the encounter on Patty herself, and extended thought on the behavioral changes a family or clan of sasquatches go through afyer the rude invasion by humans.

 

Before 1958, the sasquatch clan that Patty was a member of had virtually no exposure to humanity at all unless they ventured out of the upper Bluff Creek area to the main drainages of the Klamath, Smith, and Salmon Rivers, and we can assume that they did on occasion and perhaps even regularly. When the forestry roads were built unto the upper reaches of all the tributaries of the above rivers and logging began in a huge way in 1958, their bedrooms were invaded. These are the deep, dark, forested areas that these creatures prefer for their most solitary and intimate activities, especially courting, mating, birthing, retreat, etc. It appears that they somewhat tolerated the pressure during the decade before the PG event (which was rather intense), but eventually they either moved on to more remote areas, died off, got better at hiding, or all of the above (which is the most likely explanation), because sasquatch activity in the area subsided after the PG event by the mid-1970's. While there are still reports in the area even today, they are mostly footprint finds, vocalizations, and non-visual night time campsite prowlings.

 

Edited February 1, 2019 by Huntster

[SWWASAS]

1 hour ago, norseman said:

 

Why juveniles? Why not adults simply trying to drive you away? 

 

You seem want to equate BF behavior with behavior of other animals.   Why would an adult BF,  probably the most reclusive animal in the wild,  approach an armed human totally unaware of it's presence,  who has already passed it's position,  and hit the human with a rock so small that it would not harm me if it hit me in the head?    A cougar not interested in attacking would simply let me pass and walk away while it watched.    If cougar and BF have similar behavior,  the BF would simply let me pass and walk away.   Their behavior is either similar or different.   It is obvious to me a rock thrower is different no matter if it is adult of juvenile.    Of course I have no idea which other than the sound of the footsteps were way different, sounding more like a child running,   than adult footsteps I heard years before that, and years later.        

Edited February 1, 2019 by SWWASAS

[norseman]

I ask because it is typical primate behavior to throw things and harass an intruder until it grows weary of it and leaves. But I do not think the trait is predicated upon age. Everyone joins in.

 

As I think BF is a primate? I look for similarities between what you are experiencing and known primate  behavior.

[ShadowBorn]

4 hours ago, SWWASAS said:

You seem want to equate BF behavior with behavior of other animals.   Why would an adult BF,  probably the most reclusive animal in the wild,  approach an armed human totally unaware of it's presence,  who has already passed it's position,  and hit the human with a rock so small that it would not harm me if it hit me in the head?    A cougar not interested in attacking would simply let me pass and walk away while it watched.    If cougar and BF have similar behavior,  the BF would simply let me pass and walk away.   Their behavior is either similar or different.   It is obvious to me a rock thrower is different no matter if it is adult of juvenile.    Of course I have no idea which other than the sound of the footsteps were way different, sounding more like a child running,   than adult footsteps I heard years before that, and years later.

Swwasas

First off a cougar is not going to let you know that it is there watching you until you spotted first. So you will have no idea if there is a cougar watching you at all until it jumps you or you spot it. When the creature threw that small rock at you it was because it was making sure to let you know that it was there. It could of been a test if you were armed to see if you would have drawn you gun and that is if it notice you had a gun.

 

I was out with my son placing a stand in this one spot and my son was about eight years old when I took him with me . It was late September and I was up on the tree when my son yelled at my and said that some thing was throwing small stones at him. At the time I did not know what to make of it. So he started throwing stones back at whatever it was that was throwing the stones at him. Now what ever it was that was throwing these small stones at my son it seemed like it was a game. I on the other hand did not think much of it since I was busy with my stand. But I did keep an eye on my son and I seen how he kept on throwing these small stones back. So I asked him on what was going on and he told me that some thing was throwing stones at him and that he was throwing them back.

 

Now I am not sure if this relates to primate behavior.  The more that I thought about this incident the more I thought that this behavior is not normal. In my view I honestly thought that there must have been another human out in those woods with us playing games with him. But that was not the case as it later turned out. To this day I cannot consider them as primates like Monkeys or Apes or even Gorillas. Yet I cannot see them as humans either. I cannot even base them as being animals either. I just call them a creature or maybe a people of their own kind. Could we have branched off them I do not know and the same goes with them branching off of us I just do not know. But some thing is hidden in them from us and we may never know.

[southernyahoo]

On ‎1‎/‎23‎/‎2019 at 6:16 PM, hiflier said:

Some recent discussions in a round about way have been hinting at there being knowledge of Sasquatch at levels above just our normal field researchers. This thread is for discussing the possibility not as a conspiracy theory but more to logically understand that with a bit of mature reasoning one could conclude that there could indeed be knowledge of this creature beyond just who we know here on this Forum. And as per usual, I always have a point behind creating a thread. But just for now, Does anyone think that this creature couldn't possibly be known about in any branch of forest or land management to include animal monitoring with todays specialized equipment methods?

 

 

You might be able to find a moderator or admin here who could likely inform you whether certain IP addresses that hit this website are from the Department of Interior or Department of Defense.

[SWWASAS]

28 minutes ago, southernyahoo said:

 

 

You might be able to find a moderator or admin here who could likely inform you whether certain IP addresses that hit this website are from the Department of Interior or Department of Defense.

They probably know that this website has an DOD IP address        Kidding of course.    But if I were trying to keep a lid on bigfoot research, I would have someone assigned to monitor and possibly provide misinformation on this and other bigfoot websites.   That is what the spook agencies do.   

[hiflier]

1 hour ago, SWWASAS said:

They probably know that this website has an DOD IP address        Kidding of course.

 

Kidding is fine. Back when I was a UFO Forum member someone, anonymously of course, uploaded a list of the sources of IP addresses belonging to various agencies. Now this doesn't necessarily mean that the agencies were 'spying' on the UFO Forum as the presence of any IP address could have just been a lowling who was personally interested in the UFO subject:

 

"Different sources that view UFO Forums: HERE ARE THE BULK OF THEM GIVEN UP FROM NUMEROUS UFO WEBSITES AFTER CHECKING THE VARIOUS INTERNET SERVICE PROVIDER RECORD (ISP) HITS TO THEIR SITE Keep in mind also that sometimes employees use their computer at work to surf just like we all have at some time."

 

"Naval Surface Warfare Center, Fredericksburg, Va.; Department Of Veterans Affairs/Little Rock, Arkansas; Oak Ridge National Laboratory; U.S. Patent And Trademark Office, Arlington, Virginia; The Boeing Company, Everett, Washington; Computer Sciences Corp, Lexington Park, Maryland; National Archives And Records Administration, Temple Hills, Maryland; Information Systems, U.S. House Of Representatives, Oxon Hill, Maryland; U.S. Department Of Transportation, Washington, D.C.; Contra Costa County Office Of Education, Oakley California; State Of Texas General Services Commission, Bastrop, Texas; City Of Austin, Texas; State Of New Jersey, Department Of Treasury, Trenton, New Jersey; Department of Energy/Western Area Power Administration, Fort Collins, Colorado; Headquarters 5th Signal Command, Naval Construction Training Center, Arlington, Virginia; State Of New Mexico, Santa Fe, New Mexico; State of Alaska, Anchorage, Alaska; Army Information Systems Command, Huachuca City, Arizona; Department of Defense Network Information Center, Vienna, Virginia; Massachusetts Institute Of Technology (MIT), RCN Corporation, Baltimore, Maryland; U.S. Naval Academy, Annapolis, Maryland; NASA, Cleveland, Ohio; 75th Air Base Wing, Hill AFB, Utah; U.S. Military Academy, Newburgh, New York; U.S. Department of Agriculture, Office Of Operations, National Defense University, Accokeek, Maryland; Joint Services Command And Staff College, Second Assignment, London; NASA, Huntsville, Alabama; Hughes Network Systems, Germantown, Maryland; Arlington County Government, Arlington, Virginia, Stanford Linear Accelerator Center, Palo Alto, California; Argonne National Laboratory, Chicago, Illinois; State Of Delaware, Georgetown, Delaware; Shaw AFB, South Carolina; NASA/Kennedy Space Center, Massachusetts Institute Of Technology Lab For Nuclear Science; Government Of The Province Of Ontario, Toronto, Ontario, Canada; Federal Election Commission, Washington, D.C.; State Of New Jersey Department Of Treasury, Trenton, Pennsylvania; Space Science Institute, Boulder. Colorado; National Environmental Trust, Annapolis, Maryland; Science Applications International Corporation, Washington, D.C.; Space Science Institute, Boulder, Colorado; Department of Defense Network Information Centers in Hugo, Minnesota; San Diego, and Columbus, Ohio; Northrop Grumman Corporation, Huntington Beach, California; Directorate of Information Management, Fort Meade, Maryland; NASA - Hampton, Virginia; Army Information Systems Command, San Antonio, Texas; 20th Communications Squadron, Sumter, South Carolina; Defense Medical Systems Support Center, Falls Church, Virginia; U.S. Department Of Justice, Washington, D.C.; National Aerospace Laboratory, Leeuwarden Friesland, Netherlands; National Computer Security Center, Baltimore, Maryland; Defense Contract Management Agency, Boston, Massachusettes; Reseau D'informations Scientifiques Du Quebec (Risq Inc.), Montreal, Quebec, Canada; NASA, San Jose, California; Andrews AFB, Maryland; Federal Aviation Administration, Egg Harbor Township, New Jersey; U.S. Department Of State, Washington, D.C.; TRW Space And Defense Sector, Redondo Beach, California; NASA, New Orleans; National Oceanic And Atmospheric Administration, Seattle, Washington; Army & Air Force Exchange Service, Virginia Beach; Virginia; Defense Reutilization And Marketing Service, Battle Creek, Michigan; U.S. Army Corps Of Engineers, Vicksburg, Mississippi; Canadian House Of Commons, Ottawa, Canada, State Of Minnesota, Minneapolis, Minnesota; Lockheed-Martin Corporation, Denver, Colorado; Munitions System Division, Eglin AFB; Federal Aviation Administration, Curtis Bay, Maryland; Allied Signal Technical Services, Colorado Springs, Colorado; Northrop Grumman Corporation, Laurel, Maryland; The Boeing Company, Chicago, Illinois; Defense Contract Management Agency, Oak Park, Illinois; Department of Defense, Network Information Center, Tampa, Florida; National Library Of Medicine, Gaithersburg, Maryland; Fannie Mae, Washington, D.C., U.S.; Geological Survey, Littleton, Colorado; Director Of Logistics/Transportation Office, Fort Campbell, Kentucky; Stanford Linear Accelerator Center, Palo Alto, California; Public Defender office, Rockville, Maryland; Army National Guard Bureau, Columbia, South Carolina; Smithsonian Institute, Washington, D.C.; Headquarters U.S. Army Recruiting Command, Fort Knox, Kentucky; Spacelabs Medical, Issaquah, Washington; Wright-Patterson AFB, Dayton, Ohio; United Technologies Research Center, Manchester, Conneticut; Air National Guard Arlington, Virginia; NASA, Las Cruces, New Mexico, U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, Washington, D.C.; Internal Revenue Service, Washington, D.C.; U.S. Bureau Of Indian Affairs, Arizona; Australian Department Of Defense, Adelaide, Australia; NASA, Greenbelt, Maryland; Air Force Flight Test Center, Anchorage, Alaska; NASA, Slidell, Louisianna; U.S. Southern Command, Miami, Florida; U.S. Senate, Sergeant At Arms, Washington, D.C.; National Weather Service, Kansas City, Missouri; Army Information Systems Command, Fort Knox, Kentucky; National Archives And Records Administration, Temple Hills, Maryland; Board Of Police Commissioners, Plano, Texas; Department Of Prime Minister And Cabinet, Sydney, Australia; 355th Communications Squadron, Tucson, Arizona; NASA, Glennie, Michigan; Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport Board, Irving, Texas, NASA, Houston, Texas; General Services Administration, Silver Springs, Maryland; Battelle Memorial Institute, Columbus, Ohio; Naval Research Laboratory, Lorton, Virginia; Offutt AFB, Nebraska; Army Personnel Command, Grovetown, Georgia; New Mexico Institute Of Mining And Technology, Socorro, New Mexico; The Aerospace Corporation, El Segundo, California; National Radio Astronomy Observatory, San Antonio, New Mexico; North Carolina Research And Education Network, Raleigh, North Carolina; U.S. Geological Survey, Fairfield, California; Texas Railroad Commission, Austin, Texas; USAF Systems Command, Los Angeles, California; V.C. Summer Nuclear Station, Columbia, South Carolina; Federal Reserve Information Technology, Richmond, Virginia; 49th Fighter Wing, Holloman AFB, New Mexico; Naval Research Laboratory, Picayune, Mississippi."

 

Now as for this Forum? Add in any personnel from the DOI, F&G, FS, BLM, and Park Service, and any other federal or state agency to the UFO list and subtract whichever agency from the list that you wish to subtract by virtue of the subject being switched from UFO's to Sasquatch and it would still be a lot of official IP addresses. But, hey, folks here think no one's watching? Fine by me. The initial UFO IP address list was from May 1, 2011. Anyone think surveillance of Forums through PRISM/NSA has gotten any better in the last eight years? You bet it has. It's why I said that NO ONE is anonymous on a Forum. Everyone's email address is kept somewhere and that "somewhere" is necessarily, by law, government accessible.

Edited February 4, 2019 by hiflier

[SWWASAS]

Given the large numbers of different agencies in the above posting,   I believe that is just evidence that individuals in those agencies had a personal and non official interest in UFO's.     Official trolling would be limited to just a handful of agencies.   Secret activities are compartmentalized and not spread like butter across many agencies.    It is likely official UFO investigation agencies would have fronts so that even that would be obscured as to what the IP address was really assigned to what agency.    

 

We would see such compartmentalization in BF investigation if there was any cover up.    Only a few agencies would be involved.      The BF believably and deniability has been made a lot easier by the myth designation going back nearly as far back as the sighting reports.     UFO sightings have tended to be more often seen by multiple witness, sometimes in separated locations, and are much harder to explain away with something as simple as mythology.   Experimental aircraft  explanation works as long as the flight characteristics of the UFO are not beyond expected capabilities of aircraft.   If they are, witness are accused of not understanding what they have seen, or misidentification of natural phenomena.      The equivalent there with BF is that the witness saw a bear.    

[hiflier]

22 minutes ago, SWWASAS said:

I believe that is just evidence that individuals in those agencies had a personal and non official interest in UFO's.

 

Personally? I would stay away from such generalizations. And you know me, SWWASAS, I have read every speck of what is on that list so I know that things like the  Directorate of Information Management, Fort Meade, Maryland, the Smithsonian Institute, Washington, D.C., the U.S. Department of Agriculture, Office Of Operations and a few others would be likely to have interested parties. There is no room for naivete on a subject as potentially upheaving as Sasquatch disclosure. If it was me I would want to know who's who in Bigfootdom, what their progress is- if any, where they are and what they're up to. And if it were known that Sasquatch was real then it would be even more important to keep track of what's going on in the field and what people know and discuss. And today's technology allows that kind of monitoring to be easier than ever before.    

[Catmandoo]

On 2/1/2019 at 10:23 AM, norseman said:

In India they make masks with eyes and wear them on the back of their head. It deters Tigers!!! The darn Tiger dont like something looking at it while its stalking! Crazy.

 

Anyhow, Im just trying to make the point you dont need human level intelligence to be stealthy.

 

"you don't need human level intelligence to be stealthy."  And out smart the mask wearers. The tiger masks have some success.  There is an area where some type of harvesting is done in a forest type environment. Male harvesters wear a tiger mask on an optional basis. They learned that the masks initially work but the tigers figure out that they are fake. A theory on the tigers ability to determine the deception is that they watch the 'backward' knee action of the humans. Smart tigers.

 

I have cougar masks

[norseman]

You do? 

[Catmandoo]

Yes, cougar masks and I wear them. They are simple 'eye' masks.  Years ago, I used to walk on a fallen tree to get from a river bank to sandbars. There was cougar scat on each end of the 'tree bridge', flatter than a pancake.  I have been passed by a cougar while snowshoeing.  Been growled at when inspecting burrows but I think that it was a bobcat (momcat) and I was too close to a litter. 

Just checked some details on the "Sundarban tiger" of India.  Male harvesters work in mangrove forest environments to harvest fish, honey and wood. The ferocious Sundarban tiger is known to swim to boats and attack fishermen. Maybe the tigers think that  2-faced humans taste better.

 

I have been thinking about changing the cougar masks:  Guy Fawkes/ pet detective wig leftovers from Halloween.

Edited February 5, 2019 by Catmandoo
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[SWWASAS]

My close cougar encounter changed my cougar protocol should I have another.     That cougar was too close and too aggressive to fall back on "face the cougar and make yourself big"   theory of cougar defense.   It was not sufficiently afraid of me because of how it just walked off.    I had a gun on my hip and should have drawn it just in case.    I was so mesmerized by how beautiful and close it was I did not think of drawing the weapon.   As I mentioned a cougar in the same area was killed a few weeks later when it challenged an armed human.   I suspect it was the same one.    I was both dumb and lucky at the same time.   I guess that is a good combination to have together.