It's like watching a train wreck

[Huntster]

On 4/19/2022 at 9:15 AM, SWWASAS said:

.........When they encountered and examined the fish trap in the river I was concerned one would get beaned with a fist sized rock.      I suspect the fish trap was a valuable asset to the area BF who might be inclined to protect it.........

 

Fish trap? Those are illegal. Did they report it to Fish and Game? That's likely the only way to get them to look for sasquatches, if they think they can write a citation for an illegal act.

[Huntster]

6 hours ago, SWWASAS said:

........My guess is that at some point some gene turned on parts of the human brain that envisions constructs and making things.     Causing humans to diverge from BF if they had common ancestors.    Humans in some parts of the world took up agriculture fairly early and leaped ahead of hunter gatherers in developing technology and fixed settlements.      Agriculture enabled a more consistent food supply,  reduced the time dedicated to food gathering,   and allowed humans spare time to experiment and create.........

 

Unlike the written word and metalurgy, agriculture developed almost simultaneously and independently in both the new world and old world. Now what are the odds of that?

 

Quote

..........Even today the most primitive humans are those that are nearly full time hunter gatherers.     Perhaps BF is stuck in the hunter gatherer role and cannot break out of it..........

 

Alaska natives remain hunter/gatherers to this day, and vociferously defend that status politically. The main reason why they were never farmers (and have no intention to start) is because the climate makes farming difficult and risky. The reality, though, is that the northern farmer simply has to be selective on the crops and employ such tactics as raised beds and greenhouses. 

[norseman]

19 hours ago, ShadowBorn said:

No, bigfoot does not hide it's humanity well. It embraces it better then us. Those tools are those stones that are being thrown at people. Those are the tools of a hunter. That is the most primitive side of man.  How else can primitive man protect it's self.

 

I agree we have know idea what made that trap in that river and anything we say is just speculation. Yes, the Dr. is trying to stay away from the para normal side of things. But where are other researchers at in this point in time?  Are we any closer then we were when research first started? No. Even though that this program may be for entertainment.  It is showing that searching for these creatures is not easy. That we might have to have a open mind to knew ideas. 

 It embraces humanity better than us? By what definition do you apply that paradigm?

 

Homo Sapiens (humans) in Latin means “wise man” or “smart man”. 
 

Chimps throw rocks. Chimps are not human. Humans have gone to the moon, harnessed the atom and can replace human heart valves with pig heart valves. 
 

I feel like people have the romantic notion of the noble savage. But that’s all it is. It took a complete genus and multiple species living ridiculously hard existences in order to push us privileged few into the world that we enjoy today. 
 

I’m not belittling Chimps or any non human species. But there is a threshold that separates us from them. Bigfoot at this time doesn’t appear to be on our side of the threshold. That could very well change in the future, or it may not. They throw rocks…. Yes so do other great apes. Big deal. Show me a video of a Bigfoot sitting by a fire boiling tree sap so it can glue it’s flaked obsidian spear point onto a shaft. Show me a video of Bigfoot carrying a spear or hunting with it. How about a round rock secured to a forked shaft with sinew to make a club? Show me a Bigfoot camp that has a hearth, and has all the trappings of producing flaked tools, sinew, resin, shafts, etc.
 

This is what we would expect with a “primitive man”. I’ve never seen nor heard of any such behavior associated with Bigfoot.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[7.62]

1 hour ago, norseman said:

 It embraces humanity better than us? By what definition do you apply that paradigm?

 

Homo Sapiens (humans) in Latin means “wise man” or “smart man”. 
 

Chimps throw rocks. Chimps are not human. Humans have gone to the moon, harnessed the atom and can replace human heart valves with pig heart valves. 
 

I feel like people have the romantic notion of the noble savage. But that’s all it is. It took a complete genus and multiple species living ridiculously hard existences in order to push us privileged few into the world that we enjoy today. 
 

I’m not belittling Chimps or any non human species. But there is a threshold that separates us from them. Bigfoot at this time doesn’t appear to be on our side of the threshold. That could very well change in the future, or it may not. They throw rocks…. Yes so do other great apes. Big deal. Show me a video of a Bigfoot sitting by a fire boiling tree sap so it can glue it’s flaked obsidian spear point onto a shaft. Show me a video of Bigfoot carrying a spear or hunting with it. How about a round rock secured to a forked shaft with sinew to make a club? Show me a Bigfoot camp that has a hearth, and has all the trappings of producing flaked tools, sinew, resin, shafts, etc.
 

This is what we would expect with a “primitive man”. I’ve never seen nor heard of any such behavior associated with Bigfoot.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[norseman]

Ok back on track here. So what is this? Never heard of LiDAR being used before like this?

 

 

 

[72Malibu]

Lidar picking up a living, moving critter is interesting to say the least. I'm all ears on this.

 

Ronnie is the one that drives me nuts with his paranormal ideas. He starts talking how the shadow was walking, which watching it over and over I still do not see. I just see a shadow moving as a whole. Then he jumps to he could see a sloped head. Ronnie needs to get some help.

 

As for the rocks on the bluff and the fish trap. BF most likely would not kick a few rocks to roll down a steep embankment. He'd most likely throw them. And if you look closely at the fish trap, most those sticks are clean cut. Considering they appear to be just a mile or so from Vance Creek RR bridge, they are not far from 'civilization'. Fishtrap most likely made by campers.

[ShadowBorn]

19 hours ago, norseman said:

 It embraces humanity better than us? By what definition do you apply that paradigm?

It has done it by staying hidden. For such a large creature we should have had one on a slab by now. Especially with all the technology we have at our disposal. All we find are prints and sticks placed in patterns.  Yet, not one of us have been able to explain these creatures reasoning. Still they all seem to be surrounded around us humans as we search for them.

 

Yes , I watch this show and see how set up some of the things that go on this show. I see all the pink trail markers that have been placed on the branches.  I see when they get excited to every noise they hear. A lot of these noises can be explained. Any bigfoot show on tv is just going to be entertainment.

 

In my world and I am talking about on how I see these things from my point of view. I see them as very primitive man would be if knowledge was never given to man. Do you believe the knowledge that we have gained was just gained on our own? Something gave us knowledge to get us started. My speculation is that these creatures refused that knowledge. They felt it important to live primitive.  In my view of these creatures, they are the ones who truly live free.

 

It is us who seem to be the ones who have lost that freedom. We are the ones who are confined by the knowledge that we have gained. If all these things like cell phones, cars, tv's and even our own homes was taken from us. How would us humans live with out those material things.

 

We use guns and bows, they use rocks and bare hands to hunt.  Their knowledge of the forest is way more superior then ours. We cannot even compare to the way that they are capable of being ninjas out in our forest.

 

As it stands right now for me in that area of their research EB. That whole area has already been contaminated. The day they sprayed all that chimp/ape hormone. What ever animal that has went through that area has already spread that hormone through out the forest. So that makes every edna highly suspect. The shadow figure is also some thing that is hard to explain. But it was some thing that was not in the water or we would have seen the ripples in the river. That trap in the river is highly suspect to it being done by a human. Otherwise we be finding more of these traps else where. What ever was on that ledge gave away it's position and did not throw rocks at them. 

 

Now with Russel, If I knew that I had a creature that was above me show up as a shadow on the camera . I would have found a way to climb out of there and search for it or it's prints.  I love the show and the people that are on the show. It does make me wonder if the show is running them for entertainment. 

 

It would be great if we could use that lidar like we use sonar to find these creatures. The military has been working on some type of cloaking device. So if these creatures do cloak which I believe they do. Then lidar would be the tool to use in the field. What I like about EB is the tools that they are testing in the field. The EMF meter worked well. I enjoy the the tech stuff. If I could afford them I be using them myself..

[norseman]

2 hours ago, ShadowBorn said:

It has done it by staying hidden. For such a large creature we should have had one on a slab by now. Especially with all the technology we have at our disposal. All we find are prints and sticks placed in patterns.  Yet, not one of us have been able to explain these creatures reasoning. Still they all seem to be surrounded around us humans as we search for them.

 

Yes , I watch this show and see how set up some of the things that go on this show. I see all the pink trail markers that have been placed on the branches.  I see when they get excited to every noise they hear. A lot of these noises can be explained. Any bigfoot show on tv is just going to be entertainment.

 

In my world and I am talking about on how I see these things from my point of view. I see them as very primitive man would be if knowledge was never given to man. Do you believe the knowledge that we have gained was just gained on our own? Something gave us knowledge to get us started. My speculation is that these creatures refused that knowledge. They felt it important to live primitive.  In my view of these creatures, they are the ones who truly live free.

 

It is us who seem to be the ones who have lost that freedom. We are the ones who are confined by the knowledge that we have gained. If all these things like cell phones, cars, tv's and even our own homes was taken from us. How would us humans live with out those material things.

 

We use guns and bows, they use rocks and bare hands to hunt.  Their knowledge of the forest is way more superior then ours. We cannot even compare to the way that they are capable of being ninjas out in our forest.

 

As it stands right now for me in that area of their research EB. That whole area has already been contaminated. The day they sprayed all that chimp/ape hormone. What ever animal that has went through that area has already spread that hormone through out the forest. So that makes every edna highly suspect. The shadow figure is also some thing that is hard to explain. But it was some thing that was not in the water or we would have seen the ripples in the river. That trap in the river is highly suspect to it being done by a human. Otherwise we be finding more of these traps else where. What ever was on that ledge gave away it's position and did not throw rocks at them. 

 

Now with Russel, If I knew that I had a creature that was above me show up as a shadow on the camera . I would have found a way to climb out of there and search for it or it's prints.  I love the show and the people that are on the show. It does make me wonder if the show is running them for entertainment. 

 

It would be great if we could use that lidar like we use sonar to find these creatures. The military has been working on some type of cloaking device. So if these creatures do cloak which I believe they do. Then lidar would be the tool to use in the field. What I like about EB is the tools that they are testing in the field. The EMF meter worked well. I enjoy the the tech stuff. If I could afford them I be using them myself..

Your proving my point. How would humans live without our material things? We wouldn’t! And that’s the whole point! This is what separates humans from other species. Other Homo species never reached our level of sophistication. But they still packed around material goods. 

 

Staying hidden does not make something human. Otherwise we would include Cougars and Snow Leopards as humans. We don’t. We just found a new species of Orangutan that was “hidden” from science. That doesn’t make them human either. 
 

Primitive humans with fire and tool making would be much easier to track and find in the forest than Bigfoot. 

[ShadowBorn]

47 minutes ago, norseman said:

 

Staying hidden does not make something human

True, Staying hidden does not make you Human. But what does it really mean to be human now, then from the past. It does make you wonder how we gained this knowledge that we have today. The same goes to these creatures why they would visit camp sites with fire. Are these creatures in that learning stage? Really, They might not make fire or have shelter. But they are very curious around us.  

 

They throw rocks at us but never mean to hit us. I have never heard of no one getting hurt by these rock throws. Except for some old timers past reports. There no warning signs by the gov. that says beware of danger Bigfoot. 

 

I really do wish this show success. I do hope they find the answer that they are looking for. I truly hope that there is no hoaxing being done on the crew of the show. I do miss mountain monsters since there is very funny. I hope they bring them back so I can get some laughs. 

[norseman]

1 hour ago, ShadowBorn said:

True, Staying hidden does not make you Human. But what does it really mean to be human now, then from the past. It does make you wonder how we gained this knowledge that we have today. The same goes to these creatures why they would visit camp sites with fire. Are these creatures in that learning stage? Really, They might not make fire or have shelter. But they are very curious around us.  

 

They throw rocks at us but never mean to hit us. I have never heard of no one getting hurt by these rock throws. Except for some old timers past reports. There no warning signs by the gov. that says beware of danger Bigfoot. 

 

I really do wish this show success. I do hope they find the answer that they are looking for. I truly hope that there is no hoaxing being done on the crew of the show. I do miss mountain monsters since there is very funny. I hope they bring them back so I can get some laughs. 

I feel like we are talking in circles.

 

I have no idea what Bigfoot is. All I can do is provide conjecture on peoples observations, photo and video. It’s all very much all still in the air.

 

What’s not conjecture is the genus Homo and what science has found in the fossil record attributed to our genus in roughly 2.6 million years of our existence. I’m not saying that we know everything there is to know. But there are plenty of bipedal primate species who are extinct that did not get into the genus Homo. Because of said attributes that I have been talking about. 
 

Boiled down to brass tacks? Bigfoot does not seem to exhibit the qualifications to belong in the genus Homo. I didn’t make the qualifications, science did. And I’m not saying this based on me being pro kill. Science will need two type specimens for this species just as it has required it for every species that has been cataloged. One male and one female. Genus Homo or not. Full stop. 
 

Maybe they make stone tools and hunt with them, but we have never observed it? In which case things may change in the future. I’m totally open to being wrong. I’m just not going to budge on what science has laid out before us. It gives us reference points. Otherwise we are just blowing in the wind.
 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo

[Huntster]

5 hours ago, norseman said:

.......Boiled down to brass tacks? Bigfoot does not seem to exhibit the qualifications to belong in the genus Homo. I didn’t make the qualifications, science did.........

 

And they did a poor job of it. From your reference:

 

Quote

.........Even today, the genus Homo has not been strictly defined.[16][17][18] Since the early human fossil record began to slowly emerge from the earth, the boundaries and definitions of the genus Homo have been poorly defined and constantly in flux.........

 

Frankly, if they "talk" to each other, they're human, whether or not they manufacture or use tools. Remember, "In the beginning was the Word..........."

[FelixTheCat]

On 4/3/2022 at 9:58 PM, 7.62 said:

 

I can't stop watching expedition Bigfoot but the show has jumped the shark .

 

Another show that want's to be like Mountain Monsters but with a doctor as a cast member .

 

WHAT WAS THAT !  WHAT IS THAT  !  DID  YOU HEAR THAT !

 

Should be a drinking game for that show .  Take a shot everytime a cast member says it ..

I like watching the show as well.  But it's Hollywood, and so much of it pushes the bigfoot falsehoods of the past.

A shy and elusive bigfoot doesn't sell movie tickets, but a dangerous predator, or a rogue character, sells plenty

of movie tickets.  Also, after interacting with these intelligences for over 10 years, I realize that you don't have to

go off on distant hikes with big camera crews.  

All they have to do is to go camping, have a campfire, sit around and talk to each other, ignore the forest, and the

forest beings will come to them.  They will usually start tossing stones by them, or break sticks at opportune times.

No need to repel down a cliff, or walk around blindly at night. or forge a river, or climb a mountain.  Just find a secluded

area with access to water, and set up a camp.  But that is boring, and doesn't make for good television.

Also, bigfoot are empathic, and they prefer to be around happy, good natured people, just my opinion.

Fear is not a good attractant for the forest beings, in fact it is a repellent, because fear it what gives rise to

hate, jealousy, violence and other bad things.

 

 

 

 

 

[wiiawiwb]

7 hours ago, FelixTheCat said:

All they have to do is to go camping, have a campfire, sit around and talk to each other, ignore the forest, and the

forest beings will come to them. 

 

If that is the formula for success, why hasn't there been more success? Just about every backpacker does exactly what you describe. I know as I'm one of them.

[FelixTheCat]

3 hours ago, wiiawiwb said:

 

If that is the formula for success, why hasn't there been more success? Just about every backpacker does exactly what you describe. I know as I'm one of them.

Well, I guess location is important.  We also see stories of backpackers fleeing an area.

[norseman]

13 hours ago, Huntster said:

 

And they did a poor job of it. From your reference:

 

 

Frankly, if they "talk" to each other, they're human, whether or not they manufacture or use tools. Remember, "In the beginning was the Word..........."

A poor job? I think science should be commended for what its pulled out of the ground. Look at those little girls squeezing through the cave to get to Homo Naledi fossils! Yes. There will be some sparks flying over how new species are categorized. 

 

 

I don't think we can draw the line at speech.