2023 Urban Bigfoot, Seriously?

[Incorrigible1]

2 hours ago, georgerm said:

• Get a kit from Amazon

  

   

Click image to open expanded view

 

 

 

Long since debunked and actively discouraged by medical authorities.

However, Coughlan would love to sell you one.

[Incorrigible1]

The most important steps following a bite are:

1. Arrange to get to the hospital as quickly as possible. That may mean calling a friend or 911. Definitely call 911 for any serious symptoms. Do not drive yourself.
2. Remove any constrictive clothing and jewelry.
3. Elevate the affected extremity (please see the article explaining why we elevate). Absolutely DO NOT place the affected extremity below heart level.
4. Take a picture of the snake IF YOU CAN DO IT QUICKLY AND SAFELY. It is helpful but not necessary. DO NOT bring the snake, whether dead or alive.
5. DO NOT do any of the following: tourniquets, lymphatic bandage, pressure immobilization, cut and suck, extraction device, electrical stimulation, packing the extremity in ice.

The following articles outline proper snakebite management in a pre-hospital environment: https://btgsp.com/en-us/insights/don-t-just-do-something-stand-there

https://wsed.org/snakebite-management-pre-hospital/

This is a good summary of snakebite positioning: https://medium.com/natural-world/how-to-position-a-snakebite-9430fc988af

 

 

Here are the most important steps to be taken in-hospital:

1. Keep the affected extremity elevated.
2. Make sure they check the following laboratory tests: CBC, BMP, PT/INR, Fibrinogen, CK.
3. Ask them what their indications for antivenom are, and make sure they are consistent with what we have mentioned here.
4. If you do not feel you're getting appropriate care, advocate for yourself. Request they involve an expert. If necessary, request transfer to a more appropriate facility.
5. Do not agree to prophylactic antibiotics or prophylactic surgical intervention.

Please see the following articles describing proper in-hospital snakebite management for additional information:

Part 1: https://btgsp.com/en-us/insights/so-you-went-out-and-got-yourself-snakebitten-now-w

Part 2: https://btgsp.com/en-us/insights/so,-you-went-out-and-got-yourself-snake-bitten-now

https://wsed.org/snakebite-management-in-hospital-pit-vipers/

Edited April 21, 2023 by Incorrigible1

[wiiawiwb]

The important steps are important until they're not. There is absolutely no chance I'm abiding by Numero Uno following a bite. That recommendation works beautifully if I was bitten in my backyard or at the local town park where help is but minutes away. Where I go sasquatching, I'm always under the canopy of trees so a helicopter is not rescuing me. Moreover, there is no cell service at my location nor where the car is parked so I'm not able to call anyone to quickly explain my predicament.

 

If I'm 2 hours in from the car over terrain that isn't always easy to maneuver that means it's probably close to a 4-hour carry out on a stetcher.

 

That's after the time it takes for:

 

1) Help to mobilize

2) Help to get to my car

3) Help to spend more than 2 hours trying to find then get to my location.

 

Once bitten, I'll take my chances and move as swiftly as I can to get back to the car and hope that help can access me along the way or on my way towards the hospital. Meanwhile, I would have immediately activated my InReach and sent a pre-recorded quick message that says I've been bitten by a rattlesnake. I will trigger my InReach SOS to begin satellite text messaging to communicate my condition as I'm heading back. If ever I feel I will lose consciousness during the process, I will trigger my PLB.

 

I was a member of a SAR group and know there are precious seconds that can fritter away in steps 1-3 above. Those who chose to take the conventional approach will live with whatever the outcome is knowing they waited and hoped while their sands of fate slipped quickly away in the hour glass.

 

YMMV

 

 

 

Edited April 21, 2023 by wiiawiwb

[bipedalist]

Packing ice on skin probably a no-no but if you can cool the area down with a wrapped fabric ice pack like with ace bandange that will help

vasoconstrict the area with elevation to keep venom from free-flowing as much especially if it is a very warm or tropical environment.  They are

just trying to keep people from aggravating the situation with ice and direct contact of such on skin is my understanding.  If I am wrong then a 

medical person should speak up. You are more likely to get hurt avoiding and evading with sudden surprise such as an orthopedic injury through fall in montane environments with snakes than getting bit unless you are climbing rock ledges and probing such with hands, arms, feet and legs. Snake boots would be much too constrictive in the areas I hike, but low tops would not work well at all off trail especially unless you like to load up your socks and soles of them with dirt, rocks and leaf litter. 

Edited April 21, 2023 by bipedalist

[Huntster]

4 hours ago, wiiawiwb said:

.......That recommendation works beautifully if I was bitten in my backyard or at the local town park where help is but minutes away.........If I'm 2 hours in from the car over terrain that isn't always easy to maneuver that means it's probably close to a 4-hour carry out on a stetcher..........Once bitten, I'll take my chances and move as swiftly as I can to get back to the car and hope that help can access me along the way or on my way towards the hospital.........

 

I was bitten by a tiny rattler that I stepped on barefooted when I was 16 years old. We had just finished hiking six miles up a river canyon and set up camp. No commo. I knew it was imperative to walk out immediately. I was in pretty bad shape when we got to the car, and my girlfriend (never driven before, especially a muscle car with a four speed) almost killed us both on that mountain road in just the very few additional miles to the ranger station. The staff there got me to the hospital another 20 miles or so away.

 

But my foot was saved. Anti-venom is the salvation we have that so many in the third world don't.

[Twist]

Stay safe guys!  All this talk makes me glad I live in Michigan.  

[georgerm]

On 4/21/2023 at 6:52 AM, Huntster said:

 

I was bitten by a tiny rattler that I stepped on barefooted when I was 16 years old. We had just finished hiking six miles up a river canyon and set up camp. No commo. I knew it was imperative to walk out immediately. I was in pretty bad shape when we got to the car, and my girlfriend (never driven before, especially a muscle car with a four speed) almost killed us both on that mountain road in just the very few additional miles to the ranger station. The staff there got me to the hospital another 20 miles or so away.

 

But my foot was saved. Anti-venom is the salvation we have that so many in the third world don't.

Did your leg swell up and turn black and blue?

 

On 4/20/2023 at 11:01 PM, Incorrigible1 said:

The most important steps following a bite are:

1. Arrange to get to the hospital as quickly as possible. That may mean calling a friend or 911. Definitely call 911 for any serious symptoms. Do not drive yourself.
2. Remove any constrictive clothing and jewelry.
3. Elevate the affected extremity (please see the article explaining why we elevate). Absolutely DO NOT place the affected extremity below heart level.
4. Take a picture of the snake IF YOU CAN DO IT QUICKLY AND SAFELY. It is helpful but not necessary. DO NOT bring the snake, whether dead or alive.
5. DO NOT do any of the following: tourniquets, lymphatic bandage, pressure immobilization, cut and suck, extraction device, electrical stimulation, packing the extremity in ice.

The following articles outline proper snakebite management in a pre-hospital environment: https://btgsp.com/en-us/insights/don-t-just-do-something-stand-there

https://wsed.org/snakebite-management-pre-hospital/

This is a good summary of snakebite positioning: https://medium.com/natural-world/how-to-position-a-snakebite-9430fc988af

 

 

Here are the most important steps to be taken in-hospital:

1. Keep the affected extremity elevated.
2. Make sure they check the following laboratory tests: CBC, BMP, PT/INR, Fibrinogen, CK.
3. Ask them what their indications for antivenom are, and make sure they are consistent with what we have mentioned here.
4. If you do not feel you're getting appropriate care, advocate for yourself. Request they involve an expert. If necessary, request transfer to a more appropriate facility.
5. Do not agree to prophylactic antibiotics or prophylactic surgical intervention.

Please see the following articles describing proper in-hospital snakebite management for additional information:

Part 1: https://btgsp.com/en-us/insights/so-you-went-out-and-got-yourself-snakebitten-now-w

Part 2: https://btgsp.com/en-us/insights/so,-you-went-out-and-got-yourself-snake-bitten-now

https://wsed.org/snakebite-management-in-hospital-pit-vipers/

How long can you go without antivenom after a rattlesnake bite?

 

 

Ideally, you'll reach medical help within 30 minutes of being bitten. If the bite is left untreated, your bodily functions will break down over a period of 2 or 3 days and the bite may result in severe organ damage or death. 

 

Crofab is an antivenom  Better have insurance! 

Two summers ago, a 17-year-old was bitten by a copperhead snake in Hillsborough. His hand started to swell immediately, and he had to be hospitalized overnight, The News & Observer reported at the time. The family got the Duke Health bill a few weeks later for $225,000. The antivenom alone cost $200,000. Thankfully, with his father’s insurance, the family only had to pay $175. Why is antivenom so expensive? We talked to Duke Health and UNC Health to learn how much it costs at their hospitals. HOW MUCH DOES SNAKE ANTIVENOM COST? The N&O spoke with UNC Health and Duke Health for answers: ▪ At UNC Health: For a typical initial dose of four to six vials, the total charge for the antivenom treatment can range from $76,000 to $115,000, UNC Health’s pharmacy team said through local news director Alan Wolf.

Read more at: https://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/article262240987.html#storylink=cpy

 

 

3 DOSAGE FORMS AND STRENGTHS CROFAB is available as a sterile, nonpyrogenic, ............

 

C. atrox (Western Diamondback rattlesnake) 1270 C.  (dosage)

adamanteus (Eastern Diamondback rattlesnake) 420 C.

scutulatus (Mojave rattlesnake) 5570

A. piscivorus (Cottonmouth or Water Moccasin) 780 *

 

 

 

 

[Rockape]

**WARNING - DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME**

 

 

My grandfather, who was born in 1903 and this was when he was a teenager and into his early 20's, used to catch catfish by what he called "grappling". It when you reach under crevices, rocks, logs etc.  in the river and pull the catfish out by hand as I'm sure many are familiar with. He swore he had been bitten dozens of times by moccasins and "all you have to do is hold your hand under water and it will draw the poison out".

 

Now personally, I think they just got lucky and were never bitten by a venomous snake. These guys were tough as nails and they lived so far out in the sticks you would have probably died before you made it to a doctor, and anti-venom wasn't even in use in those days anyway, so maybe they figured nothing from nothing leaves nothing.

 

Either way, no way in hell I'm doing that. I'm getting to a hospital as fast as I can.

[Incorrigible1]

Yeah, it's extremely common for people to mistake non-venomous water snakes with cotton mouths.

 

I've heard the physical catfishing method as "noodling."

[Huntster]

4 hours ago, georgerm said:

Did your leg swell up and turn black and blue?...........

 

Horribly. They had to cut my boot off. My lower leg and foot were black. I was on my back for a few weeks, and on crutches for a few months. If I remember correctly, the entire healing process took over a year. But I've had lots of joint injuries that took a year to three years for complete healing. Indeed, my left elbow right now is still healing from an injury that occurred in my sleep!

[georgerm]

On 4/20/2023 at 8:13 PM, Incorrigible1 said:

Long since debunked. 

Sounds like lots of home made methods  don't work.

[Incorrigible1]

5 hours ago, georgerm said:

Sounds like lots of home made methods  don't work.

Tourniquets, suction cups, and cutting of flesh are to be discouraged.

[norseman]

49 minutes ago, Incorrigible1 said:

Tourniquets, suction cups, and cutting of flesh are to be discouraged.

Reminds me of the joke of the two hunters and one gets bit in the nether region. Upon finally reaching cell phone service with his buddy writhing in agony he talks to 911. They tell him to cut between the fang marks and suck out the poison. When he reaches his buddy, his buddy asks him what they said….

 

You are gonna die! Was the answer…🤣🤣🤣

[gigantor]

I hate snakes.

[Huntster]

2 hours ago, gigantor said:

I hate snakes.

 

Environmentalists discourage the killing of venomous snakes. They say that they have their place on Earth. They help keep balance on rodents. Etc, etc, et al.

 

I kill every one I see. Let other creatures flourish and fill the niche that venomous snakes now live within. Admittedly, I fear them so much that I don't go to places where they live, specifically because if they're around, I'll find them. If I go to Arizona, I do it December-February..........yeah, I hate heat almost as much as I hare snakes.