Guest Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 We don't shoot at monsters, so I'd say zero.
Guest poignant Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 (edited) Drew: If you critically review the whole situation and whatever public info released by Bipto and the TBRC, you'll realize that there are really only two options worth considering: 1. That Bipto and TBRC are conspiring and fabricating an elaborate hoax, giving anecdotes of shots fired, rock throwing, sighting accounts, etc etc. 2. That they are sincere and genuine in their efforts in tracking and obtaining a specimen and have been observing a species of intelligent, reclusive, forest primate. Now I am in no position to falsify OR verify their claims, so all I can do is wish them well and hope they come up with more evidence to share with the rest of us. Edited September 25, 2012 by poignant
Guest Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 There are TBRC members intent on collecting a specimen, yes. There's no litmus test with regard to this within the group, but the overwhelming majority of members (perhaps all) think the best and most productive next step in the study of this species and the conservation of their habitat is the presentation of a voucher specimen. All members present know this is a possibility whether or not they personally are prepared to take such an action. Bipto- So, It is known that the TBRC is a pro-kill mindset( all be it for the name of verification and protection ) so my question to your organization is-- what steps if any have you taken to ,say, present your type specimen/ study section to your state legislators for protection recommendations, or are you going to pursue those avenues.
Drew Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 Drew: If you critically review the whole situation and whatever public info released by Bipto and the TBRC, you'll realize that there are really only two options worth considering: 1. That Bipto and TBRC are conspiring and fabricating an elaborate hoax, giving anecdotes of shots fired, rock throwing, sighting accounts, etc etc. 2. That they are sincere and genuine in their efforts in tracking and obtaining a specimen and have been observing a species of intelligent, reclusive, forest primate. Now I am in no position to falsify OR verify their claims, so all I can do is wish them well and hope they come up with more evidence to share with the rest of us. Well, I would be more inclined to add a 3rd possibility, that some of the group is conspiring with hoaxers, and the others are being fooled into thinking this is a real thing. I hope for example, that the apes only present themselves to members of the group they know are going to miss. In other words, Apes A & B approach, Operation Member X, knowing that Member X is not going to blast them. Member X typically 'shoots at the apes' when others aren't around. The idea that the beasts are too dedicated, is silly, here you have people out in the woods for 5-6 months, every day, looking for the Bigfoot, but a hoaxer tricking the bigfooter can't show that kind of dedication? It could be really fun for them.
Guest Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 Well I've been lurking for a long time and this whole "Operation Persistance" has really been a treat to read and encouraged me make my first post. Many thanks to Bipto, it seems surreal that we're getting this level of access. I absolutely love the bigfoot show as well. I've never really listened to anything bigfoot related before, aside from what we see on TV, but you guys have really elevated my obssesion with the big man. Im listening to your show all day at work, albeit in reverse order.. Being from Canada, I must say Im little surprised about you saying to avoid all Canadian DNA labs, although Im sure you were just joking around. Most of all I just hope you guys get the proof we all want to see. As excited as I am/was about the Ketchum report, Im putting all my marbles in the TBRC's boat at this point. You guys really seem like you have a good thing going on over there. Question for you though Bipto, how close do you think you guys are to blowing this thing wide open? Do you see an end to the research coming at any point soon? And if so will the conclusion be definitive proof? Or, in your opinion, is the only way we get to that conclusion a dead sasquatch, and in which case its anyones guess when that happens.
Guest Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 (edited) ... my question to your organization is-- what steps if any have you taken to ,say, present your type specimen/ study section to your state legislators for protection recommendations, or are you going to pursue those avenues. We have spent a lot of time planning for this contingency, but I'm not going to lay it all out here. The idea that the beasts are too dedicated, is silly, here you have people out in the woods for 5-6 months, every day, looking for the Bigfoot, but a hoaxer tricking the bigfooter can't show that kind of dedication? It could be really fun for them. You're not making any kind of sense. Seriously. But whatever. Being from Canada, I must say Im little surprised about you saying to avoid all Canadian DNA labs, although Im sure you were just joking around. I was. Question for you though Bipto, how close do you think you guys are to blowing this thing wide open? I think every time we go in there, we have a chance to collect the specimen. Every time. It could literally happen at any moment, but there are lots of things can go wrong in these kinds of situations. You need a clear shot, you need the time to take that shot, you need to have the right guy getting the chance. Eventually, it's all going to click and happen. It's just a matter of time, IMO. Do you see an end to the research coming at any point soon? And if so will the conclusion be definitive proof? We're not going anywhere. Absent some external event beyond our control that changes the situation, we'll ge there as long as it takes. Or, in your opinion, is the only way we get to that conclusion a dead sasquatch, and in which case its anyones guess when that happens My personal opinion (and the opinion of many others both in and out of the TBRC) is that a voucher specimen is the only way to prove the animal. We are collecting other types of evidence (see the hair sample article on our site, for example), but nothing short of a specimen is going to do the trick. As you say, when that happens is anyone's guess and depends on many things happening in just the right way. Edited September 25, 2012 by bipto
Cotter Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 ^ May as well consider that you are dealing with an underground lab Dr. Moreau'ing all sorts of weird ape-like creatures. Has that been considered? /sarcasm/
Guest poignant Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 Well, I would be more inclined to add a 3rd possibility, that some of the group is conspiring with hoaxers, and the others are being fooled into thinking this is a real thing. I hope for example, that the apes only present themselves to members of the group they know are going to miss. In other words, Apes A & B approach, Operation Member X, knowing that Member X is not going to blast them. Member X typically 'shoots at the apes' when others aren't around. The idea that the beasts are too dedicated, is silly, here you have people out in the woods for 5-6 months, every day, looking for the Bigfoot, but a hoaxer tricking the bigfooter can't show that kind of dedication? It could be really fun for them.
Guest Strick Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 I should qualify the following statement by stating that I don't believe in ghosts and have no particular interest in the paranormal nor ideological axe to grind re: EVP, or whatever it's called these days, BUT...... If you leave an audio recorder running recording empty space you get voices. Period. I'm not getting all spooky and "woo", that's just how it is. I did it a few times as a teenager and it freaked me out, so I've not done it since. Course, this was the 80's, so we are talking about analogue recordings on cassette tape, but from what I've heard things haven't changed much in the digital age. You don't have to have a séance or ask questions like Josh Gates, but you get voices, that's all I know - and the voices sound a lot like the one purportedly saying "get back" on Bipto's recording... Could be artifacts on the tape or drive, I don't know I'm not an esotericist and I don't believe in spirits that communicate with the living.... So, I think what we have here is not a wood ape that can speak English, nor a TBRC guy having a nightmare or hoaxers, just one of those weird and scary little voices of unknown origin that reliably turn up on sound recorders for unexplained reasons.
Guest Suesquach Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 Bipto I just want to thank you for being so available and answering all these questions with class! This is a wonderful and exciting thread. IMO I believe what you and others in the TBRC are seeing and experiencing. Please keep us posted on the TBRC adventures!
Guest Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 The idea that the beasts are too dedicated, is silly, here you have people out in the woods for 5-6 months, every day, looking for the Bigfoot, but a hoaxer tricking the bigfooter can't show that kind of dedication? It could be really fun for them. I want to violate rule 1A SO BADLY right now! Seriously? Who would invest that sort of effort? The idea that members within the group are conspiring with hoaxers is so unrealistic. What would the motivation be? "It could be fun?" Who grows up obsessed with hoaxing bigfooters? Where's the payoff? Even the nastiest, most bitter posters over at JREF would have posted videos or something by now. In stifling heat and humidity, how would they outrun TBRC members in a friggen costume? Anyone who would even consider going out there in a costume (even if they could withstand the temperature) would be INCREDIBLY STUPID to try this. One of the more frustrating things about this thread is that even many of the people who are reasonably certain that "Bigfoot" exists in the wilderness across the continent, still want to accuse them of hoaxing. Is it jealousy? Are there Sasquatch? If there are, they have to be somewhere. Why not Area X? If I were to join the TBRC and be allowed to participate in these operations, and I were to even suspect that they were somehow hoaxing (which is absurd)....I would be furious beyond reason. Everybody in the world would know that things were not being truthfully accounted. How would a member not come forward by now if this were the case?
Guest Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 So, I think what we have here is not a wood ape that can speak English, nor a TBRC guy having a nightmare or hoaxers, just one of those weird and scary little voices of unknown origin that reliably turn up on sound recorders for unexplained reasons. Since our guys didn't hear what was on the tape until after the fact, I can't say for certain that you're wrong. However, at other times, we have heard the chatter/gibberish sounds.
Drew Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 We shall see who is the Fail here. Bigfoot is hoaxing, hoaxing is Bigfoot. Whether it is as simple as embellishing a story to get pats on the back from the Bigfoot investigator, or writing a book about a friendly Bigfoot that opens cans of beans, or fabricating a costume with possum guts, or filming a guy in the riverbed with a costume, it is all part of the Bigfoot thing. In this case, the hoax is on the participants perhaps, or maybe the entire story is made up, but I will go on the record to say it isn't a Wood Ape, Apes are not part of Bigfooting, Hoaxing is, look at the history of Bigfoot, it is one continuous hoax timeline. The only other consistent thing, is that there are no Bigfoots produced, ever.
Guest Cervelo Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 One thing I can tell you about my limited recording experience is if you have a high end cable and mic set up, you will pickup things on the recording that you don't hear in person. But if you don't you will get a lot of garbage that is easily misinterpreted. If you need help with this contact Stan Courtney he is the master of all things audio!!
southernyahoo Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 I should qualify the following statement by stating that I don't believe in ghosts and have no particular interest in the paranormal nor ideological axe to grind re: EVP, or whatever it's called these days, BUT...... So, I think what we have here is not a wood ape that can speak English, nor a TBRC guy having a nightmare or hoaxers, just one of those weird and scary little voices of unknown origin that reliably turn up on sound recorders for unexplained reasons. Ok you got me, what is it? Audio Pareidolia? But wait a minute........ Since our guys didn't hear what was on the tape until after the fact, I can't say for certain that you're wrong. However, at other times, we have heard the chatter/gibberish sounds. It's not just happening when we listen to the recordings....................
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