Hoaxes, Hoaxers, Frauds, And Con-Men In The Bigfoot Community

[Guest Cervelo]

After reading Cervelo's post about the squirrels throwing rocks at him. I think squirrels should be added to the list. How many people have thought BF was throwing rocks at them, when it was actually squirrels. Probably a big joke in the squirrel community, "let's go make the humans think Bigfoot is throwing rocks at them".

You obviously didn't read the whole post and/or watch the vid....but I will say if I had made a different type of commentary, I could be on this list

[Guest Kerchak]

I posted this in the Tarpit version, but I think that Bob H. has to be on this list by definition. If he's lying about being in the Patty suit then he's committing fraud related to a BF incident. If he's telling the truth, then he was willing participant in a hoax.

Either way he's a fraud or hoaxer.

Yes he's a definite. As I said in the other thread it's 100% proven he's not telling the truth. There is absolutely no doubt whatsoever about this.

Even without bringing the actual PGF hoax claim into it, Bob H repeatedly tried to fool people by claiming the first time he worked with Roger Patterson was when Patterson asked him (via Gimlin) to be Patty in late summer 1967.......eve though it's a proven fact that Bob H was playing a cowboy in Roger Patterson's abandoned bigfoot 'movie' from much earlier that year in May. A proven fact that Bob H tried to hide.

Phil Morris is also definitely one for the list. An attention seeking fraudster. He even advertises the 'Patty suit' as being on display in his museum. If that is not a fraud, what is?

[Guest]

All the names/incidents listed have some form of hoaxing associated with them or attributed to them.

Which is not the same as them being proven hoaxers as demonstrated by specific and conclusive evidence.

I would like to say something about this topic.

RayG has stated his intention for starting this topic. He has also added a disclaimer stating that it isn't an official BFF stance or the opinion of the staff, which it isn't. Although he is a staff member, RayG is also a member, and as a member he has the right to post this topic. Nowhere in our rules does it state that the staff can't have an opinion or be skeptical. RayG has presented his opinion and evidence for discussion just as numerous other members - skeptical and proponent alike - have done.

I have watched RayG step up to serve all of the forum members, regardless of their stance on the subject. He has been both fair and diligent in his duties. While his topic might not be popular with some, it is nonetheless an allowable topic on our forum according to the rules.

I will second that. It's no secret that I'll tear into RayG's posts when I feel the need, but I haven't had any issues with his Modding that I haven't had with other Mods, so I'd say he's been generally even-handed.

They all deserve to be on that list until we get 100% confirmation.....From conclusive evidence, Not personal belief.. Then you may sort the genuine from the fake.

I'm sorry, but it doesn't work that way. Innocent until PROVEN guilty. By conclusive evidence, not personal belief, not hearsay.

Green: "I did not start collecting Sasquatch information until 1957. Prior to that all I did was include a made-up Sasquatch story in a 1955 April Fool edition of my paper."

So now a simple April Fool's joke makes one a hoaxer, huh? Man you guys are really stretching.

Like Mr Fantastic playing Twister...

I agree completely with RayG. All those people have at least been on the periphery of some controversy.

Which does not = proof of hoaxing.

But isn't that like someone saying they've never been in a car accident as long as they didn't cause the accident? Green isn't hoaxing now, but he hoaxed then.

April Fool's Day papers are well known for their made up stories. It's not a hoax if no one either presents it as a hoax or is going to be taking it seriously to begin with.

To say otherwise would be no more valid than accusing anyone who ever appeared on "Liar's Club" of being a liar in real life.

Suspicions, accusations, and sour grapes that were recorded as written correspondence and referenced in a book about bigfoot.

Oh well...writing it down makes all the difference...

But it wasn't just Byrne. It was also Edward W. Killam, Isadore Hanken, Laymond Hardy, Thomas L. Kimball, and Edward J. Lehman.

Were you aware of any of this before this thread?

RayG

So guilt or innocence is a matter of how many people accuse a person?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day-care_sex-abuse_hysteria

[Guest Theagenes]

How about the Minnesota Iceman guy?

[Guest ajciani]

It would be good to be a little more specific in the list, and limit hoaxing to actual attempts at creating an incident or evidence and passing it off as bigfoot. It is OK to call out people or groups for other bigfoot-related scams. When so much about bigfooting is based on character, poor character means a lot. Everything should be limited to facts in evidence, and preferably linked or cited. Digest pages are good, but there is no reason to completely re-list them, especially for poorly known incidents from the 1970's.

Hoaxing Incidents

Agawan, Massachusetts, 1977

Mission, BC Bus Hoax, 1977

Shiawassee County, Michigan 'Hairy Creature' Hoax of 1978

Stillwell, Oklahoma 1977

And miscellaneous other known hoaxes at Bigfoot Encounters site.

Elbe Trackway, 2012

A long trackway of some 200+ prints. Uncovered as hoax by BFRO members.

Notable Hoaxed videos

Gable Films

A couple of films released in 2007 and 2009. The first supposedly 8mm film taken by a vacationer first filming and then being attacked by a "dog man". The second supposedly 8mm film of the police investigation. Admitted as a hoax in the final episode of MonsterQuest.

Penn & Teller's Sonoma Hoax

Although not a "hoax" in a traditional sense, in 2005, the cable television show, Penn & Teller's (rest of title cannot be posted), filmed an actor in a bigfoot costume, and showed the video around to some prominent bigfoot research groups. According to P&T, the hook was bit, hard, but the show never revealed the identities of the groups who proclaimed the video to be compelling evidence. According to P&T, an offer to purchase the video was made. The offer price stated by P&T coincided with a value that was being promoted by a well known person associated with a well-known bigfoot research organization that has a four letter acronym.

Notable Hoaxers

Dickens, Ray

Kimberley, Kevin

Marx, Ivan

Pirello, Chayse

Sohl, John

Sweeten, Danny

And miscellaneous other known hoaxers at Bigfoot Encounters site.

Tenley, Randy Lee

RIP. You know it had to happen. Texting and driving and bigfoot hoaxing don't mix well. Poor guy, hit by two teenage girls. Randy Lee Tenley deserves his own special place in bigfoot hoaxing. Hopefully, no one else will join him.

Dyer, Rick and Whitton, Matt

Created a media frenzy wen they claimed to have found a dead bigfoot. They froze a bigfoot costume and some possum guts in a solid block of ice inside a freezer. They sold it to Tom Biscardi. Whitton was fired from his job as a police officer. Dyer now runs the Tracking Bigfoot website and group, and claims to have photographed and then shot a bigfoot on Sept. 6, 2012.

Wallace, Ray and Mullens, Rant

A couple of footprint stamper makers. Wallace's stamper collection was found to have possessed one of Mullens' stampers, identified after Wallace's death in 2002.

Newton-Perry, Linda and Bigfoot Ballyhoo Blog

For the newcomer, the Bigfoot Ballyhoo site contains a lot of fascinating encounter stories, but they are all just that; stories, as in works of fiction. The story about "Bill Emery" and "Team ESP" had holes from the beginning, including an investigation site at a closed lake, promises after promises after delays after delays, a Photoshopped photo, and a picture of "Bill Emery" lifted from a photographer's website. Another fanciful story included an injured or crippled bigfoot that was regularly seen raiding park trashcans and would be caught any day. It too panned out to be fiction.

Standing, Todd

The discoverer of the bigfoot paradise known as "Sylvanic". Lots of videos and lots of claims. In the end, he was an aspiring filmmaker trying to make a name for himself with hoaxes, al la Ivan Marx, but not as successful (yet). He disappeared for a little while, and reappeared on a Finding Bigfoot episode, in which he was considered poorly credible. His clear photos of "bigfoots" have been flattly dismissed by those who have seen the creatures.

The Questionable

Lee, Darren and Harrington, Randy and the MABRC.

Speaking for the MABRC, Darren Lee and Randy Harrington have made a lot of big claims, but none have panned out. In November of 2011, they claimed to have a possible mummified bigfoot foot that was supposedly washed out of a hillside. It looked more like a medicine bag made from a bear's foot. On October 16, 2012, Robert Lindsay reported that a bigfoot may have been captured by the MABRC, and to that Darren Lee stated, "we can neither confirm or deny the existence of a body." Since December 27, 2012, Ed Smith, a MABRC affiliate, along with Lee have been claiming that some group named "Team Quantra" has captured a bigfoot. For the last two weeks, nothing. Will "Team Quantra" have misled the MABRC about the bigfoot, or is it the MABRC that has misled all of us about "Team Quantra"? When they are not jerking us around by the leash, Darren Lee spends his time editting the SquatchAbyss blog, which seems to exist for no other reason than to defame those who have exposed the MABRC (i.e. Darren Lee and Randy Harrington) for its bad behavior. And is Ed Smith even real!? Inquiring minds want to know. I once PM'd Ed Smith, and Darren Lee responded!?

The Ugly

Patterson, Roger

Tried to get people to join his club. Members had mixed results, some receiving some membership materials, others receiving nothing. The film is debated, but mostly from highly polarized positions. There was a trackway associated with the film, and multiple people saw that first-hand.

Biscardi, Tom & Searching for Bigfoot Team

Never admitted to starting a hoax, but sure did get involved in some, including the costume in a freezer hoax perpetrated by Whitton and Dyer. In 2005 he got involved in a webcast pay-per-view event, based on a contributor's (false) claims to have trapped a bigfoot. According to Biscardi, everyone was payed back.

Things and people that don't belong (until better justified)

Carter, Janice and Green, Mary

Such an incredible story about her father and "Fox", but there are a lot of things which suggest some pretty tall tales. Nothing is proven though, one way or the other, and opinions vary.

Dfoot and Robo

????

Fasano, Tim

I have seen several of his videos, and while many are squatsquatchs and blobsquatches, none scream out hoax. He also seems to be rather vocal about calling out hoaxers.

Freeman, Paul

While it may raise questions that bigfoot activity was noticed as soon as Freeman started his employment, and was only ever found by Freeman; it is rather common that only those tuned to seek or notice the unusual actually notice it. Freeman cannot be dismissed just because he was the only one finding, and the only one looking. Certainly, there is nothing conclusive, and the Freeman videos would have required the assistance of at least three other accomplices. Who and where are they? Freeman probably would have associated with them.

Green, John

An April Fools joke is an April Fools joke. Green never attempted to claim that it was anything more than it was.

Morgan, Robert

Seems like another stretch to be put on the list.

Snow Walker

This is a film listed in the IMDB. How is it a hoax?

Edited January 10, 2013 by See-Te-Cah NC
To remove unapproved link

[Guest OntarioSquatch]

"Tried to get people to join his club. Members had mixed results, some receiving some membership materials, others receiving nothing."

How is this a hoax.

[roguefooter]

Ontario Squatch- it's because the PGF is the most high profile Sasquatch encounter and has been tackled by a many skeptic to no avail. Patterson is probably the most hated man in the field and any bit of dirt is going to be greatly exaggerated.

[Guest]

Hoax: something intended to deceive or defraud.

Now if we actually went by the definition of the word, perhaps half of that list would be culled.

For example, making a faux footprint for the purpose of demonstrating casting techniques is not any kind of deceit at all. Neither is writing an April fools story.

Call out all frauds, but make sure there is actually fraud before calling someone a fraud.

I posted a pic of a family of blobsquatch. Does that make me a hoaxer?

Was Robo the guy who faked the sasquatch scream on BFF 1.0? I remember that poo storm.

Edited January 8, 2013 by PsyShroom

[Guest]

SY is correct. Freeman made one set of wooden feet to study how the tracks would look on comparison to his actual trackway findings. He was trying to debunk and challenge his own evidence as far as he could. He was a true pioneer of EFFECTIVE research well ahead of the others that all had issues with others work. The media makes their spin taking comments out of context to make him look a fool and the rest is history. He had figured out the travel route of the local troup and they became comfortable with him as well.

[bipedalist]

^ If we had more posts like this on this forum I could really get to liking this place (truly)

[Guest ajciani]

"Tried to get people to join his club. Members had mixed results, some receiving some membership materials, others receiving nothing."

How is this a hoax.

Not Hoax. Just Ugly.

It was mail fraud. I doubt he did it intentionally, but he did do it.

I am personally on the fence concerning crimes committed out of incompetence. Like if a corporate executive accidentally uses his corporate card to buy chips at a casino. Even if he realizes his mistake and promptly reimburses the company, if the Feds come in and do an audit, there is the potential for an arrest. Now, most Federal attorneys would see the one-off use and reimbursement and figure everything was settled, but if they charged the exec for embezzlement, chances are a jury would find him guilty. Would he deserve the guilty verdict? As an executive with a corporate card, he had the responsibility to make sure charges to the card were proper and authorized, but he failed. Patterson was running a club with membership dues. If he was unable to keep the records straight and fulfill the memberships, he should not have been doing it. And where did the unfulfilled dues go? At some point, Patterson did stop the club.

[Guest ajciani]

Freeman made one set of wooden feet to study how the tracks would look on comparison to his actual trackway findings. He was trying to debunk and challenge his own evidence as far as he could. He was a true pioneer of EFFECTIVE research well ahead of the others that all had issues with others work.

Exactly what I was getting at. Because Freeman was the only one who found the bigfoot evidence could mean that he was a hoaxer, but could also mean that he was the only one looking effectively.

I would also fault no researcher for having or making their own stampers. I have even suggested experiments for testing how footprints could be faked or mistaken. With bigfoots, I think the focus should be more on how footprints can be NOT made. I have found many short trackways, and none but a couple even photographed well. I have only ever found a partial print that could have been cast, and that one was only from the ball to the heel, with the toes barely visible.

PS: A bit of an aside, but still related to the Freeman comment. I was out on a lunchtime walk around the business park with a coworker, and I saw a deer through some of the tall grass. I said, "oh, a deer!". He said, "where?" I had to point it out to him. It was only 10 yards away and moving. Then I realized there were two deer, and then three. All of them about 10 yards and moving. I saw them, he didn't. Would that make me a deer hoaxer?

[Guest JohnnyWalker]

FYI: The Ed Smith story is heating up. The "bridging team" (between Quantra and the BF Researchers/Public) has been assembled:

MABRC Admin

Post subject: Re: Quantra may have captured a Bigfoot specimen. Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 12:23 pm

Courtesy of D.W. Darkwing Lee wrote:

I have finished talking to the final member of the Bridging Team today, and he has agreed to participate.

Here are the Bridging Team members on the independent team.

Dr. Jeff Meldrum

Kathy Strain

Melissa Hovey

Abe Del Rio

Steve Kulls

The MABRC part of the Bridging Team is as follows:

D.W. Lee "Darkwing"

Randy Harrington "Driveroperator"

Jim Whitehead "Biggjimm"

Rob Gaudet "ElectricBigfoot"

Doug Todd "Holotype"

Even though many will not respect the privacy of the Bridging Team members until after the meeting occurs, I'm asking for everyone to be courteous and respectful enough to not bother these folks. They will report what happens, good or bad, and they only know what everyone else knows at the moment.

http://www.mid-ameri...535c35&start=10

The backgrounds on these team members is described in the next comment (in that source link from mid-americabigfoot.com)

Why would Meldrum get involved? He must think there's something to it. Or he doesn't want to miss out on the discovery of the century, just case there is.

The 2 page thread there has an air of unfolding credibility to me. Here's to hoping Daisy is real, and healthy.

and there is a major PR in 30-90 days, as the Quantra protocol called for, in the case of such a live capture.

[roguefooter]

Not Hoax. Just Ugly.

It was mail fraud. I doubt he did it intentionally, but he did do it.

I am personally on the fence concerning crimes committed out of incompetence. Like if a corporate executive accidentally uses his corporate card to buy chips at a casino. Even if he realizes his mistake and promptly reimburses the company, if the Feds come in and do an audit, there is the potential for an arrest. Now, most Federal attorneys would see the one-off use and reimbursement and figure everything was settled, but if they charged the exec for embezzlement, chances are a jury would find him guilty. Would he deserve the guilty verdict? As an executive with a corporate card, he had the responsibility to make sure charges to the card were proper and authorized, but he failed. Patterson was running a club with membership dues. If he was unable to keep the records straight and fulfill the memberships, he should not have been doing it. And where did the unfulfilled dues go? At some point, Patterson did stop the club.

Fraud involves intent, and considering that we don't know anything about the story we can't claim it to be fraud. We don't know what got lost in the mail, we don't know how many orders were involved, or even how many members there were.

The only thing we have are the words of a rival researcher, made well after Patterson's death so even he didn't have a say. How do we know it even happened at all?

[Guest]

I don't know where you got your info but Patterson did mail out his membership newsletters- I have issue numbers 3 & 4. How is that possible if he "failed to mail back any memberships"?

Also, making casts for a documentary has no relation to hoaxing whatsoever. How else are you going to demonstrate how to cast a track for a documentary? Considering that the castings at Bluff Creek show no signs of being dug out by hand, this reason for calling him a hoaxer makes no sense.

There were no other footprints available? Human, horse, dog, tire? A "bigfoot" footprint would not be necessary for a demonstration.