Drew Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 A bear would break the neck by a blow from the fore paw. I would assume that one could tell the difference between the two different types of breaks and would be a good question for john. If you would read the papers I posted, you would see that the method they use is to grab the rear of the animal pull it down, and then deliver a fatal bit to the back of the neck. Can you post the link to the interview? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lake County Bigfooot Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Thanks again Bipto for the info, I guess track finds are kind of rare even when the animals are present. I will be interested to hear the happenings once research gets back into full swing....maybe this will be your guys year...and we can put some matters to rest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the parkie Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Bipto After you had the security camera system installed and running, was there any noticeable change in their behaviour towards NAWAC and the cabin, for example seeming 'annoyed' at having some of their territory taken when the system was running and they refused to come near ie irate vocalizations, more projectiles, even an oppressive atmosphere etc? Not sure if this been asked before, apologies if so. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) I have no doubt that bears are near area X. I have no doubt that coyotes are near area X. Bipto, have you seen any evidence of cougars or other predators? Escaped animals, that type of thing? Edited January 29, 2014 by Drew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norseman Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 If you would read the papers I posted, you would see that the method they use is to grab the rear of the animal pull it down, and then deliver a fatal bit to the back of the neck. Can you post the link to the interview? Drew, I live in cougar country, I have spent money to patch up a foal from a cougar attack. When the animal is too big the cougar will attempt to choke them out....ie adult elk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the parkie Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Bipto has clarified that no such kills have been observed at X, so the discussion around Mionczynski's opinion is now no longer relevant to this thread and needs to be discussed elsewhere as per Salubrious' moderator statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 New thread http://bigfootforums.com/index.php/topic/45416-john-mioczynski-interview-elk-predation/ This will unclog this thread. http://bigfootforums.com/index.php/topic/45416-john-mioczynski-interview-elk-predation/ I added a new thread, this should unclog this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) Bipto over the past decade or so has the activity been on the rise or decline? I realize how hard that may be to put a finger on. Our approach has changed a lot in the past three years. Just being on-site has led to us observing a lot more behavior than our previous week-or-less trips in designed to make as little impact as possible. Therefore, over the past decade, we just can't say. We do think that the level of some kinds of activities (like rock throwing) has definitely increased in the past few years. Did NAWAC keep a database of every animal that was captured in each camera every day? No. Did some perform better than others at capturing animals (bears or others) and why? Yes. Some would get nothing but trees, some would get several shots of animals. It all depends on camera placement (is it on a game trail?) and animal activity (some bears would hang out and scratch themselves on trees). Did the bear density calculated from the camera-trap rate match the expected bear density in the Ouachita NF? We didn't track that. We weren't looking for bears and didn't spend any time studying them. I will like to see a camera-trap density map (abstract map with no real coordinates) to see how many cameras were placed every year and how far apart each were set and how this changed every year, and how performance changed with different configuration. I don't believe we retained the kind of data one would need to make that kind of analysis. Not sure if someone in NAWAC is going to publish a technical report on this extensive camera-trap survey, but I think the BF research community will learn a lot from it. I don't think we'll do that. Our hands are full as it is. We don't have to capture a BF on a camera trap to have a successful learning experience on field methods. Agreed Apparently some of the cabins have been subjected to 'debris rain'. Were you ever able to get any indication what the site (if any) was that they (or it) was throwing from? IOW, how far away they were when engaged in that activity? Our original assumption was they were right up close to the cabin, but our observations since suggest they may have been farther away and lobbing the debris (assumed to be small rocks and pebbles). If you go back to listen to the sound file we've posted of this phenomenon, you can hear the debris start farther away and get closer to the structure over the span of about 15-20 seconds until they hit it. It's almost as if they were "ranging" the cabin from their hidden position. Still, this is conjecture as we've not directly observed them doing it. Did anyone in the group notice if any of the found rocks looked as though they were newly dug or "lifted out from the ground"? There are *ample* loose rocks on the ground in X. I don't recall anyone saying they've found rocks with dirt still clinging to them. Bipto has clarified that no such kills have been observed at X, so the discussion around Mionczynski's opinion is now no longer relevant to this thread and needs to be discussed elsewhere as per Salubrious' moderator statement. Agreed. After you had the security camera system installed and running, was there any noticeable change in their behaviour towards NAWAC and the cabin, for example seeming 'annoyed' at having some of their territory taken when the system was running and they refused to come near ie irate vocalizations, more projectiles, even an oppressive atmosphere etc? No, nothing like that. The only change in behavior we observed was that they stayed the heck away when the cameras were lit up. Edited January 29, 2014 by bipto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southernyahoo Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Our original assumption was they were right up close to the cabin, but our observations since suggest they may have been farther away and lobbing the debris (assumed to be small rocks and pebbles). If you go back to listen to the sound file we've posted of this phenomenon, you can hear the debris start farther away and get closer to the structure over the span of about 15-20 seconds until they hit it. It's almost as if they were "ranging" the cabin from their hidden position. Still, this is conjecture as we've not directly observed them doing it. In listening to the debris rain audio I don't recall it falling in waves like what you might hear when a whole handfull of small debris was tossed at once. It would be very difficult to mask that without the use of a higher number of subjects tossing lower quantities of debris and more consistently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salubrious Posted January 29, 2014 Moderator Share Posted January 29, 2014 ^^ yes- I remember listening to that recording. I had the impression then and now that it took several of them to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the parkie Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) So, if I understand correctly, their position could possibly be located by extrapolating further along the line one would get by joining the cabin with where the initial missing debris was landing? Edited January 30, 2014 by the parkie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest zenmonkey Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 Bipto do you guys just use tents and the cabins? I thought I read somewhere about somebody having a camper down there maybe I'm wrong. Also do you guys use a generator or do you go old school? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the parkie Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 (edited) I have a vision of a jacuzzi being powered by Bipto pedalling furiously on a static bicycle next to it whilst in his speedos... I need to get out more. Edited January 31, 2014 by the parkie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the parkie Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 Bipto Are there any old abandoned drift, coal mine adits in the area? If so, have they been checked for signs of usage? According to another thread there are some in Le Flore county. Any natural caves in the area either that have been found? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 I have a vision of a jacuzzi being powered by Bipto pedalling furiously on a static bicycle next to it whilst in his speedos...You've got it all wrong, man. Bipto's one of the big boss men. It's newbies on the bicycles! There's more than one because we have to power the satellite TV too and with just one bike, newbie would get tired and then you'd lose the bubbles and heat halfway through the game. No bueno, man. No bueno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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